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CyanApple
48 Posts
with the liberator nerfed (as proposed), terran lacks late-game options. with nerfed warp prism (and maybe increased tempest supply), increasing stalker AA damage might be a good idea (from PvZ standpoint) i can't make out the consequences of 4 larvae per inject, but design-wise i think it would fit the zerg race very well | ||
JimmyJRaynor
Canada16699 Posts
please keep the proposed changes to Terran (thor, cyclone, liberator) and if Terran needs any kind of nerf please nerf an air unit. Any how, I'm happy with the game and having fun. Keep up the great work Blizzard/Mr. Kim. | ||
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Kafka777
361 Posts
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Tosster
Poland299 Posts
User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20285 Posts
On May 21 2016 03:51 TheWinks wrote: The larva revert is probably the dumbest suggestion entertained in any post-beta community feedback update. It is the very definition of a completely game breaking change. If you take 100 shields off immortal, nerf WP and nerf liberator AA and AG before making inject give 4 larvae, you would probably be inviting a list of further changes to compensate for that (maybe P and T buffs, things like less armor on Ultralisk..). We're just getting the second patch in 6 months, we don't need another quick fix right after that lands followed up by a fourth one to fix the fix if it goes horribly wrong Larvae (and economy) is even more important than damage, health and speed values on t1 units like marines and zerglings and will affect every zerg game | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16699 Posts
Next Week’s Patch/Map Updates Split feedback from community and KeSPA pros We’re seeing another complete split in feedback here. Please let us know if we’re wrong about what the major community feedback is regarding Terran, but what we’re seeing is that our community thinks Terran is the weakest race right now. From another angle, we received KeSPA feedback that said Terran is the strongest, Protoss is also too strong and need more nerfs than just the Immortal nerf, and that Zerg is the clear weakest and could use major buffs. I am a Random Diamond player and Terran is my favourite race. Terran is also my worst race even though i love it. Terran is my weakest race BECAUSE my APM is low. You do not need to change the game so that I am better with Terran. I fully accept that Terran can only be played with high APM and I will just struggle along. Just because Terran is weak for me and my old and slow friends doesn't mean the race is weak for everyone. So please just balance the game for the top level players and don't worry about slow guys like me. On May 21 2016 04:04 Kafka777 wrote: Kespa is probably right about their suggestions and obviously they are interested in keeping the game balanced and competitive. They want balance around highest level of game play. It would be silly to balance it around low tier players, that would cause a need to issue balance patches every two weeks. i agree. i have a 50/50 win percentage with all 3 races. Its just the league i do it in with Terran has a different logo. I don't care. i'm not 12 years old... i can get over losing a video game to a player who might "technically" be slightly worse than me and beatable with a different race. | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15955 Posts
On May 21 2016 03:35 Cyro wrote: Cyclone was both better and more popular than SH, been killed by more than a couple of all-ins with a few cyclones in them (while playing early stargate PvT) and threatened exactly 0 times by swarmhosts I think this is just worded a little confusingly. Terran is strong vs Zerg, but not vs Protoss @ highest level I on the other hand have played a couple zergs that abused swarmhost hit- and run tactics but have never seen a terran making more than one cyclone. This clearly shows that swarmhosts are both better and more popular than cyclones. | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20285 Posts
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Charoisaur
Germany15955 Posts
On May 21 2016 03:37 PinoKotsBeer wrote: True, its good to see more options for zerg. they were very limited. Wait until you play terran, then you know what it really means to have limited options. | ||
Teoita
Italy12246 Posts
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Cyro
United Kingdom20285 Posts
On May 21 2016 04:21 Teoita wrote: I really don't understand korea's feedback. Sample size is super small, but Zergs do fine in proleague, won SSL, and got murdered in GSL where they had some pretty unfavourable groups that led to only Losira in the ro8. Seems fine to me. GSL PvZ was also played overwhelmingly on a very small list of maps (the same ~3 maps) due to vetos in bo3 and bo5 games ----------- On May 21 2016 04:20 Charoisaur wrote: Wait until you play terran, then you know what it really means to have limited options. I think every race feels that they have few options at the moment | ||
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Musicus
Germany23576 Posts
But honestly, I always said the warp prism had to be nerfed and some point, even it's just a cost increase, because right now the investment is way too low for what you get out of it. I also think nerfing Liberator anti ground is more important that nerfing anti air, but you can't nerf both at once. Still I think the larva buff is over the top and we should see where the game is going with next week's changes first. | ||
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TheWinks
United States572 Posts
On May 21 2016 04:08 Cyro wrote: If you take 100 shields off immortal, nerf WP and nerf liberator AA and AG before making inject give 4 larvae, you would probably be inviting a list of further changes to compensate for that (maybe P and T buffs, things like less armor on Ultralisk..). I have no idea what you're trying to say. 4 larva is fundamentally game breaking. No amount of little tweaks like reducing ultra armor by 1 or something is going to make up for something like that. | ||
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Teoita
Italy12246 Posts
On May 21 2016 04:26 TheWinks wrote: I have no idea what you're trying to say. 4 larva is fundamentally game breaking. No amount of little tweaks like reducing ultra armor by 1 or something is going to make up for something like that. I agree. For comparison, the queen buff was rather minor at the time and we know what happened. I'm so incredibly confused. | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15955 Posts
On May 21 2016 04:21 Teoita wrote: I really don't understand korea's feedback. Sample size is super small, but Zergs do fine in proleague, won SSL, and got murdered in GSL where they had some pretty unfavourable groups that led to only Losira in the ro8. Seems fine to me. When koreans give feedback they probably don't only take the leagues into consideration. They play in their teamhouses vs eachother every day. I think their feedback is mainly based around their teamhouse practice as that probably gives you a good idea of balance when you play vs the same players over and over again. I'm just surprised there's still no mention of ultras and tempests but I guess koreans aren't really concerned with absurdly stupid design as long as they can reliably win their games. And yeah only korean feedback should be considered when balancing their game, for foreigners it's simply a learn to play issue. | ||
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CyanApple
48 Posts
On May 21 2016 04:26 TheWinks wrote: I have no idea what you're trying to say. 4 larva is fundamentally game breaking. No amount of little tweaks like reducing ultra armor by 1 or something is going to make up for something like that. Zerg was to me always explained as the race that needs the best economy, the highest supplycount and the possibility to remax quickly in order to win, because the units are worth less than the units of terran and protoss. thats a design ive liked, but recently i rarely see zerg with an eco or supply lead and yet they are still balanced, because in lotv they have strong units aswell (ravagers, lurkers, ultras especially). if the inject was returned to 4 larvae per cycle, it could imo very well be balanced by nerfing individual units, as it was done in the past. it would probably require quite a bit of work to balance it properly though, so i prefer it not to be changed, as zerg works quite well currently. | ||
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Squaal
11 Posts
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Cyro
United Kingdom20285 Posts
On May 21 2016 04:26 TheWinks wrote: I have no idea what you're trying to say. 4 larva is fundamentally game breaking. No amount of little tweaks like reducing ultra armor by 1 or something is going to make up for something like that. Doubling chrono boost and mule strength would probably do it, but i still think that it's a ridiculous change | ||
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
On the other hand, giving back 4 larva with no compensation ? Wtf ? Why not have zerglings one shot command centers ? | ||
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Dungeontay
126 Posts
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