• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 17:09
CEST 23:09
KST 06:09
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins EWC 202538Tournament Spotlight: FEL Cracow 202510Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202580RSL Season 1 - Final Week9[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15
Community News
LiuLi Cup - August 2025 Tournaments3[BSL 2025] H2 - Team Wars, Weeklies & SB Ladder9EWC 2025 - Replay Pack4Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced55BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams11
StarCraft 2
General
Serral wins EWC 2025 The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings Interview with Chris "ChanmanV" Chan Tournament Spotlight: FEL Cracow 2025 Classic: "It's a thick wall to break through to become world champ"
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament LiuLi Cup - August 2025 Tournaments Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) TaeJa vs Creator Bo7 SC Evo Showmatch FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $10,000 live event
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 485 Death from Below Mutation # 484 Magnetic Pull Mutation #239 Bad Weather Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars
Brood War
General
BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams How do the new Battle.net ranks translate? BW General Discussion Nobody gona talk about this year crazy qualifiers? Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL20] Online Qualifiers Day 2 [ASL20] Online Qualifiers Day 1 Small VOD Thread 2.0
Strategy
[G] Mineral Boosting Muta micro map competition Does 1 second matter in StarCraft? Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Total Annihilation Server - TAForever Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Beyond All Reason [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok)
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread 9/11 Anniversary Possible Al Qaeda Attack on 9/11 Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Movie Discussion! Korean Music Discussion
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2025 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Gtx660 graphics card replacement Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale The Automated Ban List
Blogs
ASL S20 English Commentary…
namkraft
The Link Between Fitness and…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Socialism Anyone?
GreenHorizons
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 679 users

Star "HangShow" S4E4 - Balance talk with Flash - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 Next All
Big J
Profile Joined March 2011
Austria16289 Posts
July 09 2014 22:37 GMT
#21
Meh. Dont agree with these opinions at all.
Everything seems to be a generalization from BW to "every RTS game".
TurboMaN
Profile Joined October 2005
Germany925 Posts
July 09 2014 23:18 GMT
#22
Big thanks for the translation!
Well I've been arguing since the release that SC2 is too "casual" and pro players can't really show all of their mechanical skills.
Why did Blizz do this? Casuals don't play much ladder and have not played it in BW. They play Funmaps.

The best thing about watching BW Pro matches was that you knew how hard it was to play certain strategies (e.g. SK Terran). The player with the better mechanics won like 95% of the time. Nowadays the player with the better mechanics can't have a high winrate because there are so many allins which can be used by less skilled (mechanics) players and they get wins which they don't really deserve.
Noocta
Profile Joined June 2010
France12578 Posts
July 09 2014 23:47 GMT
#23
On July 10 2014 06:59 CutTheEnemy wrote:
Thanks a lot for this translation. I'm getting a lot more respect for S.Korea and their esports organizations in particular. They're able to be polite, vocal, innovative and hard working.

Please help spread the idea of Blizzard bringing Rob Pardo to replace Browder. Pardo led the broodwar, frozen throne and wow/BC design teams. Maybe he can deliver us.


Dude, Pardo left Blizzard a few weeks ago. Like completely
" I'm not gonna fight you. I'm gonna kick your ass ! "
SC2Toastie
Profile Blog Joined October 2013
Netherlands5725 Posts
July 10 2014 00:46 GMT
#24
I'm glad the Korean authorities on the subject agree to what I've said the past three years. Good Luck David!
Mura Ma Man, Dark Da Dude, Super Shot Sos!
agsub
Profile Joined May 2012
Singapore368 Posts
July 10 2014 00:52 GMT
#25
Thanks for the translation!
shadymmj
Profile Joined June 2010
1906 Posts
July 10 2014 01:03 GMT
#26
wow, that's a stacked interview list...but will dkim listen?
There is no such thing is "e-sports". There is Brood War, and then there is crap for nerds.
Silvana
Profile Blog Joined September 2013
3713 Posts
July 10 2014 01:14 GMT
#27
Thanks for the translation OP

Question... If they manage to raise the mechanical skill ceiling for LotV... won't it be bad for the player's wrists?? I wonder how the hell players took care of their wrists in the BW days if the game was so mechanically intense.
FreeZEternal
Profile Joined January 2003
Korea (South)3396 Posts
July 10 2014 01:49 GMT
#28
I agree with Blizzard wants us to play the game the way they want.
LingBlingBling
Profile Joined December 2012
United States353 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-10 02:10:20
July 10 2014 02:09 GMT
#29
Thank you so much for translate, I hear so many NA pros and EU pros say " it's balanced learn to play for PR for sponsors ect. So nice to hear that the Koreans don't think SC2 has good balance and has stale meta that won't invite new strats because it's an easier game to figure out compared to BW.

Hopefully Blizzard will listen to the Korean scene at least and maybe do something in their next Expac, but I doubt it.
Remember our motto: We ain't got it.
GTR
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
51451 Posts
July 10 2014 02:25 GMT
#30
On July 10 2014 10:14 silvana wrote:
Thanks for the translation OP

Question... If they manage to raise the mechanical skill ceiling for LotV... won't it be bad for the player's wrists?? I wonder how the hell players took care of their wrists in the BW days if the game was so mechanically intense.


the game has nothing to do with wrist management. the only reason why people get fucked up wrists is because they have poor posture and as a consequence have bad wrists.

just look at players like ganzi who had to retire because of poor wrist management. TLO was also going to be a victim but he was fortunate to realise the severity of the issue and has made amends to fix his problems and now he's going strong.
Commentator
Foreverkul
Profile Joined March 2014
United States1649 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-10 02:32:49
July 10 2014 02:31 GMT
#31
Basically, this confirms that Blizzard should have trusted their test team and roll out HotS as intended, but they bungled it all up when they pushed a major patch at the start of its release.

Perhaps the solution is to revert BACK to original HotS?

Basically, Blizzard should just throw in a bunch of new units into the pot and see what happens, thats how you create fun is by having variety and discovery.
XiaoJoyce-
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
China2908 Posts
July 10 2014 02:37 GMT
#32
There is so many david kim interview, and video and philosophy.
Then this interview/discussion from current and ex progamer.
I just feel, this interview speak what many people have feel in their heart.
But little more in depth and specific.
But David Kim dicussion is... so different, right?

Yeah , I agree with the hardcounters mentioned and everything is designed so we play BLIZZARD game . . .they game they wan as to play .

I remember Ghost used to destroy ultralisk, right? Then a patch, make ghost snipe so specific that it only good against spellcaster! It can use on other unit too, but it is not cost effective at all . . .

I tink Immortal is another one too . I tink Immortal ability need to be replaced with something more interesting than the current hardcounter. Regardless of dmg, as long as it is greater than 10, it is reduce to 10.

And I realised, there are plenty of air units, such as Phoenix, Oracle, Viking, Banshee. Either able to attack air, or attack ground only. They are not versatile, the reason must be for balance reason so 1 unit can easily hard counter the other by giving obvious weakness. Making them so 1-D unit...Plain . . .

Ah, I missed Goliath . . .Good movespeed, able to attack land & air , Goliath is high tech terran unit of course it have to perform as high tech unit. Great anti air, and good land dps. . . .

Maybe Marine range upgrade is good . . . a research for marine to increase range to 6.. or maybe give mech and air standard range from 6 to 7 . . . anything to make Terran race standout than other race....
Pew! Pew! Chitty Chitty Bang Bang!
YyapSsap
Profile Joined September 2010
New Zealand1511 Posts
July 10 2014 02:44 GMT
#33
They need to balance this game in other ways than numbers (although I wish they scrap this current damage system all together).

Removing the unlimited unit selection would be a start.
Empirimancer
Profile Joined July 2011
Canada1024 Posts
July 10 2014 03:04 GMT
#34
Just use that Blizzard magic to polish Starbow a bit and make it the official Starcraft 3.

Hextor
Profile Joined September 2013
16 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-10 04:34:43
July 10 2014 04:34 GMT
#35
tldr: D.Kim and Flash talk balance on phone
I can't hear you over the sound of the storm.
Novacute
Profile Joined September 2011
Australia313 Posts
July 10 2014 16:52 GMT
#36
Wow, the majority of Korean players and Kespa coaches seem to agree that Terrans are in need of help. I wonder why it takes so much coverage on Terran's current state to encourage a response from DK?
Ctone23
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
United States1839 Posts
July 10 2014 17:06 GMT
#37
Good read, but discouraging in my opinion. It's clear that the interface is the main issue for these guys. I don't see Blizz reverting the game and making it harder, although i'm in agreement it would make the game more entertaining to watch.
TL+ Member
pmp10
Profile Joined April 2012
3321 Posts
July 10 2014 17:07 GMT
#38
Honestly they gave even less useful advice than foreigner pros.
'Remake the game to be more like BW' is not a option at this point.
Canucklehead
Profile Joined March 2011
Canada5074 Posts
July 10 2014 17:08 GMT
#39
I agree with them that the decision to have everything have a hard counter to each other is too rigid and one of the design flaws of the game. I don't really agree with them that too many patches are bad though. I think the idea that given time some things can be overcome is true to a point, but sometimes things are so op/broken that all the time in the world won't do anything.
Top 10 favourite pros: MKP, MVP, MC, Nestea, DRG, Jaedong, Flash, Life, Creator, Leenock
Xiphos
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Canada7507 Posts
July 10 2014 18:36 GMT
#40
On July 11 2014 02:08 Canucklehead wrote:
I agree with them that the decision to have everything have a hard counter to each other is too rigid and one of the design flaws of the game. I don't really agree with them that too many patches are bad though. I think the idea that given time some things can be overcome is true to a point, but sometimes things are so op/broken that all the time in the world won't do anything.


A big reason why patches are so prevalent in SC2 is that it is required to keep the game in a non-stale fashion.
2014 - ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ Raise your bows brood warriors! ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ
Prev 1 2 3 4 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 13h 51m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
IndyStarCraft 322
CosmosSc2 98
StarCraft: Brood War
Larva 268
firebathero 133
ggaemo 100
Aegong 32
Stork 2
Dota 2
capcasts219
League of Legends
JimRising 346
Reynor99
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K922
flusha792
byalli574
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu524
Khaldor388
Other Games
tarik_tv15659
summit1g6648
Grubby3244
gofns2926
B2W.Neo1009
fl0m1006
420jenkins409
JuggernautJason39
Sick33
ToD0
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1859
StarCraft 2
angryscii 25
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH240
• davetesta88
• StrangeGG 72
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• sooper7s
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• FirePhoenix23
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota22223
League of Legends
• Doublelift3986
Other Games
• imaqtpie1427
Upcoming Events
Wardi Open
13h 51m
OSC
1d 2h
Stormgate Nexus
2 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
The PondCast
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
LiuLi Cup
4 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
4 days
RSL Revival
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
[ Show More ]
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

ASL Season 20: Qualifier #1
FEL Cracow 2025
CC Div. A S7

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL 20 Non-Korean Championship
BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Qualifiers
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #2
HCC Europe
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025

Upcoming

ASL Season 20
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
WardiTV Summer 2025
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
MESA Nomadic Masters Fall
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
Roobet Cup 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.