TL.net: Congratulations on qualifying for KeSPA Cup! How tough was the qualifier grind, going through the lower bracket?
Neeb: The qualifiers were surprisingly difficult for me. I expected it to be a lot easier since I was playing in good conditions, the ping was like 120 and I slept fine the night before. The only thing is that I was super tilted after losing to Scarlett in the winners semis so I didn’t care about my losers’ bracket games. It might have helped though since I wasn’t nervous when playing.
Did you play from Korea or were you back home in America?
I was in Korea for these matches, I got back from WCS Mexico a few days before the qualifiers.
How much do you think that training in Korea this year has helped your play?
I think I’d honestly improve at a similar rate if I had stayed home since I don’t have the connections to get a wide variety of practice partners. I think the ladder here is similar if not a bit worse than EU ladder, but playing customs with Byun/Solar/a few other Koreans is definitely helpful.
How do you think the best foreigners match up against the best Koreans?
The skill gap between foreigners and Koreans is a lot smaller this year than previous years, so the best foreigners are probably as good as mid-tier Koreans and can take games off of anyone they have the chance to play.
Moving onto the competition itself then, who would you most like to play, and who do you want to avoid?
I obviously want to avoid ByuN because he’s really really good and I want to avoid playing Nerchio / MarineLord / TRUE because I play them all the time already so I feel like it’s a missed opportunity. I hope to play top Koreans (that aren’t ByuN) since I’ve never played any in a live tournament setting and I’m working on my mindset a lot so I could play better here. [E/N: Note: this interview was conducted yesterday prior to the group announcements]
Who do you think will win?
ByuN.
KeSPA Cup will be the first Global Event of 2016. Do you think that there should be more Globals next year?
Yeah, for sure. I think the majority of events should be global events with just a few region locked ones to keep foreigners motivated. The Korean scene is dying at an incredibly fast rate because either Blizzard doesn’t understand or doesn’t care that Koreans have no tournaments to play in. It’s hard to stay motivated when you can’t show anything that you are practicing for another six months. Foreigners have it easy this year since there’s stuff to play in like every week. I’ve heard uThermal and ShoWTimE both talk about taking a few weeks off but there are always qualifiers or tournaments or something so they just can’t. The number of tournaments isn’t an issue it’s just that foreigners get to play everything while Koreans can only play certain events.
ByuN’s just recently destroyed Dear and sOs on his path to the GSL title, and he’s thanked you for being one of his practice partners. Do you think you’d have done a better job against him?
Haha probably not, ByuN beat me very consistently in practice too.
You will be the only non-Korean NA representative at BlizzCon this year; do you ever feel like you’re representing your region when you compete?
No it’s not that significant to me but I like making Europeans mad because, you know, NA > EU, so I want to do better than all the Europeans going.
Well that's going to get the comments section fired up. You can support Neeb at onfireneeb
On September 22 2016 20:39 Shuffleblade wrote: Neeb thinks EU ladder is better than korean ladder? xD omg
Considering KR GM has a lot of Korean amateur players and quite a few foreigners (from weaker regions), and that many of the high profile KeSPA players barely touch ladder (the account with the highest MMR in Korean GM has played 20 games this season), especially when there are still tournaments being played...
On September 22 2016 20:40 Nerchio wrote: Another delusional foreigner, jesus christ when is it going to end
LOL
Na bro - see Neeb isn't going to get flamed like yourself and uThermal did.
It's not because you're a foreigner - it's because of the content you provided.
You two let your self-interest delude you into making ridiculous statements region locking is good because if you play worse players you'll get better faster!
Neeb though - was honest about what's happening with the region-lock globally - even though it could have negative impact on him financially if they change it - just like Harstem was... strange must be a protoss thing (hurts me to say because I'm T) - basically.. balls vs. no balls.
I don't know... Multiple foreigners state that the gap has closed a lot this year. Yet... how do they know? The gap always seemed closer in online tournaments compared to offline events - and we haven't had an offline event this year yet.
I'd still be surprised if any foreigner advanced from the group stage, tbh.
On September 22 2016 20:40 Nerchio wrote: Another delusional foreigner, jesus christ when is it going to end
LOL
Na bro - see Neeb isn't going to get flamed like yourself and uThermal did.
It's not because you're a foreigner - it's because of the content you provided.
You two let your self-interest delude you into making ridiculous statements region locking is good because if you play worse players you'll get better faster!
Neeb though - was honest about what's happening with the region-lock globally - even though it could have negative impact on him financially if they change it - just like Harstem was... strange must be a protoss thing (hurts me to say because I'm T) - basically.. balls vs. no balls.
Wow never thought people can get baited so easily as you. You just provided another 15 Rage points to Nerchio .
I hope Neeb, Nerchio and MarineLorD can crush some faces in this cup .
On September 22 2016 20:40 Nerchio wrote: Another delusional foreigner, jesus christ when is it going to end
LOL
Na bro - see Neeb isn't going to get flamed like yourself and uThermal did.
It's not because you're a foreigner - it's because of the content you provided.
You two let your self-interest delude you into making ridiculous statements region locking is good because if you play worse players you'll get better faster!
Neeb though - was honest about what's happening with the region-lock globally - even though it could have negative impact on him financially if they change it - just like Harstem was... strange must be a protoss thing (hurts me to say because I'm T) - basically.. balls vs. no balls.
Wow never thought people can get baited so easily as you. You just provided another 15 Rage points to Nerchio .
I can't wait to find out how Neeb fares against that many Kespa players at a LAN event. All these online victories and conquering the ladder have made him too arrogant to handle.
On September 22 2016 20:39 Shuffleblade wrote: Neeb thinks EU ladder is better than korean ladder? xD omg
Considering KR GM has a lot of Korean amateur players and quite a few foreigners (from weaker regions), and that many of the high profile KeSPA players barely touch ladder (the account with the highest MMR in Korean GM has played 20 games this season), especially when there are still tournaments being played...
Doesn't sound that unlikely honestly.
I don't know shit about how much the actual kespa pros play ladder. What I do know is that nothing of this is new, kespa players are likely not playing less ladder than before. Meaning all that you say is true now was also true in wol and hots. Back then going to korea to ladder was thought as the ultimate training (besides living in an actual teamhouse there).
So when did we go from "that everyone(almost) that went to korea to practise sc2 leveled up incredibly due to much stronger ladder" to "EU ladder better"... It also doesn't makes sense since people are still going to korea to play sc2, Scarlett, bly and neeb among others. Why go and pay for travels and accomendations if the practise environment is worse than EU.
I'm not saying its not true, just saying its weird and if its true it really says alot about how far the foreign scene has gotten (or how the korean has fallen).
On September 22 2016 20:39 Shuffleblade wrote: Neeb thinks EU ladder is better than korean ladder? xD omg
Considering KR GM has a lot of Korean amateur players and quite a few foreigners (from weaker regions), and that many of the high profile KeSPA players barely touch ladder (the account with the highest MMR in Korean GM has played 20 games this season), especially when there are still tournaments being played...
Doesn't sound that unlikely honestly.
I don't know shit about how much the actual kespa pros play ladder. What I do know is that nothing of this is new, kespa players are likely not playing less ladder than before. Meaning all that you say is true now was also true in wol and hots. Back then going to korea to ladder was thought as the ultimate training (besides living in an actual teamhouse there).
So when did we go from "that everyone(almost) that went to korea to practise sc2 leveled up incredibly due to much stronger ladder" to "EU ladder better"... It also doesn't makes sense since people are still going to korea to play sc2, Scarlett, bly and neeb among others. Why go and pay for travels and accomendations if the practise environment is worse than EU.
I'm not saying its not true, just saying its weird and if its true it really says alot about how far the foreign scene has gotten (or how the korean has fallen).
He did say that it's not ladder that helps you improve there but the possibility of custom practice with the pros.
On September 22 2016 22:29 Colouss wrote: I want to see how he reacts to his groups . I really hope he pulls a Snute and gets out in first place but that's so unlikely to happen
On September 22 2016 20:40 Nerchio wrote: Another delusional foreigner, jesus christ when is it going to end
LOL
Na bro - see Neeb isn't going to get flamed like yourself and uThermal did.
It's not because you're a foreigner - it's because of the content you provided.
You two let your self-interest delude you into making ridiculous statements region locking is good because if you play worse players you'll get better faster!
Neeb though - was honest about what's happening with the region-lock globally - even though it could have negative impact on him financially if they change it - just like Harstem was... strange must be a protoss thing (hurts me to say because I'm T) - basically.. balls vs. no balls.
Wow never thought people can get baited so easily as you. You just provided another 15 Rage points to Nerchio .
I hope Neeb, Nerchio and MarineLorD can crush some faces in this cup .
Tho he is right. I respect how Neeb openly admits how the system is ridiculous and fucking koreans over really bad. All i got from uthermals Interview is some minor pity for the Kr scrubs since he knew If he disnt say smth like that people would complain a lot.
And besides that while i can laugh about pretty much anything, even i dont find the cocky welfare benificiaries comments about players who most likely are still a lot better than them funny at all. It just seems ignorant towards people who are suffering from the very same problem now that foreigners had themselves until a third party called Blizzard decided to save their asses lol
best foreigners are probably as good as mid-tier Koreans
That always was the case though, no? Are there more "best foreigners" now than before? Maybe.
Well we will see what happens at Kespa Cup and Blizzcon. It's easy to speak about it before and say the chances are good, but at the end of the day you also have to deliver when it matters (on the server) GL, you will need it
"The Korean scene is dying at an incredibly fast rate because either Blizzard doesn’t understand or doesn’t care that Koreans have no tournaments to play in."
The korean scene is less and less active every year, so foreigners will catch up. There is no influx of new players, almost every pro is over 20 years old. No clans like you know them from bw. No b teamers etc.
On September 23 2016 00:35 ionONE wrote: "The Korean scene is dying at an incredibly fast rate because either Blizzard doesn’t understand or doesn’t care that Koreans have no tournaments to play in."
Yeah gratz that he speaks about that. Blizzard either really needs to step it up here or people watching mainly korean sc2 (like i do) won't have a lot to watch next year i feel like :/
Do you know how many extra Kespa/Hot6ix cups and Proleague (nevermind that a large amount of games were cut), globals and so on there are going to be this year for Koreans?
On September 23 2016 01:07 stuchiu wrote: Listen Neeb you ingrate.
Do you know how many extra Kespa/Hot6ix cups and Proleague (nevermind that a large amount of games were cut), globals and so on there are going to be this year for Koreans?
It's probably too much starcraft really. :>
Shut up Apollo!
Thanks for the Neeb interview thecrazymunchkin!
Too bad that the KR server is no longer being used as heavily by top pros. It's all custom games I guess.
The Korean scene is dying at an incredibly fast rate because either Blizzard doesn’t understand or doesn’t care that Koreans have no tournaments to play in. It’s hard to stay motivated when you can’t show anything that you are practicing for another six months.
Glad to see him acknowledge this. He's shown more empathy than some of the other more outspoken and selfish foreigners. His trip to Korea seems to have matured more so than his peers. I like neeb a lot more. I'll be rooting for him in this kespa cup
Plenty of foreign pros have said that the 2016 system sucked for Koreans. It's not like Neeb has gone beyond that and given them prize money earned on the WCS circuit
On September 23 2016 01:32 Waxangel wrote: Plenty of foreign pros have said that the 2016 sucked for Koreans. It's not like Neeb has gone beyond that and given them prize money earned on the WCS circuit
And plenty of pros have said that it's good or think that they deserve it for having taken too much money before. And the fact that this is the case is very, very saddening.
On September 23 2016 00:35 ionONE wrote: "The Korean scene is dying at an incredibly fast rate because either Blizzard doesn’t understand or doesn’t care that Koreans have no tournaments to play in."
The korean scene is less and less active every year, so foreigners will catch up. There is no influx of new players, almost every pro is over 20 years old. No clans like you know them from bw. No b teamers etc.
Neeb is just a respectable guy. He's honest and forthright about things. I'm liking this guy more and more.
On September 23 2016 01:32 Waxangel wrote: Plenty of foreign pros have said that the 2016 system sucked for Koreans. It's not like Neeb has gone beyond that and given them prize money earned on the WCS circuit
Yh but they all act like it's a good thing because they can actually win cups now. Neeb is the only who admits it's killing the Korean scene
the gap became closer, because lotv playes out more randomly... more unpredictable. execution is a lesser factor now. and this is where koreans were untouchable.
On September 23 2016 01:32 Waxangel wrote: Plenty of foreign pros have said that the 2016 system sucked for Koreans. It's not like Neeb has gone beyond that and given them prize money earned on the WCS circuit
Yh but they all act like it's a good thing because they can actually win cups now. Neeb is the only who admits it's killing the Korean scene
Wax is just upset that his interviews induced flame and rage and this one is receiving mostly positive feedback.
To be fair to uthermal and nerch - this interviewer didn't bait Neeb as hard lolol - but to give Neeb credit - he was at least honest about what's going on. Tbh I don't have an issue with the foreign pro's who are having success as a result of the region lock to say that they like it.. they are entitle to that - I just wish they'd be honest and admit that nerfing competition doesn't promote the evolution of the game or pretend that their is any benefit to it at all other than financial - the point about losing all the time being de-motivating is valid - but that's a problem that you as an individual can solve - so a better headline for that interview with uthermal would have been not "if you lose to koreans you can't get better" but rather "losing to koreans makes me sad and not want to play" - probably woulda been no flame or rage with a minor change like that lolol.
While it is true that the korean scene gets weaker and weaker, it's hard to fault blizzard for that. I mean yes it would be nice for all the players who started playing sc2 (a huge chunk came from bw anyway) if the korean scene would have more tournaments and stuff, but if there isn't enough korean sponsoring interest, etc it's really hard to make that happen. New players play lol and now Overwatch, where exactly should that new talent pool come from? Even if there were 3 GSL and 3 SSL seasons + proleague, that wouldn't change much either. Sc2 isn't the game young gamers wanna be pro in these days, that's the reality.
I mean i don't follow the amateur scene (if there is one) in korea so maybe there would be a few up and coming players still, but the majority of people isn't interested in playing sc2 and more (artifically created -> blizzard sponsored) korean tournaments wouldn't change that i think.
With that being said, i am hyped for kespa cup and hope that foreigners will show good games
On September 23 2016 01:32 Waxangel wrote: Plenty of foreign pros have said that the 2016 system sucked for Koreans. It's not like Neeb has gone beyond that and given them prize money earned on the WCS circuit
Yh but they all act like it's a good thing because they can actually win cups now. Neeb is the only who admits it's killing the Korean scene
Literally nobody acts like that it's more what people like you read into it
I can assure you that almost every foreign pro thinks it's bad for the koreans and there should be more global events to balance it out. The current system is undeniable very good for us. We can prove ourselves in tournaments vs players that have the same practice coniditions, we get more exposure and make more money. That doesn't mean we justify it or think it's fair. We just play in the system that is given to us. In the end it's blizzard's call and not ours.
Well said Neeb, well said... Seems like Neeb sees something more than his ego and shows the great love towards the game. Most objective interview given by a foreigner i have heard. Neeb, you have just earned a new fan.
In my opinion, the gap beetwen koreans and non-koreans is smaller this time, because LotV is still quite a young game, and the meta is changing really fast. It gives opportunities for the rest to develop simply stronger style of playing, and despite having lower apm, worse mechanics, worse micro etc, ( I dont say that all of the foreigners has worse "game controlling" skills than all koreans. However I think in general we have to agree to that ) they can put up good fights. Same story was at the beginning of hots. In the first year a lot of foreigners reached even semi-finals of DH, HSC, IEMs etc, But the later, the more problems they had.
I agree it is a good move to help non-korean scene a little bit to make it entertaining. However i kinda feel like Koreans are left to their own, and nobody is interested in them. Blizz should take much more care about them because - agree or not - Korea is the hearth of this game. Killing koreans means killing the game... They have literally 4 tournaments where all the best players play, and some 2-nd tier koreans have nothing to say - like it was with foreigners ans koreans before region lock. No tournaments where some worse players can show up some good performance and build up themselves. Its like either you are the best or nobody cares of you. Korean scene is all about 15 players, and thats it What is more, the most entertaining player was banned for match-fixing. damn!
On September 23 2016 01:32 Waxangel wrote: Plenty of foreign pros have said that the 2016 system sucked for Koreans. It's not like Neeb has gone beyond that and given them prize money earned on the WCS circuit
Yh but they all act like it's a good thing because they can actually win cups now. Neeb is the only who admits it's killing the Korean scene
Literally nobody acts like that it's more what people like you read into it
I can assure you that almost every foreign pro thinks it's bad for the koreans and there should be more global events to balance it out. The current system is undeniable very good for us. We can prove ourselves in tournaments vs players that have the same practice coniditions, we get more exposure and make more money. That doesn't mean we justify it or think it's fair. We just play in the system that is given to us. In the end it's blizzard's call and not ours.
Litterally Neeb is the only one on here admitting that it's killing the Korean scene. Other foreigners have said that it's bad for Koreans but they still saying it's a good system overall.
On September 23 2016 01:32 Waxangel wrote: Plenty of foreign pros have said that the 2016 system sucked for Koreans. It's not like Neeb has gone beyond that and given them prize money earned on the WCS circuit
Yh but they all act like it's a good thing because they can actually win cups now. Neeb is the only who admits it's killing the Korean scene
Literally nobody acts like that it's more what people like you read into it
I can assure you that almost every foreign pro thinks it's bad for the koreans and there should be more global events to balance it out. The current system is undeniable very good for us. We can prove ourselves in tournaments vs players that have the same practice coniditions, we get more exposure and make more money. That doesn't mean we justify it or think it's fair. We just play in the system that is given to us. In the end it's blizzard's call and not ours.
Litterally Neeb is the only one on here admitting that it's killing the Korean scene. Other foreigners have said that it's bad for Koreans but they still saying it's a good system overall.
No they never said they think it's good overall (Apollo and some casters did though I think), they just said that WCS is good for them. This does not mean that they don't think there should be more events for Koreans.
Nerchio also said he wants more global events and only the 3 Championships should be region locked for example.
In an ideal world we would have the WCS tournaments we had last year but region locked (and maybe more than three) and all the dreamhacks, etc would be "global events" or rather would be what they always were: free to enter for anybody. Whatever the reason is (most likely tournament organizers) that we have the current system, it's what it is.
What are the reasons we only have 2 GSL/SSL tournaments though, that's the interesting part.
On September 23 2016 02:25 The_Red_Viper wrote: While it is true that the korean scene gets weaker and weaker, it's hard to fault blizzard for that. I mean yes it would be nice for all the players who started playing sc2 (a huge chunk came from bw anyway) if the korean scene would have more tournaments and stuff, but if there isn't enough korean sponsoring interest, etc it's really hard to make that happen. New players play lol and now Overwatch, where exactly should that new talent pool come from? Even if there were 3 GSL and 3 SSL seasons + proleague, that wouldn't change much either. Sc2 isn't the game young gamers wanna be pro in these days, that's the reality.
I mean i don't follow the amateur scene (if there is one) in korea so maybe there would be a few up and coming players still, but the majority of people isn't interested in playing sc2 and more (artifically created -> blizzard sponsored) korean tournaments wouldn't change that i think.
With that being said, i am hyped for kespa cup and hope that foreigners will show good games
Yes it would. More availability for tournaments means more money. The youth in Korea are choosing not to pursue SC2 because of the lack of tournaments, lack of money, lack of sponsor interest, and lack of popularity. But if all of that was plentiful, then yes, we'd see a lot of new talent fostering, growing, and blooming.
I have more to say on the matter but doing it on my phone is tiresome so I'll wait till I get on a computer.
On September 23 2016 03:41 The_Red_Viper wrote: In an ideal world we would have the WCS tournaments we had last year but region locked (and maybe more than three) and all the dreamhacks, etc would be "global events" or rather would be what they always were: free to enter for anybody. Whatever the reason is (most likely tournament organizers) that we have the current system, it's what it is.
What are the reasons we only have 2 GSL/SSL tournaments though, that's the interesting part.
Reasons? George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Abraham Lincoln, Alexander Hamilton, Andrew Jackson, Ulysses S. Grant and Benjamin Franklin.
On September 23 2016 02:25 The_Red_Viper wrote: While it is true that the korean scene gets weaker and weaker, it's hard to fault blizzard for that. I mean yes it would be nice for all the players who started playing sc2 (a huge chunk came from bw anyway) if the korean scene would have more tournaments and stuff, but if there isn't enough korean sponsoring interest, etc it's really hard to make that happen. New players play lol and now Overwatch, where exactly should that new talent pool come from? Even if there were 3 GSL and 3 SSL seasons + proleague, that wouldn't change much either. Sc2 isn't the game young gamers wanna be pro in these days, that's the reality.
I mean i don't follow the amateur scene (if there is one) in korea so maybe there would be a few up and coming players still, but the majority of people isn't interested in playing sc2 and more (artifically created -> blizzard sponsored) korean tournaments wouldn't change that i think.
With that being said, i am hyped for kespa cup and hope that foreigners will show good games
Yes it would. More availability for tournaments means more money. The youth in Korea are choosing not to pursue SC2 because of the lack of tournaments, lack of money, lack of sponsor interest, and lack of popularity. But if all of that was plentiful, then yes, we'd see a lot of new talent fostering, growing, and blooming.
I have more to say on the matter but doing it on my phone is tiresome so I'll wait till I get on a computer.
Nah don't get me wrong, this here:
The youth in Korea are choosing not to pursue SC2 because of the lack of tournaments, lack of money, lack of sponsor interest, and lack of popularity. But if all of that was plentiful, then yes, we'd see a lot of new talent fostering, growing, and blooming.
is quite obvious. Yes if sc2 would be popular, there would be more tournaments because more sponsors which would mean more new players. I am saying that with the current popularity and sponsor interest blizzard sponsoring 3 instead of 2 starleagues each wouldn't really do much imo. It would help current players and scene, but i don't see that it would attract new players.
Overwatch and LoL are the titles which attract the young korean gamers who then might wanna go pro.
Neebs bit on the current Korean scene stood out to me in stark contrast to most all of the other foreigner's view these days!
I can respect Neeb for saying it how it is. The Korean scene will continue to struggle and get weaker if Blizzard does not improve on this years system going forward.
On September 23 2016 02:25 The_Red_Viper wrote: While it is true that the korean scene gets weaker and weaker, it's hard to fault blizzard for that. I mean yes it would be nice for all the players who started playing sc2 (a huge chunk came from bw anyway) if the korean scene would have more tournaments and stuff, but if there isn't enough korean sponsoring interest, etc it's really hard to make that happen. New players play lol and now Overwatch, where exactly should that new talent pool come from? Even if there were 3 GSL and 3 SSL seasons + proleague, that wouldn't change much either. Sc2 isn't the game young gamers wanna be pro in these days, that's the reality.
I mean i don't follow the amateur scene (if there is one) in korea so maybe there would be a few up and coming players still, but the majority of people isn't interested in playing sc2 and more (artifically created -> blizzard sponsored) korean tournaments wouldn't change that i think.
With that being said, i am hyped for kespa cup and hope that foreigners will show good games
Yes it would. More availability for tournaments means more money. The youth in Korea are choosing not to pursue SC2 because of the lack of tournaments, lack of money, lack of sponsor interest, and lack of popularity. But if all of that was plentiful, then yes, we'd see a lot of new talent fostering, growing, and blooming.
I have more to say on the matter but doing it on my phone is tiresome so I'll wait till I get on a computer.
The youth in Korea are choosing not to pursue SC2 because of the lack of tournaments, lack of money, lack of sponsor interest, and lack of popularity. But if all of that was plentiful, then yes, we'd see a lot of new talent fostering, growing, and blooming.
is quite obvious. Yes if sc2 would be popular, there would be more tournaments because more sponsors which would mean more new players. I am saying that with the current popularity and sponsor interest blizzard sponsoring 3 instead of 2 starleagues each wouldn't really do much imo. It would help current players and scene, but i don't see that it would attract new players.
Overwatch and LoL are the titles which attract the young korean gamers who then might wanna go pro.
One really simple thing that the Korean scene could do to change some of this without spending more money is to turn Proleague into a Bo7 format. In a Bo5, every team fields the same players because the cost of dropping a map is too high to try out someone new and riskier. The incredibly few new names hired by Prolelague teams are never fielded, and then dropped after a year or even a few rounds. Just by extending the format, Proleague teams will have to reach into depth and gives a bit of freshness to the scene.
The cost of another GSL or Starleague could be astronomical. The cost to play 1 or 2 more games when you already own/rent the studio and have all the staff already there? Pretty much nothing. Especially when there are days when Proleague matches end in 30 minutes with commercial breaks on the 3-0 sweep.
On September 23 2016 02:25 The_Red_Viper wrote: While it is true that the korean scene gets weaker and weaker, it's hard to fault blizzard for that. I mean yes it would be nice for all the players who started playing sc2 (a huge chunk came from bw anyway) if the korean scene would have more tournaments and stuff, but if there isn't enough korean sponsoring interest, etc it's really hard to make that happen. New players play lol and now Overwatch, where exactly should that new talent pool come from? Even if there were 3 GSL and 3 SSL seasons + proleague, that wouldn't change much either. Sc2 isn't the game young gamers wanna be pro in these days, that's the reality.
I mean i don't follow the amateur scene (if there is one) in korea so maybe there would be a few up and coming players still, but the majority of people isn't interested in playing sc2 and more (artifically created -> blizzard sponsored) korean tournaments wouldn't change that i think.
With that being said, i am hyped for kespa cup and hope that foreigners will show good games
Yes it would. More availability for tournaments means more money. The youth in Korea are choosing not to pursue SC2 because of the lack of tournaments, lack of money, lack of sponsor interest, and lack of popularity. But if all of that was plentiful, then yes, we'd see a lot of new talent fostering, growing, and blooming.
I have more to say on the matter but doing it on my phone is tiresome so I'll wait till I get on a computer.
Yeah, if all that was plentiful that would be true. Unfortunately, only two of these things are in the hands of blizzard and the other two aren't gonna change because of the first two. It doesn't work in that direction so it's out of Blizzard's hands. Korea has to care about SC2 in general again before investing into the Korean SC2 scene becomes really viable. If they're gonna invest it's better to do it for the grassroots scene so hopefully they can attract new top players into those events and the money and experience helps motivate them to go pro.
On September 23 2016 02:25 The_Red_Viper wrote: While it is true that the korean scene gets weaker and weaker, it's hard to fault blizzard for that. I mean yes it would be nice for all the players who started playing sc2 (a huge chunk came from bw anyway) if the korean scene would have more tournaments and stuff, but if there isn't enough korean sponsoring interest, etc it's really hard to make that happen. New players play lol and now Overwatch, where exactly should that new talent pool come from? Even if there were 3 GSL and 3 SSL seasons + proleague, that wouldn't change much either. Sc2 isn't the game young gamers wanna be pro in these days, that's the reality.
I mean i don't follow the amateur scene (if there is one) in korea so maybe there would be a few up and coming players still, but the majority of people isn't interested in playing sc2 and more (artifically created -> blizzard sponsored) korean tournaments wouldn't change that i think.
With that being said, i am hyped for kespa cup and hope that foreigners will show good games
Yes it would. More availability for tournaments means more money. The youth in Korea are choosing not to pursue SC2 because of the lack of tournaments, lack of money, lack of sponsor interest, and lack of popularity. But if all of that was plentiful, then yes, we'd see a lot of new talent fostering, growing, and blooming.
I have more to say on the matter but doing it on my phone is tiresome so I'll wait till I get on a computer.
Yeah, if all that was plentiful that would be true. Unfortunately, only two of these things are in the hands of blizzard and the other two aren't gonna change because of the first two. It doesn't work in that direction so it's out of Blizzard's hands. Korea has to care about SC2 in general again before investing into the Korean SC2 scene becomes really viable. If they're gonna invest it's better to do it for the grassroots scene so hopefully they can attract new top players into those events and the money and experience helps motivate them to go pro.
I think this really illustrates the problem with the two major regions. Korea had the infrastructure and the talent, but the sponsors and the audience was in the foreign scene.
The foreign scene needed the money and infrastructure to support the larger number of players in its region and to attract more people.
The Korean scene needs general interest and popularity since it already has the talent and infrastructure in place.
I would say that the reason fewer people are playing Starcraft 2 is not because of the fewer tournaments and money. There is a decent chunk of money and five tournaments all in a single region. Not to mention they're right next to a country with an absolutely massive scene with a lot of money to throw in it. They have the most tournaments of a single region and probably the highest amount of money in a single region (aside from China).
I think they're not as in to it because it is a harder game, and there are "easier" games to get good at like Dota, Overwatch, and Lol. So what we have is somewhat opposite to the foreign scene. We have a ton of really fantastic players, but there's no real middle ground. So to get into Code A, they basically have to fight a bunch of former Code A/Code S players.
For the foreigners, we have a lot of decent people, and this makes it easier to get into SC2 because there are more people at a lower level.
So what Koreans need is a junior league for all the low level players, because the funny part is that a large part of the foreign scene is better than the non-Code A players (who we largely do not know). Blizzard should sponsor a league for people of even lower levels than most foreigners.
Cause as I've said before, 2013-2015, the Korean winners were almost always higher/top level Koreans. Very rarely did you see purely Code A or lower Koreans making it over and stomping on foreigners.
The state of the Korean scene is just terrible. It should be the #1 priority. It's like as if Blizzard is weaning Koreans off SC2 purposefully.
I don't care if the entire scene is segregated (KR and the rest of the world) but you gotta actually gotta show up and accommodate the Koreans so they have enough prize money, tournaments, and opportunity. Half of this entire year is like dead time for most pros.
On September 22 2016 20:27 Neeb said: The Korean scene is dying at an incredibly fast rate because either Blizzard doesn’t understand or doesn’t care that Koreans have no tournaments to play in.
I am starting to love Neeb! A foreign player, who expressed our deepest concerns!
Is it the lack of interest in SC2 in Korea that keeps tournament organizers from holding SC2 events there, or something else? In the rest of the world we have DH, IEM, HSC, BT, etc. doing a great job organizing tournaments with or without Blizzard's support. And even those Blizzard sponsored events aren't fully covered by Blizzard, so it really needs an independent organizer willing to invest in the game. Essentially, we need more OlimoLeagues to keep the Korean scene healthy. It surely is a problem for Blizzard but not necessarily something they can solve by themselves cost-effectively.
On September 23 2016 01:32 Waxangel wrote: Plenty of foreign pros have said that the 2016 system sucked for Koreans. It's not like Neeb has gone beyond that and given them prize money earned on the WCS circuit
Yh but they all act like it's a good thing because they can actually win cups now. Neeb is the only who admits it's killing the Korean scene
Literally nobody acts like that it's more what people like you read into it
I can assure you that almost every foreign pro thinks it's bad for the koreans and there should be more global events to balance it out. The current system is undeniable very good for us. We can prove ourselves in tournaments vs players that have the same practice coniditions, we get more exposure and make more money. That doesn't mean we justify it or think it's fair. We just play in the system that is given to us. In the end it's blizzard's call and not ours.
Litterally Neeb is the only one on here admitting that it's killing the Korean scene. Other foreigners have said that it's bad for Koreans but they still saying it's a good system overall.
No they never said they think it's good overall (Apollo and some casters did though I think), they just said that WCS is good for them. This does not mean that they don't think there should be more events for Koreans.
Nerchio also said he wants more global events and only the 3 Championships should be region locked for example.
The last interview i remember was uthermal saying the system this year is good but not perfect or something kike that. Compared to the disaster is actually is
On September 23 2016 15:39 lestye wrote: The state of the Korean scene is just terrible. It should be the #1 priority. It's like as if Blizzard is weaning Koreans off SC2 purposefully.
I don't care if the entire scene is segregated (KR and the rest of the world) but you gotta actually gotta show up and accommodate the Koreans so they have enough prize money, tournaments, and opportunity. Half of this entire year is like dead time for most pros.
Starcraft 2 was never all that popular in Korea. It was always propped up by Blizzard. You can throw as much money at the Korean scene as you want, but it won't stop whatever declining popularity there is left for Starcraft 2.
personally, Korean SC2 will never fuel Global Sc2 success. Mostly because its a national league / championship and because of the language barrier. Yes, they have english casters, but until the scene opens up to english, Korea will remain a SC2 island.
EPT
