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United States60190 Posts
On April 16 2013 01:45 unkkz wrote:
Don't they dare buff swarm hosts, if anything they need nerfs. So hard to deal with as a protoss, it's like getting hit in the face with broodlords at 10ish min.
With a massive timing before that where the zerg has nothing but lings because swarm host cost crazy amounts of gas. Ten minute swarm hosts are like fast mutas, easy to scout and deal with if you do any form of early aggression that matters.
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On April 12 2013 01:26 Ben... wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2013 00:41 lorestarcraft wrote:
Give swarm hosts time. They are really strong. This is definitely true. Most Zergs either don't use them because of the stigma around them (Early on they got a stigma of not being good when no one had actually used them yet. The same thing happened with infestors in early WoL and look how that turned out
Wow Ben, it's not the first time I read this and I really hate your argument, and I'll tell you why :
Everyone seems to forget that Infestors were buffed in patch 1.3. [ Liquipedia : 1.3 Patch notes ]
- DPS doubled
- +30% dmg vs armored units
This (huge) buff caused some players like Destiny and CatZ to abuse it for months, then the whole metagame shifted toward this unit, in addition to Broodlords. Then came players like Stephano executing the build perfectly to the point that it was considered imbalanced.
Before the buff, the Infestor was a trash unit. Zerg players didn't "figured it out", their race was buffed.
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On April 16 2013 01:50 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On April 16 2013 01:45 unkkz wrote:
Don't they dare buff swarm hosts, if anything they need nerfs. So hard to deal with as a protoss, it's like getting hit in the face with broodlords at 10ish min. With a massive timing before that where the zerg has nothing but lings because swarm host cost crazy amounts of gas. Ten minute swarm hosts are like fast mutas, easy to scout and deal with if you do any form of early aggression that matters.
Yeah no, i´m not gonna go into a theorycraft debate because that´s pointless. But even if you look away from 10min swamhosts they are still insanely strong in the lategame. Catz is abusing them like hell to great effect.
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I would like to see them include a community map every season. Hold some kind of competition. That would foster the map making community.
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In my opinion, the more time that passes before the first post-release balance patch, the less likely it is that Speedivacs and Widow Mines will get nerfed. The reason being that they're both things which players can learn to defend against, and have already done so to a large degree, even if most players aren't there yet so those units still seem very strong.
On the other hand, there's no adaptation possible for Zergs against Protoss air + high templars except to kill the Protoss before he gets to that composition, so that will probably be nerfed no matter how long Blizzard waits to see how the game evolves.
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Lol, classic DK.
Swarm host are REALLY good right now in ZvP. An for P's, new mutas make new PvZ totally unidimensional (not going phoenix is imposible for any mid game strategy).
Great interview.
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On April 11 2013 12:03 Rabiator wrote:
When korean pros say that the game is balanced it doesnt mean the same is true for "Joe Woodleague". Professionals can handle stuff more easily than casuals ... and the game should be FUN for everyone.
No, that is really dumb, they must balance for the very best players, not because "joe terrible" finds banelings imbalanced because he cant split for shit. Also FUN is way to subjective, what is fun for you might not be fun for me.
If you want to play a game with no barrier to entry and little diffrence between pro players and casual players, look into Console FPS 
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United States60190 Posts
On April 16 2013 05:24 Hypemeup wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2013 12:03 Rabiator wrote:
When korean pros say that the game is balanced it doesnt mean the same is true for "Joe Woodleague". Professionals can handle stuff more easily than casuals ... and the game should be FUN for everyone. No, that is really dumb, they must balance for the very best players, not because "joe terrible" finds banelings imbalanced because he cant split for shit. Also FUN is way to subjective, what is fun for you might not be fun for me. If you want to play a game with no barrier to entry and little diffrence between pro players and casual players, look into Console FPS
Exactly. The game is fun for people of the same skill level. SC2 is both a game of planning and execution. There is no other game like SC2 out the on the market right. Just because people can't log into the game and be amazing right off the bat does not mean it should be changed. You will likely lose your first bunch of games of chess, Settlers of Catan, Magic and League of Legends too.
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On April 16 2013 01:54 Shade_FR wrote:Wow Ben, it's not the first time I read this and I really hate your argument, and I'll tell you why : Everyone seems to forget that Infestors were buffed in patch 1.3. [ Liquipedia : 1.3 Patch notes ] - DPS doubled - +30% dmg vs armored units This (huge) buff caused some players like Destiny and CatZ to abuse it for months, then the whole metagame shifted toward this unit, in addition to Broodlords. Then came players like Stephano executing the build perfectly to the point that it was considered imbalanced. Before the buff, the Infestor was a trash unit. Zerg players didn't "figured it out", their race was buffed.
Trash unit? Hardly. It was already a powerful unit, but people just didn't know how to use them properly. History proves that.
Remember --- infestors received a big buff, then an even bigger nerf. As I remember it, it got buffed by (1) increasing the vs armor damage, (2) Fungal damages faster, and (3) fungal became an instant-hit.
But the infestor also got nerfed in that same patch and in subsequent patches when the (1) fungal immobilize duration was halved, (2) fungal reverted from instant-hit to VERY slow projectile, (3) fungal range reduced (4) armor bonus damage was removed, (5) infested terrans eggs lost 30 hp, (6) infested terrans no longer receive upgrades, (7) neural parasite was severely nerfed and became useless, and (8) infestor movement speed was reduced.
Infestors before the unnecessary v1.3 buffs would arguably be more deadly than today's infestors. Fungal hold duration for 8 seconds? Both Fungal -and- Neural have longer ranges? Infestor eggs that are 30% stronger? Infested Terrans with +3 damage and +3 armor? Are you kidding me?!
It goes to show the unit never needed the v1.3 buffs to begin with. People just needed more time to figure the unit out, but Blizzard jumped the gun by buffing the unit prematurely. They ended up back-tracking by nerfing the unit again, which included directly undoing many of the buffs from the v1.3 patch. If anything, Blizzard's experience with the unit only strengthens their argument for patience.
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Swarmhosts are terrific units ZvP at any stage of the game given the right build and circumstance. If they get buffed much to make them easier to use ZvT or ZvZ, it will be hard to keep them balanced vs P. But burrow speed seems a good place to start... certainly not range or damage.
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Good stuff.
Nice interview Apollo!
David Kim seemed like a cool guy ^^
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Moar DK plzz!
It's like im actually hearing something that matters for once.
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am i the only person that feels widow mines are a bigger issue than speed medivacs? t.t
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On April 16 2013 05:24 Hypemeup wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2013 12:03 Rabiator wrote:
When korean pros say that the game is balanced it doesnt mean the same is true for "Joe Woodleague". Professionals can handle stuff more easily than casuals ... and the game should be FUN for everyone. No, that is really dumb, they must balance for the very best players, not because "joe terrible" finds banelings imbalanced because he cant split for shit. Also FUN is way to subjective, what is fun for you might not be fun for me. If you want to play a game with no barrier to entry and little diffrence between pro players and casual players, look into Console FPS
Perfectly said 
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EPT
