EPTWCS America Reflections - 5 Things We Learned - Page 8
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lichter
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
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Incognoto
France10239 Posts
On August 14 2013 16:39 Neonico wrote: I really disagree that WCS America > WCS Europe right now. Just look at the top players of each region (let's say top8), you have the same level in both region for the top players, the main difference comes from the rest of the feild, which is really, really worst in America. And Oz and aLive for example wouldn't make the feild better in Europe as they do in America. And that write up about scarlett being the best foreigner, I'm okay with american fans trying to see the best where they can, but she just acheived her first top4 in a premier tournamement and has only 2 wins in major tournament, one being a WCS national championship. You can hardly match someone like Naniwa in the european scene, even if he actually seems to struggle in the latest stages of the tournaments. WCS AM is much more stacked with good Koreans than WCS EU and Scarlett made it farther in than Naniwa did. For sure Naniwa has a nice list of accomplishments, but as of right now I believe Scarlett is the better player. Better player in SC2 is almost subjective anyway, Innovation is considered #1 and couldn't take one game off of Maru. My 2 cents anyway; ^^ | ||
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Rob-ThePhantom
Australia9 Posts
Changes nothing but would do a better job of describing what the tournament is. There is enough of a 'Pacific' WCS scene to sustain a WCS tournament. There isn't enough of an 'American' scene. | ||
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dcemuser
United States3248 Posts
On August 14 2013 08:47 Inimic wrote: Scarlett won't save the "American" scene? She's Canadian. Just like Huk. Sorry, 'Murica. WCS America is obviously WCS North America, despite the "AM" abbreviation. They invited NA players to play in S1, not just American players. When we're talking EU vs "America", generally people are referencing North America - comparing continent to continent and not country to continent. Korea is the only nation that is good enough to be compared to continents. | ||
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lichter
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
On August 14 2013 17:01 dcemuser wrote: WCS America is obviously WCS North America, despite the "AM" abbreviation. They invited NA players to play in S1, not just American players. When we're talking EU vs "America", generally people are referencing North America - comparing continent to continent and not country to continent. Korea is the only nation that is good enough to be compared to continents. I consider it "Americas". North America, United States of America, South America (continent) | ||
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RandomPlayer
Russian Federation400 Posts
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Penev
28522 Posts
On August 14 2013 17:01 dcemuser wrote: WCS America is obviously WCS North America, despite the "AM" abbreviation. They invited NA players to play in S1, not just American players. When we're talking EU vs "America", generally people are referencing North America - comparing continent to continent and not country to continent. Korea is the only nation that is good enough to be compared to continents. WCS America is WCS North + South America. Maybe they should've called it WCS Americas like the server; Would've been less confusing probably. | ||
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DustbinBieber
France276 Posts
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LeviathanDK
Denmark87 Posts
And the reason why more tune in to WCS EU is ofc because of the time zone, but in terms of players then everyone is equal. It is not a matter of lower skill level with more players at that level. Truth be told it is at a higher level than what NA can present. Except for Scarlett WCS NA has nothing to offer except tons of Koreans that are equal. And not a lot of people want to waste 4 hours watching Sage and Alive stomping 2 americans. Ro16 is where WCS NA becomes okay to watch. WCS NA needs a new direction from their RO16 and forwards. Otherwise the viewing numbers won't change. | ||
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Sissors
1395 Posts
On August 14 2013 09:57 TyrantPotato wrote: we all have our opinions, my opinion causes me to see your post as edited. should we restrict tennis players from entering the US open ?Rol garos? Aus Open ? Wimbleton? only limited number of players from other regions are allowed? we should ban federer,joker and nadal from entering tournaments outside where they live. its only fair! we need to grow our local scenes! no. because that's retarded. why is this mentality existent in the 'esports' community? Yes because Brazil is allowed to enter in the European Championship soccer, amirite? Why is it that people like you only refer to the tournaments that use the same system as you want and act like all others don't exist and only in e-sports there could be 'region locks'? But but, European Championship is between countries and that is different!!1!!!11. No it isn't, but even if it is, then I refer you to the UEFA Championsleague. Look, also only for European countries (+ special cases). But but, those are Europeans and everyone knows they are communists anyway!!1!!!1. Okay, then I refer you with some googlines to the CONCACAF Championes League. Only for clubs from North/Central American and Caribean countries. You can whine what you want as African country, you aren't allowed to enter. No matter how retarded you think that is. So the next problems mentioned here with region lock (I assume here it is locked for place of residence, not birth country, which would be weird. Then either they can for example add Africa to Europe, or let those people decide wherever they want to play when they don't have an own WCS). "The American scene is nothing without the Koreans". No it is nothing with them. It is effectively just code A broadcasted at slightly more convenient times for American viewers. The longer it stays like that, the worse it will get. Sure once in a while a local will do reasonable, but thats not enough. If you now remove the Koreans you can start CPR and get the scene alive again, so people want to watch it. But using the excuse the scene is almost dead isn't a reason let it die comlpetely. "But Polt lives in the US, you also want to ban him?". There is no problem whatsoever with a Polt playing in WCS AM. The problem is being completely overrun by Koreans. Compare it to WCS EU, there is no issue with a few Koreans, it is actually quite nice. So in AM it also doesn't matter if a few Koreans who live in America play in WCS AM. So what to do besides region lock? Then give WCS KR more places for WCS global? Yep sounds reasonable. Similar to many 'real' sports, a good country is allowed to send more atletes. More money for WCS KR? Not saying it should be exactly the same, but I also don't see any reason why they should get more money (from Blizzard). Being a higher level competition is no reason to give them more money. Unfair? Maybe, thats life. But price money in tournaments is not related to how good people are, but to how much money sponsors want to spend on it. And that is only partially related to displayed skill levels. | ||
Olli
Austria24422 Posts
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MasterOfPuppets
Romania6942 Posts
On August 14 2013 18:52 DarkLordOlli wrote: You're optimistic if you think that WCS America is basically Code A if there are no Koreans. It's basically people who could never make it to Code A ever and Scarlett who would win every season What about Jim/MacSed/Sen? Would you really rate Scarlett above all of them constantly? | ||
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NarutO
Germany18839 Posts
On August 14 2013 16:40 Shellshock1122 wrote: Oz and aLive are about on the same level as finale and he just won EU EU is very match up dependant. PvT from Europe would give headache to lots of good players from Korea. That MVP dropped out wasn't a fluke, but Europe did show that their PvT is one of the best there is. Elfi beat TaeJa, MaNa and Socke beat countless Koreans. Its no fluke and has happened before. Also PvP as Europe is fielding tons of good Protoss is also hard. Finale winning doesn't make him superior to anyone participating in the tournament. Especially because all his series were very close. | ||
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Olli
Austria24422 Posts
On August 14 2013 18:56 MasterOfPuppets wrote: What about Jim/MacSed/Sen? Would you really rate Scarlett above all of them constantly? You'd have to have a really liberal interpretation of "America" if they could still participate in a region locked system. If they could participate then no, I'd say all three of them have a good shot. If it's only America like last year then Scarlett would win every season | ||
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NarutO
Germany18839 Posts
On August 14 2013 19:00 DarkLordOlli wrote: You'd have to have a really liberal interpretation of "America" if they could still participate in a region locked system. If they could participate then no, I'd say all three of them have a good shot. If it's only America like last year then Scarlett would win every season Would also be a great global finals if America was to send 5 players... imagine the outcry at the global finals when we have lots of series that are more onesided than ever. No one wants to see it. | ||
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Olli
Austria24422 Posts
On August 14 2013 19:03 NarutO wrote: Would also be a great global finals if America was to send 5 players... imagine the outcry at the global finals when we have lots of series that are more onesided than ever. No one wants to see it. Yes, exactly. That's the exact argument I keep making every single time someone brings up region lock. As long as Blizzard wants the WCS Global Finals to be like a Masters in Tennis for example where only the absolute best players of the season can compete, it cannot and will never happen. Every GSL or OSL would have a stronger lineup than the Global Finals and that just... doesn't make sense. And it'd look exactly like last year. Korea sends players, they dominate the tournament and eventually run into each other. Maybe you get one or two upsets like Idra going wild and taking out Roro or HerO throwing his games against Sen but other than that it'd be pure Korean domination. This way at least it won't be onesided and the quality of the Global Finals is actually good. I mean... HerO vs State today. State is one of the better NA players, he made the finals of Shoutcraft America right? Well, HerO made it look like he accidentally won. | ||
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Sissors
1395 Posts
On August 14 2013 19:00 DarkLordOlli wrote: You'd have to have a really liberal interpretation of "America" if they could still participate in a region locked system. If they could participate then no, I'd say all three of them have a good shot. If it's only America like last year then Scarlett would win every season It would be beyond obvious that people not from Korea, America or Europe can also participate in the WCS. Then you can either just add them to one (for example Africa to Europe), or you leave them free to choose. Lets say the Chinese scene then becomes so back it dominates WCS AM, then you can always add a WCS China. | ||
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Olli
Austria24422 Posts
Whether their goal is something the community wants as well is a different question. | ||
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NarutO
Germany18839 Posts
On August 14 2013 19:09 Sissors wrote: It would be beyond obvious that people not from Korea, America or Europe can also participate in the WCS. Then you can either just add them to one (for example Africa to Europe), or you leave them free to choose. Lets say the Chinese scene then becomes so back it dominates WCS AM, then you can always add a WCS China. You want WCG - Blizzard wants a masters tournament. Best of the best. Not gathering of all nations. | ||
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Sissors
1395 Posts
On August 14 2013 19:13 NarutO wrote: You want WCG - Blizzard wants a masters tournament. Best of the best. Not gathering of all nations. Blizzard wants to make money, they don't do that by making WCS AM pretty much code A in another timezone. If they just wanted the best they might as well have only done WCS KR and leave EU and AM out of it. | ||
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