EPTI will only watch SSL. Period
GOM switches free quality of GSL back to low - Page 20
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bObA
France300 Posts
I will only watch SSL. Period | ||
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Yorbon
Netherlands4272 Posts
On June 11 2015 01:59 swag_bro wrote: What do you guys do with your lives that you cant even afford a few dollars a month to support a game you love? GOM is not greedy, you guys are either cheap or gave up on SC2. I am not anymore part of the sc2 fanbase, but do ocassionally watch some gsl or wcs. For people like me, the likelihood of tuning in drops with every decision like this. Especially people who play more than one game are affected. I play some lol, and watch vods of lck. When deciding what to watch, the added value of watching such a vod or livestream is compared to the added value of watching a gsl live stream, which obviously goes down when stream quality goes down. So in the end, this is bad for gsl viewership (note, the casual viewers, not the hardcore viewers). But I don't feel entitled to it. Most casual viewers will not care, and just watch other games or tournaments. It feels as though gom is trying to get more cash at the cost of accessibility, which seems to me a very pessimistic mindset. And that mindset saddens me greatly. Your reasoning is fine for hardcore viewers: people who have invested heavily in sc2, and continue to do so. I am a cheap person, and I'd argue most casual viewers are. 'If you quit watching because of this, you're just cheap or you don't truly love sc2' does not change the reality of people's behaviour being influenced by these decisions. | ||
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ffadicted
United States3545 Posts
I have a feeling a majority of people watch with adblock on anyway, so if you watch it in medium, low, or not at all, won't change anything for Gom. You're just being a freeloader at that point that is complaining that the free stuff you're getting isn't good enough for you, while giving nothing back in return. It's no surprise SC2 is going through a tough time, so without the support of fans, there's nothing they can do to keep it alive. And this thread seems like a good example of how non-supportive people are these days. With that said, GOM seriously needs to step up their game in terms of what they are providing to the public. Their VOD services are pretty much non-existant, the stream can have its issues, the casters just don't seem to care enough about starcraft, and there just isn't enough meat there for me to actually get annoyed that people aren't subscribing... I can understand both sides of the coin here, so both Gom and the fans seriously need to re-evaluate what they're providing to the scene in order for us to take SC2 forward. | ||
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maartendq
Belgium3115 Posts
On June 10 2015 20:41 oOKamuOo wrote: Thanks to addblocker .... if this wouldn't exist we had a high quality stream... If intrusive ads for stuff I'm not remotely interested in had not existed, companies might have found a better way to stay profitable instead of being lazy and relying on ads. | ||
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Psychonian
United States2322 Posts
does someone have a restream or something? jesus fucking christ. | ||
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RaymondFish
United States42 Posts
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SC2Toastie
Netherlands5725 Posts
On June 11 2015 03:46 maartendq wrote: If intrusive ads for stuff I'm not remotely interested in had not existed, companies might have found a better way to stay profitable instead of being lazy and relying on ads. And how exactly is a company going to be profitable by providing you free content in pristine form without using ads? Stop feeling so entitled. | ||
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Psychonian
United States2322 Posts
On June 11 2015 03:50 RaymondFish wrote: so many silly people here pissed at a company wanting to make money. insane for people to think that a company should take a loss to provide high quality content. grow up. what's fucking insane is that this is 2015 and the best stream that anyone outside of Korea can get is in fucking 240p. 240 fucking p. Meanwhile the koreans get free fucking HD. GOM is just saying at this point, fuck you customers we want money. Pisses me the fuck off. I won't even be watching the GSL finals at this point, I'll wait for a VOD on youtube. Fuck GOM. Everyone else - WCS, Proleague, S2SL, Olimoleague, even the fucking Kappa Starleague hosted by nathanias is giving at the very least free 480p. For GSL to even consider streaming what was once considered the most prestigious tournament in all of Starcraft in 240p is a massive insult to all the foreign viewers. Blizzard, I know you read teamliquid. STOP SUPPORTING GOM if this is how they will treat their customers. this is unacceptable. | ||
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brickrd
United States4894 Posts
On June 11 2015 03:50 RaymondFish wrote: so many silly people here pissed at a company wanting to make money. insane for people to think that a company should take a loss to provide high quality content. grow up. if the content is so high quality then people should already be subscribing, no? i could gladly take a shit on your lawn and tell you it's "high quality" and you should pay me for it i think it's you who's using childish logic: you're saying people have no right to complain because "companies have a right to make money, blah blah blah." sure, we all know that profit organizations aim for profit. the issue is not "boo hoo, i don't want to pay for things!" it's "is it really worth paying x amount for y feature?" there are millions of things i can spend money on in the world and millions of ways to have fun. starcraft is not that essential to my life. if i think the deal for GSL sucks, i'm going to continue being a free viewer and spend my money elsewhere instead. it's not because i'm a 15-year-old with no job; it's because i don't care for the deal. being a for-profit company doesn't mean just charging people money for features and watching the cash roll in, it actually means competing with other companies for people who have plenty of other options and places to spend their money sure, some people react with childish or silly or exaggerated wording. yeah there are those few people who start talking about esports passion and boycotts and shit, and yeah that's all over the top. people are doing that on both sides of the argument but that's not representative of the core issue here. is the deal good or not? is the money worth it or not? is it good business or not? and it's not. it's a bad deal and people are calling them on it. | ||
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Mozdk
Denmark6989 Posts
On June 10 2015 15:42 NovemberstOrm wrote: Low Quality isn't going to be any better for business, in fact it'll be worse. Especially with the SSL. Yup pretty much :/ How can you possibly know that? Do you have access to the numbers? Are you a business and broadcast expert? GOM has based this decision on math with the data they. And done so to maximize their profit. How can you think you, as an outsider, have a better idea of what is best? You can dissagree with the decision, but it's from a viewer or moral perspective. Not a business one. | ||
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scott31337
United States2979 Posts
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brickrd
United States4894 Posts
On June 11 2015 04:06 Mozdk wrote: How can you possibly know that? Do you have access to the numbers? Are you a business and broadcast expert? GOM has based this decision on math with the data they. And done so to maximize their profit. How can you think you, as an outsider, have a better idea of what is best? You can dissagree with the decision, but it's from a viewer or moral perspective. Not a business one. by your logic no business would ever fail. you're just blindly assuming that they have the right read on their audience and are interpreting all their data intelligently because what? because they're a business? do you remember "new coke"? if coke can screw up with their audience i'm pretty sure GSL can lol | ||
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bluQ
Germany1724 Posts
Haven't watched GSL in like 6 month, i could care less. On June 11 2015 04:10 brickrd wrote: by your logic no business would ever fail. you're just blindly assuming that they have the right read on their audience and are interpreting all their data intelligently because what? because they're a business? do you remember "new coke"? if coke can screw up with their audience i'm pretty sure GSL can lol Well ... that reminds me ... did they ever did a good business decision concerning the foreign-scene? Maybe Korea vs rest of the World ? | ||
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SkrollK
France580 Posts
On June 11 2015 03:36 Yorbon wrote: I am not anymore part of the sc2 fanbase, but do ocassionally watch some gsl or wcs. For people like me, the likelihood of tuning in drops with every decision like this. Especially people who play more than one game are affected. I play some lol, and watch vods of lck. When deciding what to watch, the added value of watching such a vod or livestream is compared to the added value of watching a gsl live stream, which obviously goes down when stream quality goes down. So in the end, this is bad for gsl viewership (note, the casual viewers, not the hardcore viewers). But I don't feel entitled to it. Most casual viewers will not care, and just watch other games or tournaments. It feels as though gom is trying to get more cash at the cost of accessibility, which seems to me a very pessimistic mindset. And that mindset saddens me greatly. Your reasoning is fine for hardcore viewers: people who have invested heavily in sc2, and continue to do so. I am a cheap person, and I'd argue most casual viewers are. 'If you quit watching because of this, you're just cheap or you don't truly love sc2' does not change the reality of people's behaviour being influenced by these decisions. Omagad. That's actually totally THE point. I'm an occasionnal viewer, which means that I don't watch a lot of SC2 since I dont play it a lot. However, I do play BW, LoL. So i watch streams about that. And, guess what ? All free Source. I do run into SC for big events, SSL, GSL, PL, IEM, ... anytime I can. And, guess what, I also happen to watch some CS GO from time to time, apart from LoL and BW. GSL is the ONLY one to provide 240p for free. All other is at least 720p + VoD. So. Why the hell should I bother watching 240p GSL and paying for it, where litterally EVERY other thing is just 720p free ? Plus, to anyone saying that a company has to make money blablabla. Every other streams that are giving us 720p for free aren't just 2-months-into-vanishing-cause-they-got-out-of-money things, you know. That just the fucking first thing you learn about business. If you don't improve while your concurrents do,you just die. PS : even tho I can watch it for free on OGaming  And at decent hours. Which is nice ) | ||
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robopork
United States511 Posts
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BisuDagger
Bisutopia19305 Posts
On June 11 2015 03:54 SC2Toastie wrote: And how exactly is a company going to be profitable by providing you free content in pristine form without using ads? Stop feeling so entitled. Watching on my tablet I get hit with commercials at least once (usually twice) during a 10-20 min game. I am always hit with a commercial during winners interviews. If I had my computer I can use adblock I wouldn't be missing the content I'm interested in. This is the problem mystream and ustream had too and why twitch was awesome for a while. Spam commercials during breaks, but please not during content. | ||
ZeromuS
Canada13392 Posts
Is GOM the only one willing to take this stance, or are they operating so much less efficiently than the other companies that they need to do this? | ||
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bluQ
Germany1724 Posts
On June 11 2015 04:14 ZeromuS wrote: My main question related to this is how can so many other streams offer things for free without using the "low" quality bait as it were. Is GOM the only one willing to take this stance, or are they operating so much less efficiently than the other companies that they need to do this? Or did they not nurture their foreign audience to attract foreign sponsors to take care of some or most expenses for the stream? ... sorry but GOM sucks when it comes to foreign-scene and business models. edit: and in early 2011 they could have attracted a lot of western sponsors I guess. And not displaying viewer-numbers back then was also pretty awkward. On June 11 2015 04:12 robopork wrote: My knee jerk reaction is to tell them to go fuck themselves, but in an environment where 80% of viewers have ad block enabled while they watch it's hard not to feel like the community brings this on itself. The "business" model right now on twitch is not "i make dollars with ads" it is "i have viewers who subscribe/donate". Why don't they for GOM? Because they hide behind a paywall and fail to make attractive enough content. (or lower their price -_-) | ||
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brickrd
United States4894 Posts
On June 11 2015 04:12 robopork wrote: My knee jerk reaction is to tell them to go fuck themselves, but in an environment where 80% of viewers have ad block enabled while they watch it's hard not to feel like the community brings this on itself. if people don't want to subscribe or watch ads and the company can't make enough money to operate that doesn't make it "the community's fault," it just means the venture deserves to fail. GSL is either GSL or it's nothing whereas my money is still the same money even if i spend it elsewhere. the consumer's willingness or unwillingness to spend is judge jury and executioner and we don't really owe them anything tbh. that's how the entertainment industry works, if you don't satisfy people they're gone | ||
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BisuDagger
Bisutopia19305 Posts
On June 11 2015 04:14 ZeromuS wrote: My main question related to this is how can so many other streams offer things for free without using the "low" quality bait as it were. Is GOM the only one willing to take this stance, or are they operating so much less efficiently than the other companies that they need to do this? OGN's Proleague is a common comparison in this thread. The problem is Proleague is on TV and can make enough of Korean Television that international money won't make or break them. GSL must not be making enough from the Korean audience and the obvious thing to me is the lack of television and television level sponsors. GSL must also be having trouble building relationship seeing as SBENU only has a hand in PL and not the GSL. Of course the GSL vs OGN loyalty among koreans/korean employees/korean sponsors is always there too. | ||
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