• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 14:20
CET 20:20
KST 04:20
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book16Clem wins HomeStory Cup 289HomeStory Cup 28 - Info & Preview13Rongyi Cup S3 - Preview & Info8herO wins SC2 All-Star Invitational14
Community News
ACS replaced by "ASL Season Open" - Starts 21/0224LiuLi Cup: 2025 Grand Finals (Feb 10-16)41Weekly Cups (Feb 2-8): Classic, Solar, MaxPax win2Nexon's StarCraft game could be FPS, led by UMS maker13PIG STY FESTIVAL 7.0! (19 Feb - 1 Mar)17
StarCraft 2
General
Nexon's StarCraft game could be FPS, led by UMS maker How do you think the 5.0.15 balance patch (Oct 2025) for StarCraft II has affected the game? StarCraft 1 & 2 Added to Xbox Game Pass Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book Terran Scanner Sweep
Tourneys
WardiTV Team League Season 10 LiuLi Cup: 2025 Grand Finals (Feb 10-16) PIG STY FESTIVAL 7.0! (19 Feb - 1 Mar) $5,000 WardiTV Winter Championship 2026 StarCraft Evolution League (SC Evo Biweekly)
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ? [A] Starcraft Sound Mod
External Content
Mutation # 513 Attrition Warfare The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 512 Overclocked Mutation # 511 Temple of Rebirth
Brood War
General
Ladder maps - how we can make blizz update them? TvZ is the most complete match up BW General Discussion ACS replaced by "ASL Season Open" - Starts 21/02 Which units you wish saw more use in the game?
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 1 Small VOD Thread 2.0 KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates Zealot bombing is no longer popular? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Current Meta
Other Games
General Games
ZeroSpace Megathread Diablo 2 thread Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Ask and answer stupid questions here! Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
The Search For Meaning in Vi…
TrAiDoS
My 2025 Magic: The Gathering…
DARKING
Life Update and thoughts.
FuDDx
How do archons sleep?
8882
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1864 users

Star "HangShow" S4E4 - Balance talk with Flash - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 Next All
Big J
Profile Joined March 2011
Austria16289 Posts
July 09 2014 22:37 GMT
#21
Meh. Dont agree with these opinions at all.
Everything seems to be a generalization from BW to "every RTS game".
TurboMaN
Profile Joined October 2005
Germany925 Posts
July 09 2014 23:18 GMT
#22
Big thanks for the translation!
Well I've been arguing since the release that SC2 is too "casual" and pro players can't really show all of their mechanical skills.
Why did Blizz do this? Casuals don't play much ladder and have not played it in BW. They play Funmaps.

The best thing about watching BW Pro matches was that you knew how hard it was to play certain strategies (e.g. SK Terran). The player with the better mechanics won like 95% of the time. Nowadays the player with the better mechanics can't have a high winrate because there are so many allins which can be used by less skilled (mechanics) players and they get wins which they don't really deserve.
Noocta
Profile Joined June 2010
France12578 Posts
July 09 2014 23:47 GMT
#23
On July 10 2014 06:59 CutTheEnemy wrote:
Thanks a lot for this translation. I'm getting a lot more respect for S.Korea and their esports organizations in particular. They're able to be polite, vocal, innovative and hard working.

Please help spread the idea of Blizzard bringing Rob Pardo to replace Browder. Pardo led the broodwar, frozen throne and wow/BC design teams. Maybe he can deliver us.


Dude, Pardo left Blizzard a few weeks ago. Like completely
" I'm not gonna fight you. I'm gonna kick your ass ! "
SC2Toastie
Profile Blog Joined October 2013
Netherlands5725 Posts
July 10 2014 00:46 GMT
#24
I'm glad the Korean authorities on the subject agree to what I've said the past three years. Good Luck David!
Mura Ma Man, Dark Da Dude, Super Shot Sos!
agsub
Profile Joined May 2012
Singapore368 Posts
July 10 2014 00:52 GMT
#25
Thanks for the translation!
shadymmj
Profile Joined June 2010
1906 Posts
July 10 2014 01:03 GMT
#26
wow, that's a stacked interview list...but will dkim listen?
There is no such thing is "e-sports". There is Brood War, and then there is crap for nerds.
Silvana
Profile Blog Joined September 2013
3713 Posts
July 10 2014 01:14 GMT
#27
Thanks for the translation OP

Question... If they manage to raise the mechanical skill ceiling for LotV... won't it be bad for the player's wrists?? I wonder how the hell players took care of their wrists in the BW days if the game was so mechanically intense.
FreeZEternal
Profile Joined January 2003
Korea (South)3396 Posts
July 10 2014 01:49 GMT
#28
I agree with Blizzard wants us to play the game the way they want.
LingBlingBling
Profile Joined December 2012
United States353 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-10 02:10:20
July 10 2014 02:09 GMT
#29
Thank you so much for translate, I hear so many NA pros and EU pros say " it's balanced learn to play for PR for sponsors ect. So nice to hear that the Koreans don't think SC2 has good balance and has stale meta that won't invite new strats because it's an easier game to figure out compared to BW.

Hopefully Blizzard will listen to the Korean scene at least and maybe do something in their next Expac, but I doubt it.
Remember our motto: We ain't got it.
GTR
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
51544 Posts
July 10 2014 02:25 GMT
#30
On July 10 2014 10:14 silvana wrote:
Thanks for the translation OP

Question... If they manage to raise the mechanical skill ceiling for LotV... won't it be bad for the player's wrists?? I wonder how the hell players took care of their wrists in the BW days if the game was so mechanically intense.


the game has nothing to do with wrist management. the only reason why people get fucked up wrists is because they have poor posture and as a consequence have bad wrists.

just look at players like ganzi who had to retire because of poor wrist management. TLO was also going to be a victim but he was fortunate to realise the severity of the issue and has made amends to fix his problems and now he's going strong.
Commentator
Foreverkul
Profile Joined March 2014
United States1649 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-10 02:32:49
July 10 2014 02:31 GMT
#31
Basically, this confirms that Blizzard should have trusted their test team and roll out HotS as intended, but they bungled it all up when they pushed a major patch at the start of its release.

Perhaps the solution is to revert BACK to original HotS?

Basically, Blizzard should just throw in a bunch of new units into the pot and see what happens, thats how you create fun is by having variety and discovery.
XiaoJoyce-
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
China2908 Posts
July 10 2014 02:37 GMT
#32
There is so many david kim interview, and video and philosophy.
Then this interview/discussion from current and ex progamer.
I just feel, this interview speak what many people have feel in their heart.
But little more in depth and specific.
But David Kim dicussion is... so different, right?

Yeah , I agree with the hardcounters mentioned and everything is designed so we play BLIZZARD game . . .they game they wan as to play .

I remember Ghost used to destroy ultralisk, right? Then a patch, make ghost snipe so specific that it only good against spellcaster! It can use on other unit too, but it is not cost effective at all . . .

I tink Immortal is another one too . I tink Immortal ability need to be replaced with something more interesting than the current hardcounter. Regardless of dmg, as long as it is greater than 10, it is reduce to 10.

And I realised, there are plenty of air units, such as Phoenix, Oracle, Viking, Banshee. Either able to attack air, or attack ground only. They are not versatile, the reason must be for balance reason so 1 unit can easily hard counter the other by giving obvious weakness. Making them so 1-D unit...Plain . . .

Ah, I missed Goliath . . .Good movespeed, able to attack land & air , Goliath is high tech terran unit of course it have to perform as high tech unit. Great anti air, and good land dps. . . .

Maybe Marine range upgrade is good . . . a research for marine to increase range to 6.. or maybe give mech and air standard range from 6 to 7 . . . anything to make Terran race standout than other race....
Pew! Pew! Chitty Chitty Bang Bang!
YyapSsap
Profile Joined September 2010
New Zealand1511 Posts
July 10 2014 02:44 GMT
#33
They need to balance this game in other ways than numbers (although I wish they scrap this current damage system all together).

Removing the unlimited unit selection would be a start.
Empirimancer
Profile Joined July 2011
Canada1024 Posts
July 10 2014 03:04 GMT
#34
Just use that Blizzard magic to polish Starbow a bit and make it the official Starcraft 3.

Hextor
Profile Joined September 2013
16 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-10 04:34:43
July 10 2014 04:34 GMT
#35
tldr: D.Kim and Flash talk balance on phone
I can't hear you over the sound of the storm.
Novacute
Profile Joined September 2011
Australia313 Posts
July 10 2014 16:52 GMT
#36
Wow, the majority of Korean players and Kespa coaches seem to agree that Terrans are in need of help. I wonder why it takes so much coverage on Terran's current state to encourage a response from DK?
Ctone23
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
United States1839 Posts
July 10 2014 17:06 GMT
#37
Good read, but discouraging in my opinion. It's clear that the interface is the main issue for these guys. I don't see Blizz reverting the game and making it harder, although i'm in agreement it would make the game more entertaining to watch.
TL+ Member
pmp10
Profile Joined April 2012
3382 Posts
July 10 2014 17:07 GMT
#38
Honestly they gave even less useful advice than foreigner pros.
'Remake the game to be more like BW' is not a option at this point.
Canucklehead
Profile Joined March 2011
Canada5074 Posts
July 10 2014 17:08 GMT
#39
I agree with them that the decision to have everything have a hard counter to each other is too rigid and one of the design flaws of the game. I don't really agree with them that too many patches are bad though. I think the idea that given time some things can be overcome is true to a point, but sometimes things are so op/broken that all the time in the world won't do anything.
Top 10 favourite pros: MKP, MVP, MC, Nestea, DRG, Jaedong, Flash, Life, Creator, Leenock
Xiphos
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Canada7507 Posts
July 10 2014 18:36 GMT
#40
On July 11 2014 02:08 Canucklehead wrote:
I agree with them that the decision to have everything have a hard counter to each other is too rigid and one of the design flaws of the game. I don't really agree with them that too many patches are bad though. I think the idea that given time some things can be overcome is true to a point, but sometimes things are so op/broken that all the time in the world won't do anything.


A big reason why patches are so prevalent in SC2 is that it is required to keep the game in a non-stale fashion.
2014 - ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ Raise your bows brood warriors! ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ
Prev 1 2 3 4 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Monday Night Weeklies
17:30
#40
RotterdaM966
TKL 336
IndyStarCraft 315
SteadfastSC112
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Grubby 3472
RotterdaM 966
TKL 336
IndyStarCraft 315
Harstem 277
BRAT_OK 134
SteadfastSC 112
elazer 99
UpATreeSC 91
Livibee 38
Ketroc 21
Vindicta 12
StarCraft: Brood War
Mini 720
Shuttle 520
ggaemo 356
nyoken 45
Rock 25
JYJ 20
Dota 2
Gorgc4511
League of Legends
Rex45
Counter-Strike
fl0m5312
Foxcn517
Other Games
Beastyqt907
ceh9525
C9.Mang0130
ToD113
ArmadaUGS110
Liquid`Hasu102
KnowMe102
Trikslyr76
Mew2King69
JuggernautJason17
OptimusSC27
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL42015
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 21 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• kabyraGe 176
• davetesta9
• Reevou 6
• IndyKCrew
• sooper7s
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• intothetv
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• HerbMon 30
• FirePhoenix4
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota262
League of Legends
• Nemesis3154
• Jankos1891
• TFBlade912
Other Games
• imaqtpie1208
• Shiphtur418
Upcoming Events
OSC
4h 40m
WardiTV Winter Champion…
16h 40m
PiGosaur Cup
1d 5h
Replay Cast
1d 13h
WardiTV Winter Champion…
1d 16h
Replay Cast
2 days
PiG Sty Festival
2 days
Maru vs Bunny
Classic vs SHIN
The PondCast
2 days
KCM Race Survival
2 days
WardiTV Winter Champion…
2 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
3 days
PiG Sty Festival
3 days
Clem vs Percival
Zoun vs Solar
Epic.LAN
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
PiG Sty Festival
4 days
herO vs NightMare
Reynor vs Cure
CranKy Ducklings
4 days
Epic.LAN
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
PiG Sty Festival
5 days
Serral vs YoungYakov
ByuN vs ShoWTimE
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Wardi Open
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-02-14
LiuLi Cup: 2025 Grand Finals
Underdog Cup #3

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Nations Cup 2026
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S1: King of Kings
[S:21] ASL SEASON OPEN 1st Round
[S:21] ASL SEASON OPEN 1st Round Qualifier
[S:21] ASL SEASON OPEN 2nd Round
[S:21] ASL SEASON OPEN 2nd Round Qualifier
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
RSL Revival: Season 4
WardiTV Winter 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
FISSURE Playground #3
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
ESL Pro League Season 23
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.