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On December 02 2013 08:26 Valiver wrote:
Wow any time any female gamer/community member gets any sort of recognition this debate comes up. MaddeLisk got this sponsorship because a sponsorship is a kind of investment. XMG and all other brands want to get their names out there and people with character and who do things for the community and have good viewer numbers get sponsored. That's just how it goes. If people watch her stream because she is a female so be it, who cares? People watch, so she gets sponsored. It doesn't have to be more complicated than that.
It happens because sexism is a very political topic. You should learn to get used to it, although it would be nice if people didn't get too anal about it.
On December 02 2013 07:58 HaRuHi wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2013 06:47 hansonslee wrote:On December 02 2013 06:25 HaRuHi wrote:On December 02 2013 06:13 hansonslee wrote:On December 02 2013 06:01 NbSky wrote:On December 02 2013 03:53 Pierrot wrote:On December 02 2013 03:50 NbSky wrote:
never hurts to sponsor a good looking girl haha, imagine how many people replayed the clip just to see those legs and smile haha You are fucking disgusting. More importantly though, congratulations MaddeLisk! =) You must not have hit puberty yet lol To degrade a woman like that is unacceptable. Treat the woman for the work she does not how she looks. If I remember correctly, Maddelisk has been in the scene for a very long time, so she deserve some respect. Well, we don`t see Grubby wearing skin tight trousers and an extra shot of his legs when promoting benq, do we? And I am not sure that you remember correctly, she is a math student no? She tried some tourneys and did not spectacular and they are easily a 100 people who did more for the community or are better players, or play for longer, but they are male. But when total Buiscuit makes a team to promote them people call them faceless koreans. It is a marketing descision for xmg. I am happy for maddelisk, good for her, but she is there because she has marketing value, and she got it because she is a mediocre female player, while even great male players don`t get personal sponsor ships, so yeah, I can see why people get frustrated when it becomes apparent that it is not a competition about skills but looks for most parts. Yeah, that's a very good point. I just think it's nice that women do get more exposure in the gaming world. I remember when Aphrodite was in the GSTL invitational, some people were complaining how there were other players who deserved to be on that spot. I know your school of thought is that women should be evaluated on the same standard as men, which is valid in certain scenarios (such as becoming a firefighter). For me, I think we should add a little bit more leeway for women in a male-dominated world, which can be disagreeable to some. When the playing field is leveled, then I believe we should have men and women on the same standard. Hope you can be understanding, if not agreeable, of my views. I support women's rights, but I am not that hyper-feminist, which has been dominant lately. That actually is not my school of thought, but I found it ridiculuos that people call someone disgusting in this thread because they complement her on her legs and I just wanted to spill some seeds that might sproud common sense. My school of thought is: we are a species with 2 different genders, they posess a specialized physiology for different tasks, down to the way our brains are wired. So, great Legs Maddelisk and best of Luck in Sc2. I think the playing field is what it is, life is not fair and it is good for most of us that it isn`t. Most men surely can`t score a sponsorship because of their looks (except for snute/bisu ofcourse), but the majority of girls don`t get exposure to competitive gaming and have more social pressure to socialise. For me that is ok, I enjoy being part of this two gendered species, I sometimes don`t like that sc2 is too much about marketing, sure. I also don`t like it when people get all mad because I don`t look a girl into the personality first and when those people want to make us something we aren`t, a uni-gender species.
Yeah, I hear ya, and I definitely agree that there is nothing wrong with being a two gender species (unless we can to be more politically correct and consider transgender as the third gender).
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Good for her. 
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In between the breast shots, and the skin tight legs shots, that wink and smile, and the hair flipping, did anybody notice that she plays hearthstone like a zerg. 4sd44sdddd4sd44sddd4sdd4sdsdddddd
That droning apm.
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God, so much QQ. She has charisma and is good looking, why must there always be this 'she doesn't deserve this', 'don't treat her different because she's a woman' etc...
I'm a protoss player and one of the streams that I watch most is destiny, not because he's good, but because he's funny and has a lot of charisma. If it wouldn't be for his bad pr bm sometimes, he would probably get sponsorship's as well, even if he is far from being the best.
Just be happy for Maddelisk, seriously. Some people...
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You could say that this sponsorship is a bit sexist in itself, because there are like a thousand sc2 gamers that are better than her but the difference is only male/female. Actually that's the exact definition of sexism. But whatever, I don't care. Still happy for her, congratz!
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On December 02 2013 08:37 SolidSMD wrote:
God, so much QQ. She has charisma and is good looking, why must there always be this 'she doesn't deserve this', 'don't treat her different because she's a woman' etc...
I'm a protoss player and one of the streams that I watch most is destiny, not because he's good, but because he's funny and has a lot of charisma. If it wouldn't be for his bad pr bm sometimes, he would probably get sponsorship's as well, even if he is far from being the best.
Just be happy for Maddelisk, seriously. Some people...
You may want to support someone based on their entertainment or marketability factor, which is a choice totally up to you, and XMG as we have seen here. However, I would much rather opt to improving the living for the people this competitive scene is built upon, namely, the 'real' competitors. I could say a lot more but I'll stop myself at that.
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On December 02 2013 06:25 HaRuHi wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2013 06:13 hansonslee wrote:On December 02 2013 06:01 NbSky wrote:On December 02 2013 03:53 Pierrot wrote:On December 02 2013 03:50 NbSky wrote:
never hurts to sponsor a good looking girl haha, imagine how many people replayed the clip just to see those legs and smile haha You are fucking disgusting. More importantly though, congratulations MaddeLisk! =) You must not have hit puberty yet lol To degrade a woman like that is unacceptable. Treat the woman for the work she does not how she looks. If I remember correctly, Maddelisk has been in the scene for a very long time, so she deserve some respect. Well, we don`t see Grubby wearing skin tight trousers and an extra shot of his legs when promoting benq, do we? And I am not sure that you remember correctly, she is a math student no? She tried some tourneys and did not spectacular and they are easily a 100 people who did more for the community or are better players, or play for longer, but they are male. But when total Buiscuit makes a team to promote them people call them faceless koreans. It is a marketing descision for xmg. I am happy for maddelisk, good for her, but she is there because she has marketing value, and she got it because she is a mediocre female player, while even great male players don`t get personal sponsor ships, so yeah, I can see why people get frustrated when it becomes apparent that it is not a competition about skills but looks for most parts.
so is it frustrating that husky is a huge hit in the community as a diamond protoss who casts games spouting silly catchphrases? should he be denied money, pay, sponsorships etc. because his popularity "isn't about the skill"? if people are interested in a player, that player will be profitable, and there's absolutely nothing "unfair" about that. what difference does it make if they're 90% caster and 10% player like husky or 100% player or 50% player and 50% community leader or whatever? incontrol is popular as a bottom tier pro gamer but a top tier host and personality. lot of people consider innovation "boring" even though he's a god tier player, which reduces his marketablility because people aren't as interested in him as they are in other players. is this "unfair"? no. it's audience preference.
here are the reasons i'm interested in a female masters player more than some no name male grandmaster player:
there are few women in the scene not because women are inherently bad at starcraft, but because fewer women identify with esports/gaming as something they want to involve themselves in. if a masters female player gets a sponsorship and becomes visible to a lot of girls who may not have otherwise been interested, that increases the community, increases the skill pool, and makes progress away from the sexist cesspit that is gaming culture. if i were a woman, i wouldn't want to fight to involve myself in a community that makes me feel unwelcome and doesn't take me seriously. why should women be fighting to make it into a scene that doesn't welcome them? WE should be fighting to INVITE them so the game grows and becomes a more civilized community
On December 02 2013 08:49 Caladan wrote:You could say that this sponsorship is a bit sexist in itself, because there are like a thousand sc2 gamers that are better than her but the difference is only male/female. Actually that's the exact definition of sexism. But whatever, I don't care. Still happy for her, congratz!
there are fewer women BECAUSE of sexism, making efforts to introduce women is not sexist, it's counteracting the sexism that's already tehre.
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On December 02 2013 08:55 -Kyo- wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2013 08:37 SolidSMD wrote:
God, so much QQ. She has charisma and is good looking, why must there always be this 'she doesn't deserve this', 'don't treat her different because she's a woman' etc...
I'm a protoss player and one of the streams that I watch most is destiny, not because he's good, but because he's funny and has a lot of charisma. If it wouldn't be for his bad pr bm sometimes, he would probably get sponsorship's as well, even if he is far from being the best.
Just be happy for Maddelisk, seriously. Some people... You may want to support someone based on their entertainment or marketability factor, which is a choice totally up to you, and XMG as we have seen here. However, I would much rather opt to improving the living for the people this competitive scene is built upon, namely, the 'real' competitors. I could say a lot more but I'll stop myself at that.
you realize of course that without the entertainment and community side of the game, there won't BE a scene, so the competitive pool won't matter because it won't exist? SC2 isn't just about flicking your fingers around for most people, it's about running jokes, tasteless and artosis, arguments over korean invasions, show matches, balance whining, etc. etc. etc. people come to the community to have a good time, we're not just a bunch of indigo children fighting to raise our APMs over 9000
yes, obviously there are two sides to the coin and people differ in what they want out of the scene. but it seems ridiculous for you to just handwave away the idea of anyone ever succeeding without being the absolute best player in the world who hasn't been sponsored yet.
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Yeah, I hear ya, and I definitely agree that there is nothing wrong with being a two gender species (unless we can to be more politically correct and consider transgender as the third gender).
Politically correct? I highly doubt that a trans person would want to be separately labeled aside from the male and female genders, the whole point is to become the opposite gender for whatever reasons they have and to associate with it. Not to be outcast and labeled as different.
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Waise, I think you might have overlooked how the conversation began ... and concluded. 
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A beautiful and dedicated sponsor for a beautiful and dedicated gamer girl =) Grats!
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Very happy for her. She was at Dreamhack, by the way, saw her in interviews there on the Swedish TV.
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On December 02 2013 09:02 Waise wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2013 08:55 -Kyo- wrote:On December 02 2013 08:37 SolidSMD wrote:
God, so much QQ. She has charisma and is good looking, why must there always be this 'she doesn't deserve this', 'don't treat her different because she's a woman' etc...
I'm a protoss player and one of the streams that I watch most is destiny, not because he's good, but because he's funny and has a lot of charisma. If it wouldn't be for his bad pr bm sometimes, he would probably get sponsorship's as well, even if he is far from being the best.
Just be happy for Maddelisk, seriously. Some people... You may want to support someone based on their entertainment or marketability factor, which is a choice totally up to you, and XMG as we have seen here. However, I would much rather opt to improving the living for the people this competitive scene is built upon, namely, the 'real' competitors. I could say a lot more but I'll stop myself at that. you realize of course that without the entertainment and community side of the game, there won't BE a scene, so the competitive pool won't matter because it won't exist? SC2 isn't just about flicking your fingers around for most people, it's about running jokes, tasteless and artosis, arguments over korean invasions, show matches, balance whining, etc. etc. etc. people come to the community to have a good time, we're not just a bunch of indigo children fighting to raise our APMs over 9000 yes, obviously there are two sides to the coin and people differ in what they want out of the scene. but it seems ridiculous for you to just handwave away the idea of anyone ever succeeding without being the absolute best player in the world who hasn't been sponsored yet.
Did you read my post for what it contained? Apparently not, because I never waved away anything about the entertainment factor in the scene. I simply said I would first and foremost provide to the players rather than those who entertain because I see greater benefits for the scene. I readily admitted that companies like XMG have their own goals in the first sentence. If you cannot reply to what someone has posted why bother typing two hilariously misguided paragraphs?
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So a girl for playing SC2 and we are doing the whole "girls vs 'real competitive games(whatever the fuck that is)' thing, right? I wonder how many more times this needs to happen before no one cares?
Good for her, we need more girls in the scene and playing the game. Girls are dope. You heard it here first.
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On December 02 2013 09:19 Plansix wrote:
Girls are dope. You heard it here first.
I think it's not the first time I heard about it, I may be wrong though
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meh I don't like teams recruiting girls to gain exposure/whatever get from this, but it's no reason to dislike her
gl =)
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Totally awesome! MaddeLisk is wonderful player and person! Had the pleasure of facing her once on the ladder ! =)
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On December 02 2013 09:13 -Kyo- wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2013 09:02 Waise wrote:On December 02 2013 08:55 -Kyo- wrote:On December 02 2013 08:37 SolidSMD wrote:
God, so much QQ. She has charisma and is good looking, why must there always be this 'she doesn't deserve this', 'don't treat her different because she's a woman' etc...
I'm a protoss player and one of the streams that I watch most is destiny, not because he's good, but because he's funny and has a lot of charisma. If it wouldn't be for his bad pr bm sometimes, he would probably get sponsorship's as well, even if he is far from being the best.
Just be happy for Maddelisk, seriously. Some people... You may want to support someone based on their entertainment or marketability factor, which is a choice totally up to you, and XMG as we have seen here. However, I would much rather opt to improving the living for the people this competitive scene is built upon, namely, the 'real' competitors. I could say a lot more but I'll stop myself at that. you realize of course that without the entertainment and community side of the game, there won't BE a scene, so the competitive pool won't matter because it won't exist? SC2 isn't just about flicking your fingers around for most people, it's about running jokes, tasteless and artosis, arguments over korean invasions, show matches, balance whining, etc. etc. etc. people come to the community to have a good time, we're not just a bunch of indigo children fighting to raise our APMs over 9000 yes, obviously there are two sides to the coin and people differ in what they want out of the scene. but it seems ridiculous for you to just handwave away the idea of anyone ever succeeding without being the absolute best player in the world who hasn't been sponsored yet. Did you read my post for what it contained? Apparently not, because I never waved away anything about the entertainment factor in the scene. I simply said I would first and foremost provide to the players rather than those who entertain because I see greater benefits for the scene. I readily admitted that companies like XMG have their own goals in the first sentence. If you cannot reply to what someone has posted why bother typing two hilariously misguided paragraphs?
lol, no need to get defensive. not every post is an accusation against you. i was advancing the discussion by adding another thought to the topic.
think you need to relax kid and use your brain before you try to start schoolyard arguments
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Well, that didn't take very long to devolve rofl
w/e congrats Maddelisk, good move by XMG!
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EPT
