EPTNaNiwa 1 hour interview post-IEM - Page 3
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karfussen
Poland55 Posts
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aka_star
United Kingdom1546 Posts
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Sabu113
United States11112 Posts
On March 22 2014 07:13 Noocta wrote: You know, Esport has a whole has made me very puzzled about Korean culture. That country just seem to have a lot of problems. Different culture, different values and a bit of a chip on the shoulder relative to China and Japan. Remarkable how they've developed in the past 50 years. Interesting Interview. Only 1/3 through need to take a break heh. If he had a little more charisma or social sense could have made a good focus for a documentary. | ||
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Ammanas
Slovakia2166 Posts
On March 22 2014 07:44 Darkhorse wrote: Kinda think both of these guys burned themselves with IEM. For those wondering what the "racist" comment about Thorin was about, http://www.esportsheaven.com/news/64245/thorin-from-unfiltered-to-unemployed. Judge the comments for yourself I guess I dunno where I stand on them. Funny thing is, most of what he said is actually true. I don't see how anyone in Poland can be offended by those comments, it's true. And it's true for them, it's true for my country (Slovakia), it's true for Czech Republic, Ukraine, all the ex-Soviet Union states. Poland is probably the most developed out of all of them, but we all still have A LOT to catch up to (and also there is a lot of what just can stay in the west and shouldn't ever come). | ||
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ThePlagueJG
Sweden1010 Posts
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Ravomat
Germany427 Posts
On March 22 2014 08:31 MaTRiX[SiN] wrote: Listened to it again, he said that he and sase played 10 custom games with the startale members in 1 year but he also said "considering the amount of practice we did in the later stages", so it sounds like something happened that made them not want to help him anymore? Was it after he made it into the code s that they didnt want to help him practice? I think it's rather that Naniwa and sase didn't want to practice with the koreans. Naniwa said something about practicing with Polt for his match against MVP where MVP pretty much blind counters him. He believes it's a possibility that his replays got shared with his opponents more than once. | ||
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Cheren
United States2911 Posts
On March 22 2014 08:52 Ammanas wrote: Funny thing is, most of what he said is actually true. I don't see how anyone in Poland can be offended by those comments, it's true. And it's true for them, it's true for my country (Slovakia), it's true for Czech Republic, Ukraine, all the ex-Soviet Union states. Poland is probably the most developed out of all of them, but we all still have A LOT to catch up to (and also there is a lot of what just can stay in the west and shouldn't ever come). “Put it this way, it’s another place also where there’s constantly news stories where at their football games they have straight up racism aimed at all black players, with the whole crowd like chanting stuff or throwing banana peels. That happened like 50 years ago in the developed European countries - that shit happens, like, now in Poland.” It's disappointing that someone who calls out actual racism gets called a racist. | ||
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SoSexy
Italy3725 Posts
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playa
United States1284 Posts
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Arghmyliver
United States1081 Posts
On March 22 2014 07:44 Darkhorse wrote: Kinda think both of these guys burned themselves with IEM. For those wondering what the "racist" comment about Thorin was about, http://www.esportsheaven.com/news/64245/thorin-from-unfiltered-to-unemployed. Judge the comments for yourself I guess I dunno where I stand on them. Forgive me - I have no context - but from the quotes in this article it sounds more like he was calling into question the infrastructure of Poland as a whole rather than hating on the Polish as a race? As evidenced by the "Like, the second they opened that up everyone in Poland was just like “Cool, let’s get the fuck out of Poland” and they just went to the next countries." comment. He's not saying Poles are inferior - he's saying they for some reason are anxious to leave their home country and it's probably not just for a change of scenery. This is actually true too - if you look at immigration statistics in other European countries (e.g. Norway) Polish immigration is like super high (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norway#Immigration) - and it's definitely not the same as saying that other Europeans are superior to Polish, or that Polish people are inferior. I don't think remarking on the infrastructure or world status of a country is the same as racism. A lot of African countries are dirt poor - its a sad truth. Does that meant the inhabitants are worse than other humans? Obviously not. Does that mean ALL African countries are dirt poor? Certainly not. There is nothing to be gained though by ignoring world problems (poverty in Africa, corruption in America, etc). These problems are not necessarily indicative of the entire population of those countries - that is to say, not all US politicians are in the pocket of corporate interests, but a huge number are - but stepping around them for the sake of perceived "racism" is not going to help those inhabitants. There is a huge difference between a factual statement and racism. Populations which have historically lived at high altitudes are in fact physically better at oxygenation than other populations. Does that mean Tibetans are superior to Louisianans? Well actually in that specific physical aspect, yes, but in a general sense, absolutely not. These differences/adaptations are what make the Human population and indeed life in general so goddamned awesome. Saying that a Louisianan is going to have serious problems compared to a native Tibetan if they are both placed without preparation on the summit of an incredibly high mountain is not racist, its a factual statement. Saying that Louisianans are inferior to Tibetans in general is a racist statement. Similarly, stating that Poland is having problems as a country is not the same as saying that Polish people are problems. Saying that all Polish people are racist is inherently racist, saying that Poland has a problem with institutional racism is not. Humans are great! <3 Argh Edit: My open Wiki tabs after writing this - for those who are interested; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-altitude_adaptation_in_humans#Physiological_basis http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louisiana (For the Demonym) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism Additional note - I used Louisiana as a contrast to high-altitude populations as a good deal of the geography is at or below sea-level. A good European equivalent might be the Netherlands. If anyone knows additional areas of the world where the geography is similar, I would be interested to know. | ||
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LightSpectra
United States3546 Posts
Best wishes to you Naniwa <3 | ||
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t e a C h e r
Canada151 Posts
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aZealot
New Zealand5447 Posts
Good luck to you, Naniwa. Go well. | ||
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leova
266 Posts
On March 22 2014 09:38 t e a C h e r wrote: Finally saw what Thorin said, and I don't see how the Pols saw this as racism. calling somebody backwards, racist, undeveloped, their country sh*t and their citizens dying to leave....yeah, totally not racist or at all discriminatory /sarcasm That said, the actual interview NOT touching on his IEM disrespectful garbage "play" is, in itself, extremely misleading and unwelcome. Junk thread with a junk link to a junk interview between 2 junk esports figures  | ||
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Undead1993
Germany17651 Posts
a very dedicated personality. i hope he comes back one day and gives sc2 another try. the foreign sc2 world needs people like these. was interesting to get to know how koreans think about foreigners and how they interact or rather not interact with them. all in all a great interview, a lot of insightful content. | ||
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SpikeStarcraft
Germany2095 Posts
On March 22 2014 09:38 t e a C h e r wrote: Finally saw what Thorin said, and I don't see how the Pols saw this as racism. "Esports is filling that essential hole of being polish" is a pretty harsh thing to say to a country that withstood the combined effort of the sowjet union and the Third Reich to destroy Poland's existence as a country. He makes it sound like you would be less of a person because you're polish. I think thats where he crossed the line to racism. The rest is probably true (never been to poland) but he presented it in such a condescending manner that i can understand that IEM didnt want to have him at the analysis desk for cs go at Katowice in front of a huge polish crowd which he just insulted a couple days before. You're free to behave like a douche but then you shouldnt be surprised when people dont want to hang out with you anymore. EDIT: just realized that this is a conversation between 2 people that just lost a job. | ||
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Fhiz
361 Posts
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Penev
28536 Posts
On March 22 2014 08:57 Cheren wrote: It's disappointing that someone who calls out actual racism gets called a racist. It got confusing when racism stopped being only about ethnicity. On topic: Thorin says some thing though that are at the very least generalizing about the Polish. And to say such things before going to a tournament in Poland is just very stupid. | ||
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TR
2320 Posts
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Chaosu
Poland404 Posts
On March 22 2014 08:57 Cheren wrote: It's disappointing that someone who calls out actual racism gets called a racist. Yeah I'm sure we should praise him as our hero who was brave enough to CALL OUT ACTUAL RACISM. Not! The racist in football was last brought up before EURO 2012 (football championships which took place in Poland & Ukraine) and it was brought up not as a recent accident but just a warning for public (it was western media complaining at thing that turned out to be thing of the past). FYI nothing like that happend during the championships. | ||
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