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On March 15 2013 08:43 BabyMozart wrote:
I want to see a david kim vs idra showmatch :D
Wow, this is a great fucking idea.. A showmatch with David Kim with a random pro player. This would be something I would pay to watch for. David plays each race versus different players. Lets get this shit hyped up!
Balance right?
This ^. I highly doubt David Kim is a GM in any race let alone all three now days.
There is no proof of it being so.
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On March 15 2013 07:46 Grumbels wrote:
I think it was Day[9] that showed an in-house Blizzard tournament starring David Kim and his play certainly wasn't good enough for Korean GM.
It was Day[9].
If I'd played like Dayvie in those games I'd be mighty embarrassed. He was outclassed in at least one game by a Diamond scrub.
That said, he was GM at that time (under the name Dayvie) with random so I think he might have been mucking about. When I play with my buddies I certainly don't showcase my best play, I just want to have fun and try out some cool builds (which means my builds won't be polished and will require more attention, meaning worse multitasking and micro).
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In my oppinion Void Ray and Medivac brakes the fucking game. I don´t have any chance on winning vs dropping terran or Airtoss......
And again I feel fucking angry about my money spend into a beta. Not to talk about the story mode 30€ =5h
Damn rip off piece of shit company Blizzard is, no joke
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^ Althaz also has the point that the skill levels during different times effect who has the grand master positions. As more players join the ladder, there is more competition. And now that we have real professionals such as the KeSPA teams joining... As well as the strategies of the game being mapped out... The positions of the rankings will shuffle around dramatically. A show match between any professional and David Kim would very much likely shatter this illusion of "balance".
But of course, there's nothing we can do. And neither will the people in power ever demonstrate their lack of competence due to the fact that the pacification of illusion will be shattered. It's not in their best interest. It's only up to the players to band together DEMAND such displays. Otherwise we will forever be stuck in such a dilemma. Trust without logical justification is just speculation, as Warren Buffett would say. 
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On March 15 2013 11:20 Suikakuju wrote:
In my oppinion Void Ray and Medivac brakes the fucking game. I don´t have any chance on winning vs dropping terran or Airtoss......
And again I feel fucking angry about my money spend into a beta. Not to talk about the story mode 30€ =5h
Damn rip off piece of shit company Blizzard is, no joke
calm down, man.
they will fix it soon.
Remember how broken WoL was upon release?
HotS is tons better.
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The truth is our balance relies on one person, where nobody can watch him play in streams every day like our real professional players, where there is no account profile available for proof of competence. Our balance in the past has also been determined by over simplified statistics of win rates which are used as a proxy for the fairness of balance. But that would be like saying, "because statistics show that 80% of alcohol consumption does not kill people... Alcohol therefore does not kill people..." It's black and white thinking and a very simple logical fallacy. Statistics do not determine truth if they are taken from an overly simplistic perspective.
Where is the proof of David Kim's competence? Who is he to say: "The game globally balanced, I repeat, the game is globally balanced."?
And let us not forget the balance protest of GSL Code S player Ryung: http://touhonoob.mykomica.org/starcraft/src/1354369161734.jpg during round 5 of a GSL match.
But I guess my argument will never be noticed anyway.
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On March 15 2013 11:26 neoghaleon55 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2013 11:20 Suikakuju wrote:
In my oppinion Void Ray and Medivac brakes the fucking game. I don´t have any chance on winning vs dropping terran or Airtoss......
And again I feel fucking angry about my money spend into a beta. Not to talk about the story mode 30€ =5h
Damn rip off piece of shit company Blizzard is, no joke calm down, man. they will fix it soon. Remember how broken WoL was upon release? HotS is tons better.
yeah I mean sure...they fix that and this soon. But I am fucking pissed, which is my right after buying there games. Which just sold because of there name^^ Diablo 3 and Starcraft 2
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On March 15 2013 11:28 Akusta wrote:
The truth is our balance relies on one person, where nobody can watch him play in streams every day like our real professional players, where there is no account profile available for proof of competence. Our balance in the past has also been determined by over simplified statistics of win rates which are used as a proxy for the fairness of balance. But that would be like saying, "because statistics show that 80% of alcohol consumption does not kill people... Alcohol therefore does not kill people..." It's black and white thinking and a very simple logical fallacy. Statistics do not determine truth if they are taken from an overly simplistic perspective.
Where is the proof of David Kim's competence? Who is he to say: "The game globally balanced, I repeat, the game is globally balanced."?
He is like a politician say people want they want to hear...
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I don't think widowmine is the obvious next nerf. Heck, I think defending against void ray is far more figured out then defending widow mine but void ray is still more "broken". Still, I think they should wait with nerfs.
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On March 15 2013 11:39 Rioo wrote:
I don't think widowmine is the obvious next nerf. Heck, I think defending against void ray is far more figured out then defending widow mine but void ray is still more "broken". Still, I think they should wait with nerfs.
Rather than nerving voidrays I ould prefer if they changed the corruptor to a less one dimensional role that is able to deal with voidrays. But it might be to late for such changes.
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People talking about DK showmatch, that can't ever happen. Imagine the shitstorm if he got supply blocked? Floating a bit of minerals? God forbid lost a game? :O Insane amounts of people would discredit all of blizzard's balancing if they saw the lead balance guy didn't play perfect and know everything about the game!
Finding it hard to believe without proper proof tho..
Anyway.. I like his thinking, i do agree on widow mine getting blast radius reduce, that's the most annoying thing.. Either that or lowering the damage so it doesn't one-shot workers, oh nevermind they'd be terrible then.. They could increase cost, but his suggestion seems way better. Oracle doesn't need a nerf, it is strong vs terran, but really not vs other races. In pvp there are so many counters to it early on, being a huge risk to invest in it. Also you costing 150/150 for a visible detector is costly coming from protoss.
Vr issue, i guess we don't know yet, but i do think they are too strong in pvz at first glance.. But then again, zergs are going roach/hydra like it was wol release, and we all know how easy that was to counter.. Nothing really changed and i still think hydra is a bad unit for it's cost, should really just decrease it slightly. Also vr's in pvp is a must have for mid-late game, it's abit silly.
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On March 15 2013 11:45 Mellon wrote:
People talking about DK showmatch, that can't ever happen. Imagine the shitstorm if he got supply blocked? Floating a bit of minerals? God forbid lost a game? :O Insane amounts of people would discredit all of blizzard's balancing if they saw the lead balance guy didn't play perfect and know everything about the game!
Finding it hard to believe without proper proof tho..
Anyway.. I like his thinking, i do agree on widow mine getting blast radius reduce, that's the most annoying thing.. Either that or lowering the damage so it doesn't one-shot workers, oh nevermind they'd be terrible then.. They could increase cost, but his suggestion seems way better. Oracle doesn't need a nerf, it is strong vs terran, but really not vs other races. In pvp there are so many counters to it early on, being a huge risk to invest in it. Also you costing 150/150 for a visible detector is costly coming from protoss.
Vr issue, i guess we don't know yet, but i do think they are too strong in pvz at first glance.. But then again, zergs are going roach/hydra like it was wol release, and we all know how easy that was to counter.. Nothing really changed and i still think hydra is a bad unit for it's cost, should really just decrease it slightly. Also vr's in pvp is a must have for mid-late game, it's abit silly.
If he is GM, there should be replays from the ladder.
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On March 15 2013 06:25 peidongyang wrote:
I'm calling bs on the gm three races thing
That means he is performing at a similar if not higher level than thorzain, sase and a lesser tier Korean pro Zerg at their respective races? Yeah bullshit.
LOL no. It's probably NA server (read the OP, interview doesn't specify which server, it just says David Kim has a korean ID), which is much easier.
Edit: And I think D.Kim is doing a good job balancing the game. Only move I absolutely cannot condone is the +2 range queen, which single handedly could have put SC2 to rest if it wasn't for HotS.
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David kim should stream. I'd love to see how he handles the things ppl are complaining about and hear his narration of the games.
I'm glad they are not jumping the gun on changes, the game is so fun right now. The only thing I can say seems a little silly is the void rays. The mines are good, but I've seen ppl shut them down, and I've seen ppl lose because they handled them poorly.
I really feel like the skill ceiling has gotten infinity higher with this expansion, only the best will prosper!
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They'll probably wait for MLG Dallas to finish before making balance changes. A Terran should have won this tournament even in WoL (one might say they qualified because hellbats were too strong or something, but it's like the 10 best Terrans in the world), so it's not unfair if a Terran wins even if Terran turns out to be OP as fuck. :D
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On March 15 2013 06:05 Seiniyta wrote:
Grandmaster with all 3 races? Pretty awesome.
Yep + He was GM on the NA ladder before.
dayvie#947 is his NA account (which got to GM at least once on NA) but I guess he moved to KR server now (though I wonder if he plays with a lot of lag considering doesn't he stay at CA to work with Blizzard's Irvine HQ)?
On March 15 2013 06:25 peidongyang wrote:
I'm calling bs on the gm three races thing
That means he is performing at a similar if not higher level than thorzain, sase and a lesser tier Korean pro Zerg at their respective races? Yeah bullshit.
See above.
Also David Kim was a former pro player AFAIK. He isn't just some random guy. Plus, David Kim is Korean.
On March 15 2013 06:44 sCFade wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2013 06:42 Qikz wrote:
I think it's entirely plausable. You forget, that he literally lives and breathes the game. He more than likely plays it a hell of a lot more than Thorzain/Sase whoever else they mentioned. He has to be good at the game as he's the balance designer, could you imagine how bad the game would be if they let a bronze player think up the balance changes?
As anyone who has matched him can tell you, the idea of him being GM on KR with one race, let alone 3, is a joke.
MVP is GM Terran (of course) and he used to off race frequently on Zerg and still own up on the GM ladder.
David Kim can do the same easily. Remember he was a former pro player plus "dayvie#947" his NA account used to frequently play and he got matched with top players all the time (you can add his account and check). Of course he no longer uses dayvie#947 (probably because everyone found out and kept spamming him with invites or something... this was before they added the ability to block invites and messages from non-friend listed players to battle.net).
I definitely think David Kim should stream to prove haters wrong.
Not sure about now but his dayvie#947 account was clearly GM level. In the beta, David Kim was almost untouchable for a decent amount too (he had like a 90%+ win rate on the beta) and he played Random there too (so it wasn't like he abused 1 supply 2 armor Roaches all beta or 11/11 every game, he played all 3 races with 90% win rate in the beta).
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i hope they do something about the widow mine soon.
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ep + He was GM on the NA ladder before.
dayvie#947 is his NA account (which got to GM at least once on NA) but I guess he moved to KR server now (though I wonder if he plays with a lot of lag considering doesn't he stay at CA to work with Blizzard's Irvine HQ)?
On March 15 2013 06:25 peidongyang wrote:
I'm calling bs on the gm three races thing
That means he is performing at a similar if not higher level than thorzain, sase and a lesser tier Korean pro Zerg at their respective races? Yeah bullshit.
See above.
Also David Kim was a former pro player AFAIK. He isn't just some random guy. Plus, David Kim is Korean.
Your ethnicity does not determine your skill... Beta GM doesn't qualify or provide proof of competence in an ever changing meta game.. he was GM 3 years ago, and this argument is brought up in my previous post. There's no proof that he even plays now days. And I wonder where this "Korean ID" is? If anyone should be balancing, it should be professionals from all races put together. Which would somewhat fight against self interest by having opinions from ALL races from players with proven competence .
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What about instead of a burrow charge, a strait up, charge. It would displace enemy units that are in the way, so splitting or or having a think line of battle hellions wouldn't stop an ultralisk from reaching tanks. Probibally just as glitchy. It may have to walk over units then, doing trample damage.
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On March 15 2013 12:22 Akusta wrote:Show nested quote +ep + He was GM on the NA ladder before.
dayvie#947 is his NA account (which got to GM at least once on NA) but I guess he moved to KR server now (though I wonder if he plays with a lot of lag considering doesn't he stay at CA to work with Blizzard's Irvine HQ)?
On March 15 2013 06:25 peidongyang wrote:
I'm calling bs on the gm three races thing
That means he is performing at a similar if not higher level than thorzain, sase and a lesser tier Korean pro Zerg at their respective races? Yeah bullshit.
See above.
Also David Kim was a former pro player AFAIK. He isn't just some random guy. Plus, David Kim is Korean. Your ethnicity does not determine your skill... Beta GM doesn't qualify or provide proof of competence in an ever changing meta game.. and there's no proof that he even plays now days. And I wonder where this "Korean ID" is? If anyone should be balancing, it should be professionals from all races put together. But then comes in the flaw in mankind. Self interest that causes conflict. Maybe I should just give up and become a politician lol.
Please don't.
On topic, being a good player doesn't make you qualified as a balance designer. Leave that to competent people and let IdrA whine all he wants on the ladder.
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EPT
