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I mean it's pretty clear that the only race you have a shadow of a chance with is protoss just because they are mechanically slow, but i still wouldn't put money on it. The difference between "mid-masters" and GM is astronomical.
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On March 28 2013 14:33 Kaitokid wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 11:33 Cress wrote:On March 28 2013 00:11 emythrel wrote:On March 27 2013 23:48 lorestarcraft wrote:
Does anyone not consider that the controller probably has some distinct advantages, such as mouse precision and easy hotkeys? it also has some distinct disadvantages such as lack of buttons. How do you keep 7-8 control groups of units and buildings on a controller? you don't because it probably only has 8 buttons, all of which have to be bound to other things like the unit/building command card or using spells. There are always two sides to a story. Plus lets be honest here, no matter how good you got with a controller, there will always be people who plays with keyboard and mouse who stomp you because you are limited in ways they are not. It's impressive that hes made it to master, I can't even do that with a mouse and keyboard but then perhaps it says more about the design of Protoss and their 1a deathball potential than his skill with a pad. I certainly couldn't imagine him having the same success with Terran or Zerg, you need too many hotkeys and control groups to play effectively with a pad. Actually I have it set up in a way to expand the amount of buttons I have. If you are creative enough you will figure it out. It sounds like you've made a lot of assumptions. Which is fine, but I have vods of me winning against masters players using Zerg? Maybe they were just really bad masters players who knows. If I put time into any of the races I'm sure I could reach low masters with them. Protoss was my main race pick though Setting up hotkeys is pretty effortless for me and the mouse precision is fine. The analog stick mouse speed however is far below what a normal mouse could do and its one of the first critiques people would probably notice. Over the years of playing I'm noticed extremely sharp increases in my play both from changing how my controls work and from pratice I guess. I used to be so bad and chobo. I guess I still am. I would not be surprised if I had another increase in skill over the next year and was suddenly playing at 300 apm. There's also another factor that this is not really a full time thing for me. Just something I've been working on in my free time. Who really reachs GM playing star craft 2 part time^^;? This post is just a declaration of my dedication to improving. I'm just a lowly masters player at the moment though. I respect your opinion though and thank you for posting. I wish you would look over all the information next time though before making assumptions but its cool <3 Cress you seem to have a wrong impression about the players in gm.. I would say around 20-25% are actual progamers and the rest are just people who play in their freetime
99% of those GM's who play in the free time have formed their life in such a way that they can play alot more than the average full-time employeed.
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On March 29 2013 19:50 Hider wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2013 14:33 Kaitokid wrote:On March 28 2013 11:33 Cress wrote:On March 28 2013 00:11 emythrel wrote:On March 27 2013 23:48 lorestarcraft wrote:
Does anyone not consider that the controller probably has some distinct advantages, such as mouse precision and easy hotkeys? it also has some distinct disadvantages such as lack of buttons. How do you keep 7-8 control groups of units and buildings on a controller? you don't because it probably only has 8 buttons, all of which have to be bound to other things like the unit/building command card or using spells. There are always two sides to a story. Plus lets be honest here, no matter how good you got with a controller, there will always be people who plays with keyboard and mouse who stomp you because you are limited in ways they are not. It's impressive that hes made it to master, I can't even do that with a mouse and keyboard but then perhaps it says more about the design of Protoss and their 1a deathball potential than his skill with a pad. I certainly couldn't imagine him having the same success with Terran or Zerg, you need too many hotkeys and control groups to play effectively with a pad. Actually I have it set up in a way to expand the amount of buttons I have. If you are creative enough you will figure it out. It sounds like you've made a lot of assumptions. Which is fine, but I have vods of me winning against masters players using Zerg? Maybe they were just really bad masters players who knows. If I put time into any of the races I'm sure I could reach low masters with them. Protoss was my main race pick though Setting up hotkeys is pretty effortless for me and the mouse precision is fine. The analog stick mouse speed however is far below what a normal mouse could do and its one of the first critiques people would probably notice. Over the years of playing I'm noticed extremely sharp increases in my play both from changing how my controls work and from pratice I guess. I used to be so bad and chobo. I guess I still am. I would not be surprised if I had another increase in skill over the next year and was suddenly playing at 300 apm. There's also another factor that this is not really a full time thing for me. Just something I've been working on in my free time. Who really reachs GM playing star craft 2 part time^^;? This post is just a declaration of my dedication to improving. I'm just a lowly masters player at the moment though. I respect your opinion though and thank you for posting. I wish you would look over all the information next time though before making assumptions but its cool <3 Cress you seem to have a wrong impression about the players in gm.. I would say around 20-25% are actual progamers and the rest are just people who play in their freetime 99% of those GM's who play in the free time have formed their life in such a way that they can play alot more than the average full-time employeed.
Thats a gross overestimation, by your statistics, there would be 2 GM's per Server who did not "formed their life in such a way that they can pay alot more than the average full-time employeed".
A better estimation would be 50%-70%, there are a lot GM players who do not spend that much time on SC2.
EDIT: Unless you have a family inc. children to supply "beeing a full-time employee" does not really cut into your SC2 Time, having a normal 40 hours job (with some overtime) still theoretically allows you to play 3-4 hours per day easily while maintaining a social life.
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On March 29 2013 20:15 gaymon wrote:Show nested quote +On March 29 2013 19:50 Hider wrote:On March 28 2013 14:33 Kaitokid wrote:On March 28 2013 11:33 Cress wrote:On March 28 2013 00:11 emythrel wrote:On March 27 2013 23:48 lorestarcraft wrote:
Does anyone not consider that the controller probably has some distinct advantages, such as mouse precision and easy hotkeys? it also has some distinct disadvantages such as lack of buttons. How do you keep 7-8 control groups of units and buildings on a controller? you don't because it probably only has 8 buttons, all of which have to be bound to other things like the unit/building command card or using spells. There are always two sides to a story. Plus lets be honest here, no matter how good you got with a controller, there will always be people who plays with keyboard and mouse who stomp you because you are limited in ways they are not. It's impressive that hes made it to master, I can't even do that with a mouse and keyboard but then perhaps it says more about the design of Protoss and their 1a deathball potential than his skill with a pad. I certainly couldn't imagine him having the same success with Terran or Zerg, you need too many hotkeys and control groups to play effectively with a pad. Actually I have it set up in a way to expand the amount of buttons I have. If you are creative enough you will figure it out. It sounds like you've made a lot of assumptions. Which is fine, but I have vods of me winning against masters players using Zerg? Maybe they were just really bad masters players who knows. If I put time into any of the races I'm sure I could reach low masters with them. Protoss was my main race pick though Setting up hotkeys is pretty effortless for me and the mouse precision is fine. The analog stick mouse speed however is far below what a normal mouse could do and its one of the first critiques people would probably notice. Over the years of playing I'm noticed extremely sharp increases in my play both from changing how my controls work and from pratice I guess. I used to be so bad and chobo. I guess I still am. I would not be surprised if I had another increase in skill over the next year and was suddenly playing at 300 apm. There's also another factor that this is not really a full time thing for me. Just something I've been working on in my free time. Who really reachs GM playing star craft 2 part time^^;? This post is just a declaration of my dedication to improving. I'm just a lowly masters player at the moment though. I respect your opinion though and thank you for posting. I wish you would look over all the information next time though before making assumptions but its cool <3 Cress you seem to have a wrong impression about the players in gm.. I would say around 20-25% are actual progamers and the rest are just people who play in their freetime 99% of those GM's who play in the free time have formed their life in such a way that they can play alot more than the average full-time employeed. Thats a gross overestimation, by your statistics, there would be 2 GM's per Server who did not "formed their life in such a way that they can pay alot more than the average full-time employeed". A better estimation would be 50%-70%, there are a lot GM players who do not spend that much time on SC2.
I think it's more accurate to say that pretty much every single grandmaster, at some point in time put in significantly more effort than most players to improve, and practice. Once they get there they might play no more than 1-2 games a day on average to maintain a skill level high enough to stay in GM.
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You guys suck sometimes.
Here we have this guy who is extremely successful in a very unconventional way of playing and half of you are being Debbie Downers about it.
Some blame Protons being too easy, others blaming SC2 to be too easy, some say all his opponents suck or that it's impossible for him to reach GM...
How about just recognising that he's done something really impressive and rooting for him to reach his goals?
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On March 29 2013 20:29 kafkaesque wrote:
You guys suck sometimes.
Here we have this guy who is extremely successful in a very unconventional way of playing and half of you are being Debbie Downers about it.
Some blame Protons being too easy, others blaming SC2 to be too easy, some say all his opponents suck or that it's impossible for him to reach GM...
How about just recognising that he's done something really impressive and rooting for him to reach his goals?
Agreed. But at least Cress has the right attitude of using their pessimism as motivation.
I think it's definitely possible, and it's just a matter of how much time and effort he's willing to put into it. And it will take a loooot of time and effort, rest assured, but it's an obtainable goal.
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This is simply stunning!!
Fantastic job dude, I wish you the best of luck in reaching GM even though it seems like luck isn't the reason for your success 
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this is my favorite thread in TL so far! will definetely be following this! wish you best of luck!
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Haha this is freaking awesome, hope you continue to improve. It would be legit awesome to see you at an event or something playing with an Xbox controller hahaha :D Pretty cool already to see all the buttons you're hitting. Cool 
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I think this is doable with protoss. Seeing your current level of skill and seeing that you are master makes me cringe. GM would be like 5 times the cringe. All of these protoss players like weedamins maximusblack and even he-who-must-not-be-named-ex (although he went out with a bang) bring a very negative image to protoss.
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this is a new and fun way to play got to give you some respect for this
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This isnt even interesting.
I wanna see something interesting like if a diamond player map hacking can get to masters or something.
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On March 29 2013 18:33 gingerfluffmuff wrote:
Can we please all agree that being GM outside of Korea is no big deal? It can achieved with mass grinding and a few anti-meta builds.
OT: Playing with a 360 controller is awesome, huge props to the OP. But outside of getting people interested for your own stream its pointless. (Just send one of your workers at game start to the opponent, this should make the game also harder)
Thanks for posting your opinion gingerfluffmuff. I respect that, but I wish you would think outside the box a little bit. There's a lot of reasons to use the controller. The mouse and key board is a lot less comfortable way to play games for me.
I play on the xbox360 controller because I don't have to worry about posture/wrist pain/back pain and its a comfortable way to play the game. I can put my feet up on the desk and slink back into my chair. I'm even able to put my hand behind my back and still browse the internet. Its a lot less constricting for me and so I enjoy the game more.
If we both played a game to gather at a masters level. Your hunched over a desk and I'm sitting with my feet up on the desk does it really matter that your complaining to me about potential that may or not exist if I were to use a mouse and keyboard?
I also make my own wonky builds so that I enjoy the game more. Without being comfortable and actually having fun playing the game I would probably not stick around.
What you see as point less. Is actually me playing the game my way.
Cress
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On March 30 2013 00:31 o29 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 29 2013 20:29 kafkaesque wrote:
You guys suck sometimes.
Here we have this guy who is extremely successful in a very unconventional way of playing and half of you are being Debbie Downers about it.
Some blame Protons being too easy, others blaming SC2 to be too easy, some say all his opponents suck or that it's impossible for him to reach GM...
How about just recognising that he's done something really impressive and rooting for him to reach his goals? Agreed. But at least Cress has the right attitude of using their pessimism as motivation. I think it's definitely possible, and it's just a matter of how much time and effort he's willing to put into it. And it will take a loooot of time and effort, rest assured, but it's an obtainable goal.
Well in a way this is a goal I've been working towards since star craft 2 was released. I've seen massive spikes in my skill over time and I've stopped ruleing myself out. I play star craft 2 with the game pad regardless if I'm streaming or not. It's just something that I'm sharing with you guys.
The kind comments some of you have left for me really means a lot. Makes me wanna keep streaming.
There's always gonna be a few people that are gonna hate I suppose
I got top 8 masters, I'm sure they were all like easy masters players though.
Like bronze players that made it into masters or something. Low points etc.
Anyway its less about ranking more just about improving. Everyday I come closer to reaching god mode with the game pad XD
![[image loading]](http://image.noelshack.com/fichiers/2013/08/1361436853-1310338955965.gif)
Nappa: Vegeta.... What does the scouter say about Cress's Gangnam style power level?!
Vegeta: Its over 9000!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Yeah you knew that was coming =D
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This is amazing. I just watched your most recent game (A ZvP where you mass muta) and as soon as it ended I ordered an xbox wireless receiver off ebay. I don't care if I can't get to masters or above like you can. This looks like fun. I'll give it a try for a few months for sure :D
Edit: That gif is epic!
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Wow. Just wow.
Also makes me sad about myself.
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Some people on here are being a bit silly. There's no ultimate rule that dictates that a keyboard and mouse are the optimal tools with which to play this game. The best tools to use to accomplish any task are appropriate tools that you are most comfortable with. Cress has created a system that best accommodates the manner in which he wants to play, nobody really has justification to doubt him, nor should anyone feel bad for their own play after watching his stream. Different strokes.
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I'm not 100% sure if this simply highlights massive differences in the skill sets required to play the 3 races in SC2. I don't want to say that your ability to play with the game pad speaks volumes to game balance, but I think it's safe to say you'd have to go back to the drawing boards if you wanted to reach the same goal with Terran, as opposed to Protoss. Simply from watching the speed of your gameplay as well as how you move the cursor around, I don't think you'd be able to make it very far. Protoss is a race that can compensate for a lot of mechanical deficiency as long as you just play a safe macro style, which seems to be your style from what I've seen on stream.
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EPT
