EPTAsk mYi balloon which race is hardest :D
Demoted! Anyone else? - Page 10
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Dunmer
United Kingdom568 Posts
Ask mYi balloon which race is hardest :D | ||
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PanN
United States2828 Posts
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TRaFFiC
Canada1448 Posts
On April 17 2014 03:20 DjayEl wrote: Hard to say, it still does not explain why my opponents are far worse than the ones I was facing at the end of the other season. I will go through that for sure, but for now I can attest that for me it is not an enjoyable experience at all and I believe Bizzard should be more transparent about this. Or display true MMR or something. It's too much disturbing, it's a hassle each time to understand where you belong and how do you compare with, say, your friends in other divisions. Haha buddy, I experienced the same. Luckily I didn`t fall into plat, but I went 10-1 my first few games back in diamond and I`m thinking wtf, wtf. It seems to be stabilizing out after 30 games I`m moving towards 50% just like you said (still around 60). My EU account is plat. I don`t play as much on it and I think that goes to show a couple things. You have to play a lot of games to get promoted and leagues aren`t working. It has a serious effect on whether anyone can improve in the game. On my diamond accounts, I hit master players who smash me. But on the plat one, I just play plats. Hard to improve playing plats. | ||
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Ctone23
United States1841 Posts
Just because I'm older now, full time job, and only play one-three games a day during the week(more on weekend), doesn't mean I should be fucking demoted every season. I was diamond in wol and had a great experience with about a 50% win rate, exactly what blizz wanted. Now, I constantly get demoted to where this season i'm in gold, yet I play versus masters and diamonds all the time. I love the game, but fuck me, so annoying to deal with, especially when the community bases your knowledge on the color of the border on your portrait. It really shouldn't matter, but it does. I don't understand the logic here, I guess maybe they want people to stick around and play longer ladder sessions. That tactic is backfiring with me personally, I lose desire to play. I worked hard to earn my league in wol, and it just seems like all that work with my mmr is completely useless, and blizz is deciding how my activity represents my skill. BOO! | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27456 Posts
On April 24 2014 23:05 Ctone23 wrote: Have to admit, I posted in here saying that promotion is relatively easy after the season starting demotion, but hasn't been the case for me this season, and I couldn't be more fucking frustrated. Just because I'm older now, full time job, and only play one-three games a day during the week(more on weekend), doesn't mean I should be fucking demoted every season. I was diamond in wol and had a great experience with about a 50% win rate, exactly what blizz wanted. Now, I constantly get demoted to where this season i'm in gold, yet I play versus masters and diamonds all the time. I love the game, but fuck me, so annoying to deal with, especially when the community bases your knowledge on the color of the border on your portrait. It really shouldn't matter, but it does. I don't understand the logic here, I guess maybe they want people to stick around and play longer ladder sessions. That tactic is backfiring with me personally, I lose desire to play. I worked hard to earn my league in wol, and it just seems like all that work with my mmr is completely useless, and blizz is deciding how my activity represents my skill. BOO! I feel your pain man. As a working single parent of sorts I still have maintained a decent overall mechanical level but I can't play enough to ever outdo the MMR decay it seems! A session is infrequent and tends to start with me stomping bad players, start hitting guys who are good, be out of time and the process repeats next time I log. Then I post my complaints in here and people somehow get the impression I give a fuck about the portrait beside my name :S | ||
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Ctone23
United States1841 Posts
On April 24 2014 23:29 Wombat_NI wrote: I feel your pain man. As a working single parent of sorts I still have maintained a decent overall mechanical level but I can't play enough to ever outdo the MMR decay it seems! A session is infrequent and tends to start with me stomping bad players, start hitting guys who are good, be out of time and the process repeats next time I log. Then I post my complaints in here and people somehow get the impression I give a fuck about the portrait beside my name :S Yea essentially I posted a rant of sorts. I have to say I feel a bit better after posting that. I just get discouraged now, where before I did not. I understand you are supposed to lose, but the frustration grows inside because of all of the hidden variables. They say mmr decay only happens if you are inactive for two weeks continuous, which I have never done, and at the end of each season I play higher league opponents. Next season I win my placement vs a plat, get gold? It doesn't make any logical sense. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27456 Posts
Go on ladder and get placed way, way down not just in terms of league but in terms of the relative ability of the players, who are often noticeably worse than who I used to play. The general crux of my rant is that IMO your skill does not decay equivalently with the MMR decay, your playing chops remain higher than the matchmaking system allows for, so you come back, play a bunch of games vs bad players, start to progress, go inactive a bit and then the cycle repeats. I'd imagine for the more active player this isn't an issue, but for those with a lot of RL commitments it really tanks the fun out of laddering. | ||
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Synk
United States297 Posts
Anyways it took about 3 ladder sessions, I went 22-3 and got put back into Diamond (at rank 1). I was surprise that I didn't start facing a single diamond player until I had won about 15 straight though, I just absolutely crushed 15 gold and platinum people in a row which was really kind of annoying but good for the ego I guess. The ladder does seem a lot more competitive now so I don't know if I'll even bother pushing to get back into Masters, | ||
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RampancyTW
United States577 Posts
If you have been playing frequently enough to avoid MMR decay and got placed into a lower league to start the season, and are playing "worse" opponents, than before-- THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH YOUR LEAGUE. Your MMR determines who you play against, not your league. And your MMR is unaffected by the fact you got demoted to start the season. | ||
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rikter
United States352 Posts
i think the big thing driving a lot of this goofiness isnt the mmr decay, its the shrunken player base. I think that its harder to move up to diamond and beyond bc there just arent enough higher ranked players on for you to really boost your mmr against? At some point i would imagine your mmr stops going up, or does so at a pathetic rate, if you dont get matched against higher quality opponants? At the very least it may be time to revise our stereotypes, bc as the base shrinks it is inevitable that quality players are going to have to populate lower leagues | ||
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rikter
United States352 Posts
i think the big thing driving a lot of this goofiness isnt the mmr decay, its the shrunken player base. I think that its harder to move up to diamond and beyond bc there just arent enough higher ranked players on for you to really boost your mmr against? At some point i would imagine your mmr stops going up, or does so at a pathetic rate, if you dont get matched against higher quality opponants? At the very least it may be time to revise our stereotypes, bc as the base shrinks it is inevitable that quality players are going to have to populate lower leagues | ||
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nkr
Sweden5451 Posts
On April 24 2014 05:29 Dunmer wrote: Thats a question where very few people are in a position to answer. People have so much bias and only really can play one race very often. Ask mYi balloon which race is hardest :D he has said that terran is the hardest race ;p | ||
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Ctone23
United States1841 Posts
On April 24 2014 23:45 Wombat_NI wrote: I'd imagine for the more active player this isn't an issue, but for those with a lot of RL commitments it really tanks the fun out of laddering. Spot on right there. On April 24 2014 23:53 RampancyTW wrote: So much of the complaining in this thread is placebo effect, delusion, or outright lies. If you have been playing frequently enough to avoid MMR decay and got placed into a lower league to start the season, and are playing "worse" opponents, than before-- THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH YOUR LEAGUE. Your MMR determines who you play against, not your league. And your MMR is unaffected by the fact you got demoted to start the season. EDIT: Oops, read that wrong. Disagree completely. How is it that I end the previous season top 8 plat, playing 50% of my games vs Diamond, win the placement match vs a plat terran, and get gold? Also, how can you explain how I continue to play diamond and masters league opponents. I'm sick of people hailing MMR as the all-knowing source, when in reality its broken. | ||
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RampancyTW
United States577 Posts
On April 25 2014 00:21 Ctone23 wrote: Wait, what?Spot on right there. EDIT: Oops, read that wrong. Disagree completely. How is it that I end the previous season top 8 plat, playing 50% of my games vs Diamond, win the placement match vs a plat terran, and get gold? Also, how can you explain how I continue to play diamond and masters league opponents. I'm sick of people hailing MMR as the all-knowing source, when in reality its broken. So you're still playing the same level of players that you were before? Sounds like your MMR is working exactly as intended. The leagues may be a little wonky, but that won't affect the quality of player you play against. | ||
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korona
1098 Posts
On April 24 2014 23:53 RampancyTW wrote: So much of the complaining in this thread is placebo effect, delusion, or outright lies. If you have been playing frequently enough to avoid MMR decay and got placed into a lower league to start the season, and are playing "worse" opponents, than before-- THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH YOUR LEAGUE. Your MMR determines who you play against, not your league. And your MMR is unaffected by the fact you got demoted to start the season. On April 25 2014 00:21 Ctone23 wrote: EDIT: Oops, read that wrong. Disagree completely. How is it that I end the previous season top 8 plat, playing 50% of my games vs Diamond, win the placement match vs a plat terran, and get gold? Also, how can you explain how I continue to play diamond and masters league opponents. I'm sick of people hailing MMR as the all-knowing source, when in reality its broken. Actually after HotS launch the league has mattered. The matchmaking is still MMR based, but it seems to prefer opponents from your own league. E.g. if there are two available opponents in close MMR range - one from lower league and one from your league, the matchmaker generally picks the one from your league. When you drop into lower league MMR range during the season, you are still most of the time facing others from your league, whose MMR has also dropped either naturally via losing or via MMR decay. But in the start of the new season you are placed into the lower league based on your MMR and most of your opponents will be from that league. And population in the lower league is now a mix of those whose MMR dropped there during the previous season and those who already were there. Those who dropped into the lower league are likely generally more skilled than the players who already were there. | ||
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-stOpSKY-
Canada498 Posts
Example: OP was masters but is in diamond now. If OP still faces challenging diamond/masters opponents I don't see why it matters if hes in diamond. They should just have an invisible MMR with no leagues so people stop talking about them IMO. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17894 Posts
then i go on a long run of playing games. after 10 or 15 games i'm back to a 50/50 winning percentage. all this nitpicking/whining is good for a laugh. i've played many RTS games over the last 10+ years and each game had its own matchmaker. relative to the other match making systems i've played within , SC2's system is excellent. i'm in Diamond, but i move from Gold to Diamond depending on the race i use and how often i play. the lowest Bronze players and the top GM players might not like the match making system, but this occurs with all ladders for all RTS games... and probably all games in general. | ||
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Ctone23
United States1841 Posts
On April 25 2014 00:36 korona wrote: Actually after HotS launch the league has mattered. The matchmaking is still MMR based, but it seems to prefer opponents from your own league. E.g. if there are two available opponents in close MMR range - one from lower league and one from your league, the matchmaker generally picks the one from your league. When you drop into lower league MMR range during the season, you are still most of the time facing others from your league, whose MMR has also dropped either naturally via losing or via MMR decay. But in the start of the new season you are placed into the lower league based on your MMR and most of your opponents will be from that league. And population in the lower league is now a mix of those whose MMR dropped there during the previous season and those who already were there. Those who dropped into the lower league are likely generally more skilled than the players who already were there. I don't buy that, and that is just too complicated. I think the main issue is that the player pool is dropping and blizz wants to fill all of the leagues and allow for promotions, which is frustrating for someone working over 40 hours a week who can't play a lot. As for your example of MMR, I don't think me playing vs diamond and masters players in the previous system indicates your scenario. I think they simply want to fill the leagues and probably pick players with fewer than X amount of games to be demoted. Who knows.. | ||
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korona
1098 Posts
On April 25 2014 00:38 -stOpSKY- wrote: I don't wanna be that guy but.... why does it matter? You should be playing to have fun and find challenging opponents. If you are being challenged in whatever league you're in I don't see why it should matter. Example: OP was masters but is in diamond now. If OP still faces challenging diamond/masters opponents I don't see why it matters if hes in diamond. They should just have an invisible MMR with no leagues so people stop talking about them IMO. The main problem here is that matchmaking results are often quite bad. This is due that wildly different skilled players often share similar MMR. Even if the matchmaker is technically working fine, it thinks that players who have same MMR are equally skilled. For example player A is at the bottom border of diamond league. He goes inactive for 4 weeks. Now his MMR decays into high gold range. Player B on the other hand is a solid high gold range player. But now the matchmaker considers both equally skilled and if they are matched, the player A wins most of the time even if he is bit rusty. | ||
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Salient
United States876 Posts
On April 25 2014 00:38 -stOpSKY- wrote: I don't wanna be that guy but.... why does it matter? You should be playing to have fun and find challenging opponents. If you are being challenged in whatever league you're in I don't see why it should matter. Example: OP was masters but is in diamond now. If OP still faces challenging diamond/masters opponents I don't see why it matters if hes in diamond. They should just have an invisible MMR with no leagues so people stop talking about them IMO. People care about their league placement because it is a tangible badge by which they evaluate their skill level. It's the same reason that people care about their chess Elo. What Blizzard should do is simply display The player's MMR, eliminate or radically change MMR decay, eliminate leagues, and eliminate seasons. MMR decay really destroys rated team games. You might have 10 different 2x2 partners that you occasionally play with. Those teams can easily suffer repeat MMR decay penalites if you play a few games a month (and thus fall all the way to bronze at the start of the next season). It's just silly. | ||
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