EPTTerran Buffs - Balance Testing Soon - July 1 - Page 32
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Skynx
Turkey7150 Posts
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LennX
4568 Posts
Why can't they buff other Terran units that are not being used? Tweaking the build time of mech units will or, a change in BC will help(maybe maximum of 100 energy, yamato costs 75 energy to use). Making bunker having a default 6 space building. (who gets that upgrade anyway?) Or maybe they could revert of some the nerfs that they made. I'm looking at you ghosts nerfs and barracks build time increase. But we will just get "Bunker build time now reduced to 30 seconds." | ||
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herMan
Japan2056 Posts
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althaz
Australia1001 Posts
On July 02 2014 15:41 Svizcy wrote: Voted yes on both, since it has been like 4-5 years now since the terran got buffed the last time. Wont affect me in any way, but i guess we can expect some more terrans in top8 of gsl now again i hope. Terran got buffed in the previous patch, lol. Not saying they don't need some help though. Only Polt, Taeja and Maru have won anything for ages now and there are other talented Terran players IMO, it's just so hard to win at the highest level if you arent' the complete player in terms of build order poker, mechanics, strategy and in fact, everything. Protoss and Zerg right now are more forgiving if you aren't that sort of player, IMO. It's really close to balanced right now, Terran just needs a little something extra. | ||
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mechengineer123
Ukraine711 Posts
2. In terms of recent tournament wins, the three races are performing quite evenly. Really? Really? Anyway, faster unload speed for medivacs seems like a cool thing, gonna result in more small microbattles probably. Buffing the speed boost is a bad idea, there's no fun in watching medivacs fly past (or away from) things too fast for them to do anything. Widow mines.. ehh, I just wish they were more consistent or would really react to targetting. It's too random now, sometimes they kill 10 banelings, sometimes they kill 10 own marines and that decides the battle right away. They should look for a more lategame oriented option too, for once. Give the thor some love. | ||
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helius788
New Zealand74 Posts
Stim research time decrease to 140s (-30s) Combat shields research time decrease to 60 (-50s) and costs the same as Concussive Shell (50/50) And MSC Photon Overcharge costs 150 Energy MSC cost should be 150/150 (a unit that is so good and powerful in every situtation, match-up etc. , must cost more since Protoss can neglect building an army by too much) That would fix TvP and would not ruin TvZ (bio needs a buff in TvZ as well imo) or TvT (since mech is more viable atm anyways) Terran could skip a factory and go for a pure bio push. This would give Terrans some options and would help defending Blink pushes of Toss that are far too powerful atm. | ||
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BEARDiaguz
Australia2362 Posts
On July 02 2014 19:01 mechengineer123 wrote: Really? Really? Anyway, faster unload speed for medivacs seems like a cool thing, gonna result in more small microbattles probably. Buffing the speed boost is a bad idea, there's no fun in watching medivacs fly past (or away from) things too fast for them to do anything. Widow mines.. ehh, I just wish they were more consistent or would really react to targetting. It's too random now, sometimes they kill 10 banelings, sometimes they kill 10 own marines and that decides the battle right away. They should look for a more lategame oriented option too, for once. Give the thor some love. Innovation winning dragon invitationals 1 and 2, Taeja winning HSC and Dreamhack, Polt getting second at both MLG and Redbull BG's. Only problem is when taeja and polt finals'd their tournaments there wasn't an awful lot of terrans doing well besides them. | ||
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aka_star
United Kingdom1546 Posts
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Teoita
Italy12246 Posts
On July 02 2014 19:02 helius788 wrote: I would suggest instead (to help Terran early game which is non existent atm): Stim research time decrease to 140s (-30s) Combat shields research time decrease to 60 (-50s) and costs the same as Concussive Shell (50/50) And MSC Photon Overcharge costs 150 Energy MSC cost should be 150/150 (a unit that is so good and powerful in every situtation, match-up etc. , must cost more since Protoss can neglect building an army by too much) That would fix TvP and would not ruin TvZ (bio needs a buff in TvZ as well imo) or TvT (since mech is more viable atm anyways) Terran could skip a factory and go for a pure bio push. This would give Terrans some options and would help defending Blink pushes of Toss that are far too powerful atm. For the millionth time, the MsC cannot be nerfed heavily because of PvT because it would affect PvZ and PvP very deeply as well. Other than that, i agree with those changes along with a true lategame buff. | ||
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plgElwood
Germany518 Posts
TvP This moment when you scanned 3 times found some templar, shift snipe the, and then the main protoss ball comes down on your standing Bio force from another side and its Storm Storm Storm -100 Supply - mid map so instant GG? Spent 100/100 to watchtower everything maybe?!? I want the C&C 3 mobile Watchtower pls.... TvZ Z has 4 queens lings and spine on two base, hellion dont do anything, by the time medevac is out there are spores, and lings and now even more queens. The creep gets out of hand because 2 queens pushing it guarded by speed lings, even if you had you 4-6 Hellion out, there is no way to engage the tumors, either you are accepting surround or take direct damage from the Queens (remember when queens were melee vs. Ground ? Pepperidge Farm remembers !) And here is the problem if you miss the lings run out, you will lose your hellions, and some map control for a long time. And by the way...whats the micro requirement for lings? yep Shift move ahaed, followed by attack to the hellion retreat path and go back to macro, oh minimap shows hellion escape, whole army button, back to base. Whats Terran doing? F*cking racedriving the little cars, looking for angles and chokes to use the flame, to get them to do at least some damage. Mines vs. Baneblob. I tried, I really tried to minefield my way. Double Factory mines, mines everywhere, Whats Z doing "you are not attacking me, so i use my Mutaflock headed by 2 overseer to kill your mines left and right. Even if I take a hit...does not matter regen. #YOLForever So when i ran past my minefield saw the blob incoming, what the fuck stim...retreat into the minefield. Zerg passes 10 mines...all hit decent....Blob kills all bio not in the medevacs anyway. Retreat further....muta looking for prey also get hit by mines killing natural mineral line.....where 2 mines and a turrets got sniped instantly....zergs at your throat loosing 20 mutas in the process....still can not remax faster on 6-8 barracks and three base.. Zerg figured Macro and Creep. Also that mines dont do damage and Maps these days are to big to Marine-Tank it. Also since the muta Buff, tanks are even weaker, fly in snipe, lose nothing. I want Z and P lose their whole army when not looking, Storm and Baneling is equal to a zero-timer nuke. You could actually make that, a nuke that has 0.5 Seconds to arrive. | ||
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Skrulla
Norway3 Posts
Therefore it would be smarter to reduce the cost or buff the thors as they serve the same purpose but in a different composition.. Or obviously tanks, as they are useless unless youre in a TvT and have air. | ||
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Evil_Sheep
Canada902 Posts
On July 02 2014 18:11 Mojito99 wrote: This is very true, but ironically this is due to the T strengths rather than its weaknesses. Keep in mind SCII was designed around Terran bio units, all other races haven been given counters to address the strength of bio. It is not that Terran lack versatility, its more of the fact that at any point bio remains the undoubtedly strongest option but lives and dies on mechanics as show by the korean terran which every tries to copy. T does have versatility in openings: marauder hellbat, gas first builds, widow mine drops, fast stim, hellion pushes. these literally work against all races. The main reason why you never see them is to do with the fact that bio is so strong and these pushes all sacrifice the strength of a midgame bio push. Not sure how to address this in a patch but essentially you need to nerf the bio output dps, and instead make the composition more durable by for example incr. the healing output of a medivac. Then and only then can you adjust the units which can feature in a hybrid composition such as hellbats resulting in more versatile unit comps. Honestly I don't know how to "fix" this problem, and I don't think there is scope to make sweeping changes to terran before LotV. They really just need a buff now and though I don't like to jump on the easy hate David Kim bandwagon, as I think he's usually done a good job in the past, his proposed buffs just strike me as intellectually bankrupt. | ||
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Rollora
2450 Posts
Mr Kim might think it is super Exciting, but well... it is essentially a coinflip unit: if it does what it should do you have superawesome trades, but well it often doesnt and you cannot do anything about it so its a super lame unit. I think they are on the same lamer-level as the free units. Medivac Buff... meh, I'd like to see the standard units doing more damage vs shilded units, like a Tankshot does some extra damage to shielded units after a vertain upgrade | ||
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t0n!ght
57 Posts
I read through most of this thread and the original battle.net thread. I'm a diamond terran player myself and I think terran needs to buffed immediately. I'm ok with the state of TvT. I think it's a super exciting matchup to play and watch. Unfortunately you hardly ever get to see it anymore. In my opinion TvP is so much better since the WM buff. I like playing it again and it feels balanced to me. I feel sad for the protoss players that storm openings are not viable anymore. But they were way too strong. We all remember those 2-2 zealot/archon 2 base all ins into storms. I was losing against those so many times and really couldn't understand how I could hold that. Ok let's get to TvZ. I think in the current state you can't win on Frost cross and Waystation against zerg. You need to outplay them hard otherwise you just can't. I have a super hard time to get even trades in midgame. Usually I can't trade ok and that's why I lose. Plus zerg gets stronger the longer the game goes I just don't. In my opinion there are 2 problems with terran atm: 1) The ability to trade ok in TvZ midgame 2) Early game weakness and predictability Suggestions to 1): In think buffing the widow mine is the way to go. Tweak the numbers. Not as strong as the old one, but stronger as it is now. I don't think this will change TvP. Storm openers are already dead. Suggestions to 2): I'm not sure about this. I think the problem is that terran has to go for the "greedy/standard" build because there are no "agressive 2 basy" builds that do anything. This makes it really easy to come up with a strong zerg/protoss 2-base timing which will never be hard-countered by an agressive terran build. Maybe we could solve this by making room for "agressive 2 basy" terran builds. Yeah I really hope we can come up with better buff suggestions. I started playing league and I really enjoy that there are no balance related problems. | ||
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XiZeL
Switzerland92 Posts
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helius788
New Zealand74 Posts
On July 02 2014 19:05 Teoita wrote: For the millionth time, the MsC cannot be nerfed heavily because of PvT because it would affect PvZ and PvP very deeply as well. Other than that, i agree with those changes along with a true lategame buff. PvP is a mirror match, so an effect of the MSC will not effect the balance. And for PvZ 150Energy instead of 100 would not effect the matchup by too much to adapt. Imo Protoss is too strong in PvZ as well The MSC must be looked at no matter the matchups, since the value a player gets for 100/100 costs is simply ridiculous. A Zerg or Terran does not have an early spellcaster unit that is so useful and costefficient that not getting a MSC is stupiditiy. | ||
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Highways
Australia6105 Posts
Terran needs a buff, but do it in smarter and more exciting ways. Just goes to show how incompetent David Kim is. | ||
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gneGne
Netherlands697 Posts
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StackerTwo
United States41 Posts
how about: instead of 20 damage 10 + 10 shield ;P | ||
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Glomblor
Australia26 Posts
Let's remember back to the start of HOTS when Zerg needed something to address siege lines - Swarm Host Protoss needed options early game - MSC. Terran needs a viable Mech option. I feel something like the science vessel/warhound or maybe a mech caster that increased damage done to unis in an area (so as to detract from early blink attacks while enhancing the midgame push). | ||
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