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Gullis
Sweden740 Posts
On January 15 2014 23:18 plgElwood wrote: I guess Starbow´s success will depend on the Ladder. It has to be good, otherwise players wont accept it. Pretty much this, I would only play SB if there where some kind of matchmaking system. For now it is just so much easier to find an equally skilled opponent in sc2. | ||
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Pirfiktshon
United States1072 Posts
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Grumbels
Netherlands7032 Posts
On January 15 2014 23:38 Pirfiktshon wrote: Thats kinda the point though because of Lurkers and Defiler you needed irrad to even be able to kill them because the impervious Dark swarm otherwise it would always be a uphill battle for Terran no matter the situation so yo uhave to build scourge and use plague on sci vessels and use muta or Hydra to snipe depending if you are plyaing Hydra / Lurker or Muta ling into ultra ling defiler scourge play...... It's okay at first, but in late-game scenarios where the terran has 7+ vessels it just shuts down every zerg tech unit. | ||
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Pirfiktshon
United States1072 Posts
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quebecman77
Canada133 Posts
was sure to never play sc2 again, fucking great mode !!! better that sc2, blizzard should just support it and switch to this mod !! make ladder ect !! | ||
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Squat
Sweden7978 Posts
On January 15 2014 23:51 Pirfiktshon wrote: I wasn't a Pro in BW but I've played A- / A players in TvZ every good Z player I've played always made it a point to snipe sci vessels...... If you don't you will get rekt..... LOL just the same that If I don't Irrad your Defiler / Lurker or Guardian / muta i will get rekt.... LOL It was different in BW though, specifically because smartcast makes this particular spell so devastating in SB. This is one of those examples where porting a BW ability directly into the SC2 engine doesn't really work. I'm worried plague and Dark Swarm could be problematic also once the gameplay is further refined. Right now, Irradiate seems like something that could be considered a bit broken. Which of course is perfectly fine, that's why we have a beta to begin with. As cool as some of the BW spells are, we won't be able to port all of them in as they are, the SC2 UI just makes some of them too strong. | ||
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Hider
Denmark9448 Posts
This is one of those examples of porting a BW ability directly into the SC2 doesn't really work. In Broadwar it did 250 total damage. In Sbow it is 190. So it is a bit nerfed probably, but I agree that smartcast outweights that disadvantage. | ||
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sage_francis
France1823 Posts
On January 15 2014 23:47 Grumbels wrote: It's okay at first, but in late-game scenarios where the terran has 7+ vessels it just shuts down every zerg tech unit. Use plague, scourges and mutas vs vessels...just like we did in BW.... | ||
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awesomoecalypse
United States2235 Posts
Still, impressive how much work went into it, and I hope it does well--any interest in the game is good for the scene overall imo. | ||
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Code
Canada634 Posts
You probably dont want to nerf the damage too much cuz it needs to be able to kill lurkers and damage ultras, etc.. but the casting time, casting range, energy cost, or vessel speed/acceleration can all be adjusted so its not simply "spam irrad on good units and fly away" and its more of a risk to take out high profile targets. Something that rewards better control by the T player. | ||
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dani`
Netherlands2402 Posts
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c0se
Germany148 Posts
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Scorch
Austria3371 Posts
On January 16 2014 00:44 c0se wrote: Are spidermines supposed to be that bad? They get killed by dragoons before launching even without detection on the protoss side. Yeah they're kinda weird. However, to make up for it, they also have a manual ability to fire immediately without having to unburrow. | ||
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DjayEl
France252 Posts
this I think. The reason I play Protoss (and Blue in MtG, and Mage in WoW, and other similar races/classes in other games) is that my favorite aspect of competitive games is the ability to dictate or outright control what my opponent can do. Then you should play Zerg, as in MtG blue control decks were all about containing threats while securing the card advantage. Aggro decks were those which would "force" response of the opponents, Protoss working much more like an aggro-lock/disrupt deck (like TnT with Stax elements, referring to type 1 decks, with hints of Black Suicide if you decide to all-in). Just sayin  About Starbow, well I didn't play it, but... why assume it would be a better SC2 just because the fundamentals are different, as nobody knows yet what laws would emerge from them ? I mean, saying reaver drops seem awesome and part of a viable SB strategy is like saying "hey, in SC2 you can do baneling drops and its COOL!", while we all know that in the real world the metagame has ruled out these very tactic for some specific (and much unpredictable) reasons. If even dudes from the project say ZvT is currently better in HotS as a design thing (non-balance wise), how would it become better in SB after balancing stuff ? Even if it becomes somehow 10% more balanced than in hots (which I doubt about much), why would it be more dynamic or challenging or compelling or fun ? Just because it features BW units with oudated mechanics? Don't want to harm the good feelings going on about this project though. I think it's great initiative. But here I give my honest opinion as a player, for what it's worth: SB and BW in general might have been a staple RTS once, but fact is SC2 has improved a lot on one aspect: fun. One may not agree and it's fine, and SC2 is far from perfect, but we have 3 different races instead of having almost 1 race with 3 different set of skins and very similar mechanics. You can argue all day long against warp in mechanics and mass larvae and FF, but at the end of the day you have 3 very different races with super fun gameplays, with an interesting paradigm of high tech/high predictability versus low tech/high versatility, resulting in thrilling asymetrical, yet somehow balanced matchups. But such a project is a good thing. Many will learn how hard it actually is to design a game, and why its mainly done by game designers (who get paid for it) instead of players. The latter are not the former for a reason, one of them being that once the game becomes quite figured out and the balance/design issues arise, the first would probably be the only ones who will accept to spend 95% of their time during many years dealing with the endless complaints of a partial community, releasing tiny patches and working their ass of to maintain decent PR and support for their game. Yet if SB succeeds, I wouldn't be more happy as I will get an ever better RTS that I do know. | ||
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Tefel
Poland67 Posts
I will stream ESL STARBOW cup in 30 minutes! https://twitter.com/dignitasTefel/status/423463374584676352/photo/1 http://twitch.tv/Tefel | ||
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Squat
Sweden7978 Posts
As for Sc2 being fun, opinions, rectums and all that. | ||
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awesomoecalypse
United States2235 Posts
Then you should play Zerg, as in MtG blue control decks were all about containing threats while securing the card advantage. Aggro decks were those which would "force" response of the opponents, Protoss working much more like an aggro-lock/disrupt deck (like TnT with Stax elements, referring to type 1 decks, with hints of Black Suicide if you decide to all-in). I disagree. The decks built around milling the opponent while stopping them from playing anything, or decks that shut down their creatures while you ping them to death with otherwise measly flyers and whatnot, strike me as very protossy, in that basically your win is predicated on stopping the opponent from doing almost anything he wants to do, rather than engaging in direct engagements and trying to win with better creatures. OTOH, I haven't played MtG in several years, so maybe that playstyle isn't as prevalent as it once was. A card like Stasis, for example (http://gatherer.wizards.com/pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=3948), strikes me as very Protossy. Expend mana to keep your opponent helpless to do anything with any of their creatures, buying you time to whittle them down with spells or mill them out entirely. Thats a very similar design philosophy to a spell like Forcefield. | ||
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Butterednuts
United States859 Posts
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shivver
United States232 Posts
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/11224202871?page=1 LOL I mean that forum has the SH*TTIEST community I have ever seen. There's no doubting where sc2 is headed and despite all that they still resist and insist that david kim and dustin browder is going to lead them to the promised land fuking delusional fanboys User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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TimENT
United States1425 Posts
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