• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 03:14
CEST 09:14
KST 16:14
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash9[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy16ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT30Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book20
Community News
Weekly Cups (March 23-29): herO takes triple6Aligulac acquired by REPLAYMAN.com/Stego Research8Weekly Cups (March 16-22): herO doubles, Cure surprises3Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool49Weekly Cups (March 9-15): herO, Clem, ByuN win4
StarCraft 2
General
What mix of new & old maps do you want in the next ladder pool? (SC2) Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy Aligulac acquired by REPLAYMAN.com/Stego Research Weekly Cups (March 23-29): herO takes triple herO wins SC2 All-Star Invitational
Tourneys
RSL Season 4 announced for March-April Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament StarCraft Evolution League (SC Evo Biweekly) WardiTV Mondays World University TeamLeague (500$+) | Signups Open
Strategy
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Frigid Storage Publishing has been re-enabled! [Feb 24th 2026]
External Content
Mutation # 519 Inner Power The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 518 Radiation Zone Mutation # 517 Distant Threat
Brood War
General
[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash ASL21 General Discussion Gypsy to Korea How Can I Add Timer & APM Count? A cwal.gg Extension - Easily keep track of anyone
Tourneys
[ASL21] Ro24 Group F [ASL21] Ro24 Group E Azhi's Colosseum - Foreign KCM Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Starcraft Tabletop Miniature Game General RTS Discussion Thread Darkest Dungeon
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Canadian Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion! [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT] Tokyo Olympics 2021 Thread General nutrition recommendations
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
[G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Money Laundering In Video Ga…
TrAiDoS
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
FS++
Kraekkling
Shocked by a laser…
Spydermine0240
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 11478 users

Star "HangShow" S4E4 - Balance talk with Flash - Page 3

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 Next All
[N3O]r3d33m3r
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Germany673 Posts
July 10 2014 18:44 GMT
#41
Holy Wow, Themarine really knows his stuff, I agree with everything he says!
LingBlingBling
Profile Joined December 2012
United States353 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-10 18:56:59
July 10 2014 18:55 GMT
#42
On July 11 2014 02:07 pmp10 wrote:
Honestly they gave even less useful advice than foreigner pros.
'Remake the game to be more like BW' is not a option at this point.



did you even watch and read? they gave perfect insight on the issues with sc2 that they been saying for a long time now, they have far more knowledge of this game then the random NA and EU pros by a large margin, and are far more experience and qualified to know what makes a good RTS Esport game. So much nicer hearing from people in the most established Esport place in the world vs biased NA pros or EU pros. Korea knows what they are talking about.

But of course NA typically wants a easy game.
Remember our motto: We ain't got it.
TheBloodyDwarf
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
Finland7524 Posts
July 10 2014 18:55 GMT
#43
On July 10 2014 10:03 shadymmj wrote:
wow, that's a stacked interview list...but will dkim listen?

Depend who they want to listen. Majority? Meaning we need patch soon. Minority? Flash and others in this interview that don't want patch?
+ Show Spoiler +
Personaly I couldn't care less I play so little that it doesn't matter (School)
Fusilero: "I still can't believe he did that, like dude what the fuck there's fandom and then there's what he did like holy shit. I still see it when I close my eyes." <- reaction to the original drunk santa post which later caught on
ReMinD_
Profile Joined May 2013
Croatia846 Posts
July 10 2014 19:03 GMT
#44
I can't even take SC2 seriously anymore. How come in Dota we have same teams at the top for years, meanwhile every SC2 tournament yields a new 'champion'.
Parting: Well, even I can make better maps than these.
Goofinator
Profile Joined September 2013
England45 Posts
July 10 2014 19:06 GMT
#45
I don't like the idea of making the interface like Brood War. Macro is obviously a skill, but it isn't a skill that is particularly exciting to watch. They need to make it so that players can use their superior speed/mechanics in more interesting ways by making units more microable, having more abilities on units that promote micro on both sides, discouraging deathballs and encouraging multi-pronged harassment.

One other thing that I would like to add is something that kinda annoys me is people say that Protoss have "too many options". In my opinion variety is GOOD in rts games - what needs to be done is to give Terran and Zerg MORE options so they can pull off as many crazy builds as Protoss can. Look at Pigbaby vs Bomber - Pigbaby pulled off a load of different builds , making the finals quite exciting, but would it be awesome if Bomber could do the same thing.

Personally, I think the best way to increase variety is to create more upgrades that give units more abilities that rely on micro but are not essential for units to function. At the moment most upgrades are not really a choice, but something that is essential for units to function. If you gave units more upgrades that didn't help "1a" syndrome but were useful with micro then players could rush to these upgrades to make use of their micro.
Hider
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Denmark9433 Posts
July 10 2014 19:07 GMT
#46
On July 11 2014 04:03 ReMinD_ wrote:
I can't even take SC2 seriously anymore. How come in Dota we have same teams at the top for years, meanwhile every SC2 tournament yields a new 'champion'.


If you cannot answer that question your self, then I would avice you to comment in a more humble way.
viperattack999
Profile Joined July 2014
Canada32 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-10 19:53:41
July 10 2014 19:48 GMT
#47
The pros stated what most of the community has been saying for years. The style of the game needs an update as much as the balance.

Most units have very specific roles that hard counter one set of units but are terrible vs another set. This limits play diversity and choice. There plenty of good units in the game but too many are niche and have limited roles.

By adapting a BW/Starbow approach to damage, more units are available in more situations and the skill gap goes way up. Blizzard seems to involved in developing play styles EG: Terran has a good mid game but weaker late game....

this kind of thinking limits Terrans options for no good reason. Just forces a limiting play style.

EDIT: BW was much harder to play but even as a scrub I enjoyed it much more.
y0su
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
Finland7871 Posts
July 10 2014 20:04 GMT
#48
wow awesome work!
good read and good points brought up
intotheheart
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Canada33091 Posts
July 10 2014 20:19 GMT
#49
Interesting how Flash kept saying "stop crying and get good" the entire time through.
kiss kiss fall in love
Sapphire.lux
Profile Joined July 2010
Romania2620 Posts
July 10 2014 20:21 GMT
#50
I share the sentiment entirely.
Head Coach Park: "They should buff tanks!"
Terranist
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States2496 Posts
July 10 2014 20:24 GMT
#51
i think flash is too concerned about his legacy to ever speak candidly about balance. truthfully speaking, waiting for terrans to "figure it out" is not an option because SC2 does not have the longevity of bw and if this precedent continues there will be no more pro scene before long.
The Show of a Lifetime
StarscreamG1
Profile Joined February 2011
Portugal1653 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-10 21:20:43
July 10 2014 21:20 GMT
#52
If at matchmaking we could choose between Hots or Starbow...the problem would be solved ^_^
Vasoline73
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States7847 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-10 23:29:04
July 10 2014 23:26 GMT
#53
Can Blizz please listen to these people? -___-. Of course some will whine (saying this is worse than AM/EU player feedback) but at least the game will be fun to watch...

Edit: TY for translation!
VArsovskiSC
Profile Joined July 2010
Macedonia563 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-10 23:30:32
July 10 2014 23:28 GMT
#54
I don't like Starbow much.. It relies on Broodwar.. HotS could be a lot better if all of it's new units had a clear idea/design in the purpose/concept behind (some do, but others don't hence why we don't love it as much as we could)..

However - the real reason I wanted to write on this thread is - I was SO hoping the VOD would have English CC translations of this
Another world, another place, another universe, won the race.. :) ;) :P
ZAiNs
Profile Joined July 2010
United Kingdom6525 Posts
July 10 2014 23:35 GMT
#55
On July 11 2014 08:28 VArsovskiSC wrote:
I don't like Starbow much.. It relies on Broodwar.. HotS could be a lot better if all of it's new units had a clear idea/design in the purpose/concept behind (some do, but others don't hence why we don't love it as much as we could)..

However - the real reason I wanted to write on this thread is - I was SO hoping the VOD would have English CC translations of this

HaN-
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
France1920 Posts
July 11 2014 00:45 GMT
#56
Makes me really happy seeing a big korean starcraft figure such as TheMarine articulate so well what's wrong with SC2.
And then I get sad cause I have close to no hopes that Blizzard will take that road with LoTV.

THX for the transcript. Can't wait for the subed VOD so that it hopefully get the exposure it deserves among the foreign scene.
Calendaraka Foxhan
Nerski
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States1095 Posts
July 11 2014 02:01 GMT
#57
On July 11 2014 05:19 IntoTheheart wrote:
Interesting how Flash kept saying "stop crying and get good" the entire time through.


He's always been like that, I found it humorous anyone thought he'd QQ about balance when it was announced he'd be on this program in this discussion. Any really really good pro gamer always knows the key to victory is get better and not worry about what is not in your control.
Twitter: @GoForNerski /// Youtube: Youtube.com/nerskisc
jinorazi
Profile Joined October 2004
Korea (South)4948 Posts
July 11 2014 02:28 GMT
#58
Themarine is awesome
age: 84 | location: california | sex: 잘함
robertpires87
Profile Joined October 2013
Northern Ireland87 Posts
July 11 2014 02:36 GMT
#59
Flash should considered himself more than just another terran. His performance in the total biscuit's sandisk give me the best sc2 experience in my life. The best Terran to watch
Deleted User 97295
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
1137 Posts
July 11 2014 12:25 GMT
#60
--- Nuked ---
Prev 1 2 3 4 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 2h 46m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
WinterStarcraft597
Ketroc 49
Codebar 25
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 4766
ggaemo 390
Stork 309
Hm[arnc] 105
Leta 94
sSak 41
910 38
Rock 15
GoRush 9
Bale 7
[ Show more ]
Noble 6
Dota 2
XaKoH 254
NeuroSwarm136
League of Legends
JimRising 691
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K778
Other Games
summit1g4997
C9.Mang0259
Mew2King55
ToD25
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL5299
Other Games
BasetradeTV100
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 55
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Lourlo1356
• Stunt453
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
2h 46m
Maru vs MaxPax
BSL
11h 46m
RSL Revival
23h 46m
Cure vs Rogue
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 6h
BSL
1d 11h
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
Kung Fu Cup
4 days
[ Show More ]
The PondCast
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: W1
WardiTV Winter 2026
NationLESS Cup

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
CSL Elite League 2026
ASL Season 21
CSL Season 20: Qualifier 2
StarCraft2 Community Team League 2026 Spring
RSL Revival: Season 4
Nations Cup 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026

Upcoming

CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
Acropolis #4
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
IEM Rio 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.