EPT
Starbow - Page 28
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WombaT
Northern Ireland26532 Posts
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Destructicon
4713 Posts
On January 14 2014 10:08 Bagi wrote: I'd say at first glance the reaper, banshee, dropship and viking upgrades are all kinda weird and unnecessary. These are not units you build in great numbers, rather balance them around not needing upgrades at all. Why are there so damn many range upgrades? Also I dont think every caster needs to have 2 researchable spells + a useless energy upgrade just because BW did it. Overall I just think there are a little too many ideas and gimmicks in the current state of starbow (manually detonating mines, looking at you). Its still an amazing mod though, and with some good polish it could very well challenge SC2 or at least Blizzards vision of where the game should be going. I think you underestimate the amount of work it takes to create an RTS game from scratch... I think the range upgrades for a lot of units is to allow them to skirmish early game without one clearly dominating the other, thus facilitating some more dynamic early games. Later thought is ok for Dragoons to get + 2 range because they are a protoss unit and they are supposed to be the strongest toss ground unit all around. In comparison marines and marauders only get +1 range because, otherwise in conjunction with stim they might be too strong, also doesn't make sense that terran bio would have range equal to that of protoss. Toss are slow, strong and long range, terran are nimble, fragile but lower range (if playing bio). | ||
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Alacast
United States205 Posts
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Destructicon
4713 Posts
On January 14 2014 10:37 Alacast wrote: Am I crazy, or are most dps values significantly lower in BoW than SC2? I think the units have comparable damage but slower attack speed, which does indeed result in less DPS. This + tendency of units in Starbow to spread out a bit, is there to offset the extreme killing efficiency of the SC2 engine, allows more time to micro and for the better player to distinguish himself via micro and army control, and its less punishing if you get caught out of position, since you won't lose everything at once. | ||
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Alacast
United States205 Posts
On January 14 2014 10:41 Destructicon wrote: I think the units have comparable damage but slower attack speed, which does indeed result in less DPS. This + tendency of units in Starbow to spread out a bit, is there to offset the extreme killing efficiency of the SC2 engine, allows more time to micro and for the better player to distinguish himself via micro and army control. Thank you -- in watching a few of these Axiom videos over the last few days, that was a very strong impression. I have always felt changing the damage values in SC2 alone would fix a lot of the perceived problems. | ||
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superpanda27
111 Posts
On January 14 2014 10:43 Alacast wrote: Thank you -- in watching a few of these Axiom videos over the last few days, that was a very strong impression. I have always felt changing the damage values in SC2 alone would fix a lot of the perceived problems. Except for the inherent problems that Protoss design has like early warpgates (as opposed to Starbow pushing it to tier 3) and the map maker's nightmare: forcefields. | ||
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Ben...
Canada3485 Posts
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GizmoPT
Portugal3040 Posts
On January 14 2014 11:06 Ben... wrote: Okay, this is pretty great. I was skeptical but I have been watching Crank and it has been significantly more interesting to watch than most SC2 streams have been lately. after like 3 years its normal | ||
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Bareleon
371 Posts
I was toss: I liked doing rever drops. I liked doing recall. I even had a warp prism go ahead of my arbitur cause he had turrets up, so hopefully the arbiture will live to recall units in and it did. Scarabs dont dmg my own buildings when I attack it? I had to destroy my own pylon but scarabs wasnt doing dmg to it, Dragoons dont attack like BW Dragoons. Scouts AA seem a bit strong lol. carriers still take forever to build. you kept the nerf blizz did to the pylon radius? Toss still feels a-move, maybe a little less and a little more multi-tasking. | ||
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Vindicare605
United States16121 Posts
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Xiphos
Canada7507 Posts
On January 14 2014 10:47 superpanda27 wrote: Except for the inherent problems that Protoss design has like early warpgates (as opposed to Starbow pushing it to tier 3) and the map maker's nightmare: forcefields. Forcefields are those blocks that traps unit inside am I right? if that were the case, I actually like them. They just have to made it counter-able by clicking on it to destroy or at least give it a certain HP to halt the effect, I could see many brilliant maneuvers around that ability. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On January 14 2014 11:35 Xiphos wrote: Forcefields are those blocks that traps unit inside am I right? if that were the case, I actually like them. They just have to made it counter-able by clicking on it to destroy or at least give it a certain HP to halt the effect, I could see many brilliant maneuvers around that ability. I always thought it would be kinda nice if you couldnt overlap them, or if they overlap the "overlapped" part would disappear. Or maybe just add some sort of delay to them, i think there are many things you could do to make them more "exciting" | ||
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SoleSteeler
Canada5459 Posts
I hope this mod does gain more genuine popularity, and not just "fuck blizz sc2 sux" kinda hype. | ||
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Alacast
United States205 Posts
On January 14 2014 10:47 superpanda27 wrote: Except for the inherent problems that Protoss design has like early warpgates (as opposed to Starbow pushing it to tier 3) and the map maker's nightmare: forcefields. I don't think FF or WG have been proven to be objectively bad. Some people don't like them, I understand, but they are unique and original mechanics. | ||
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Swisslink
2954 Posts
On January 14 2014 11:50 Alacast wrote: I don't think FF or WG have been proven to be objectively bad. Some people don't like them, I understand, but they are unique and original mechanics. ... which make balancing REALLY hard and mapdesign very one-dimensional. | ||
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Parcelleus
Australia1662 Posts
-Vultures look way overpowered. -Just massing of dragoons , I didnt like it at all -Unit compositions were not varied and were mainly one or 2 units -Much prefer the units and micro of sc2 to starbow -Feels like if you are diehard BW fan you may like this mod -Overall I much prefer SC2 HOTS , oh well I had a look | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland26532 Posts
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CannonsNCarriers
United States638 Posts
On January 14 2014 11:59 Parcelleus wrote: I checked out the Romsom vs Dirtybag (PvT). -Vultures look way overpowered. -Just massing of dragoons , I didnt like it at all -Unit compositions were not varied and were mainly one or 2 units -Much prefer the units and micro of sc2 to starbow -Feels like if you are diehard BW fan you may like this mod -Overall I much prefer SC2 HOTS , oh well I had a look As it stands, Dragoons supply efficient and do well against everything besides siege-mode tanks. If they go bio, make goons + zealots. If they go mech, you need goons to deal with vultures. If they go air for some reason, goons are the best ground to air. The Starbow protoss army is Goons with a sprinkling of support. | ||
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mcleod
Canada350 Posts
i agree with some other peoples post about there being to many upgrades/gimmicks. the orbital command should be looked at. I dont agree with terran having chrono boost or the scv drop. it just seems unnecessary. also the fusion core tech tree is weird. | ||
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Xiphos
Canada7507 Posts
On January 14 2014 11:59 Parcelleus wrote: I checked out the Romsom vs Dirtybag (PvT). -Vultures look way overpowered. -Just massing of dragoons , I didnt like it at all -Unit compositions were not varied and were mainly one or 2 units -Much prefer the units and micro of sc2 to starbow -Feels like if you are diehard BW fan you may like this mod -Overall I much prefer SC2 HOTS , oh well I had a look - Vultures are only OP if you can't figure out how to defend them: Always wall-in properly, build Scourges if you are Zerg since you will most likely have Spire anyways. If you are P, make sure you have Goons on the outskirt of the T's base to catch Dropship and generally be active with your goons. - Its a matter of style, generally speaking Goons are only build as "meatshield" for Zealot to enter the fray if you are planning on Zealot/Goon combo. - 1 or 2 units? Well make some spell casters. - That's because you can have more flexibility in SB as you can keep formation thus emulating more of realistic warfare style. - No, majority of SC2 fans' posting seems to suggest otherwise. - Well then you are the minority, but at least you tried  | ||
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