On February 24 2013 07:36 kollin wrote: You edited it in the same minute that he posted his post, which is very suspicious. Furthermore, we have literally disproven everything you have said. Sundance went on SotG sometime recently and said viewership had risen, and the excellent points WolfInSheep made really go to prove that you're either trolling or backing down and admitting you're wrong wounds your manly pride.
Again, you haven't disproven anything. You're essentially just attacking me in an attempt to undermine my points.
What points would that be, could you summarizing them? aslo since you mention "evidence" could you supply them with a source and please specify how these sources are more legit than Dreamhack and sundance on STOG.
How about the fact that right now there are only 3k viewers on twitch for WoL and 11k for HoTS. Is that enough to sustain the scene? This is, imo, why there has been so much negativity among the community and why so many teams/players are retiring. Thats it. I'm just using common sense and simple logic. It's quite obvious to me, at least.
I have literally never watched a player stream for more than 10 minutes, and I have never watched a player stream in the past year at all. Who cares about player stream numbers? Player streams in BW had horrid viewership numbers (foreign only for the most though) yet the Korean scene lived on for over 10 years purely through tournaments.
Tournaments are what matter to me, so your point is pretty stupid as usual because you assume that you are the center of SC2 and what you like must be what the scene needs. Sure, Destiny gets more viewers on LoL, but the truth is that a lot of professional players do not need huge streaming numbers to survive. The issue was that Destiny was never good enough at SC2 to get into a position where that was true for him, so he moved.
The fact is that you've gotten proven wrong over and over again except on declining player stream numbers, which you had to continuously revise lower and lower until you stopped exaggerating out your ass (of course you also ignore the fact that IdrA was a very top-tier pro and even a top 10 world zerg at one point when he was streaming, and now he isn't even close to that).
But no, clearly IGN shuttering EVERY OTHER SITE besides a Men's advice site ("Warning, obvious appeal to mainstream crowd for income detected!") means that StarCraft 2 is dying. Horribly dying. I know this because 1 + 2 = fish
Having a large viewership helps maintain the scene economically somewhat, but there are also other ways in which you can save/make money. Having good management, sponsors, and good use of ad spaces will probably be something the scene can work on. I will be honest that a long time ago I did not know there is an energy drink called Nos, and recently I learned of this game called zoozoo bubbles...
On February 24 2013 08:17 Hikari wrote: Having a large viewership helps maintain the scene economically somewhat, but there are also other ways in which you can save/make money. Having good management, sponsors, and good use of ad spaces will probably be something the scene can work on. I will be honest that a long time ago I did not know there is an energy drink called Nos, and recently I learned of this game called zoozoo bubbles...
that is great, however, hte head of the IPL said they are 5 years from profitability. Ziff Davis said "find another sugar daddy".
On February 24 2013 08:17 Hikari wrote: Having a large viewership helps maintain the scene economically somewhat, but there are also other ways in which you can save/make money. Having good management, sponsors, and good use of ad spaces will probably be something the scene can work on. I will be honest that a long time ago I did not know there is an energy drink called Nos, and recently I learned of this game called zoozoo bubbles...
that is great, however, hte head of the IPL said they are 5 years from profitability. Ziff Davis said "find another sugar daddy".
On February 24 2013 08:17 Hikari wrote: Having a large viewership helps maintain the scene economically somewhat, but there are also other ways in which you can save/make money. Having good management, sponsors, and good use of ad spaces will probably be something the scene can work on. I will be honest that a long time ago I did not know there is an energy drink called Nos, and recently I learned of this game called zoozoo bubbles...
that is great, however, hte head of the IPL said they are 5 years from profitability. Ziff Davis said "find another sugar daddy".
and as you know Ziff-Davis is trying to sell the league.
although why any one would buy it to lose money for 5 years is beyond me.
IPLs previous "value proposition" was that it drew traffic to IGN.com. ZD announced their alternative method of attracting that same traffic is by simply reporting on eSPorts events rather than paying out the prize money.
On February 24 2013 08:17 Hikari wrote: Having a large viewership helps maintain the scene economically somewhat, but there are also other ways in which you can save/make money. Having good management, sponsors, and good use of ad spaces will probably be something the scene can work on. I will be honest that a long time ago I did not know there is an energy drink called Nos, and recently I learned of this game called zoozoo bubbles...
that is great, however, hte head of the IPL said they are 5 years from profitability. Ziff Davis said "find another sugar daddy".
and as you know Ziff-Davis is trying to sell the league.
although why any one would buy it to lose money for 5 years is beyond me.
IPLs previous "value proposition" was that it drew traffic to IGN.com. ZD announced their alternative method of attracting that same traffic is by simply reporting on eSPorts events rather than paying out the prize money.
For one thing, a ton of businesses these days go for years and years without ever making money. I still don't think Youtube has ever made money, and if they have it's because Google has cut out the middleman by using their own ad networks, and yet YT is considered to be worth billions. Also, who's to say that IPL won't be bought by someone else who also plans to use it to promote their other businesses?
On February 24 2013 08:17 Hikari wrote: Having a large viewership helps maintain the scene economically somewhat, but there are also other ways in which you can save/make money. Having good management, sponsors, and good use of ad spaces will probably be something the scene can work on. I will be honest that a long time ago I did not know there is an energy drink called Nos, and recently I learned of this game called zoozoo bubbles...
that is great, however, hte head of the IPL said they are 5 years from profitability. Ziff Davis said "find another sugar daddy".
and as you know Ziff-Davis is trying to sell the league.
although why any one would buy it to lose money for 5 years is beyond me.
IPLs previous "value proposition" was that it drew traffic to IGN.com. ZD announced their alternative method of attracting that same traffic is by simply reporting on eSPorts events rather than paying out the prize money.
well you said it yourself, 5 years from profitability.. so "losing" money for 5 years isnt really true, rather it means you will make money in the future to compensate for the initial costs. so it has more to do with short versus long term investement strategies rather than "sugar daddies".
On February 24 2013 08:17 Hikari wrote: Having a large viewership helps maintain the scene economically somewhat, but there are also other ways in which you can save/make money. Having good management, sponsors, and good use of ad spaces will probably be something the scene can work on. I will be honest that a long time ago I did not know there is an energy drink called Nos, and recently I learned of this game called zoozoo bubbles...
that is great, however, hte head of the IPL said they are 5 years from profitability. Ziff Davis said "find another sugar daddy".
and as you know Ziff-Davis is trying to sell the league.
although why any one would buy it to lose money for 5 years is beyond me.
IPLs previous "value proposition" was that it drew traffic to IGN.com. ZD announced their alternative method of attracting that same traffic is by simply reporting on eSPorts events rather than paying out the prize money.
well you said it yourself, 5 years from profitability.. so "losing" money for 5 years isnt really true, rather it means you will make money in the future to compensate for the initial costs. so it has more to do with short versus long term investement strategies rather than "sugar daddies".
ya well there are 5 million assumptions that go into this "plan for profitability" any one can lose money. the tricky part is making it.
if IPLs plan look like a sure thing to you then put together a group of investors and laugh all ur way to the bank.
On February 24 2013 08:17 Hikari wrote: Having a large viewership helps maintain the scene economically somewhat, but there are also other ways in which you can save/make money. Having good management, sponsors, and good use of ad spaces will probably be something the scene can work on. I will be honest that a long time ago I did not know there is an energy drink called Nos, and recently I learned of this game called zoozoo bubbles...
that is great, however, hte head of the IPL said they are 5 years from profitability. Ziff Davis said "find another sugar daddy".
and as you know Ziff-Davis is trying to sell the league.
although why any one would buy it to lose money for 5 years is beyond me.
IPLs previous "value proposition" was that it drew traffic to IGN.com. ZD announced their alternative method of attracting that same traffic is by simply reporting on eSPorts events rather than paying out the prize money.
well you said it yourself, 5 years from profitability.. so "losing" money for 5 years isnt really true, rather it means you will make money in the future to compensate for the initial costs. so it has more to do with short versus long term investement strategies rather than "sugar daddies".
ya well there are 5 million assumptions that go into this "plan for profitability" any one can lose money. the tricky part is making it.
if IPLs plan look like a sure thing to you then put together a group of investors and laugh all ur way to the bank.
obviously. i was just quoting you. short term return happens to be the shit right now but that doesnt mean its the only way to make money. its simply the easiest way to appeal to investors.
I don't understand why everybody thinks sc2 is going to die just because there are other games that are more popular. Sure, they have higher numbers but who really cares? As a viewer you should watch what you want to watch not whats the most popular. Even if sc2 continues to die and there is only a small niche of people who play and watch it, who cares. If you dont like the game than just leave now. There will always be competitive sc2 whether or not there are 50k prize pools.
On February 24 2013 08:17 Hikari wrote: Having a large viewership helps maintain the scene economically somewhat, but there are also other ways in which you can save/make money. Having good management, sponsors, and good use of ad spaces will probably be something the scene can work on. I will be honest that a long time ago I did not know there is an energy drink called Nos, and recently I learned of this game called zoozoo bubbles...
that is great, however, hte head of the IPL said they are 5 years from profitability. Ziff Davis said "find another sugar daddy".
and as you know Ziff-Davis is trying to sell the league.
although why any one would buy it to lose money for 5 years is beyond me.
IPLs previous "value proposition" was that it drew traffic to IGN.com. ZD announced their alternative method of attracting that same traffic is by simply reporting on eSPorts events rather than paying out the prize money.
well you said it yourself, 5 years from profitability.. so "losing" money for 5 years isnt really true, rather it means you will make money in the future to compensate for the initial costs. so it has more to do with short versus long term investement strategies rather than "sugar daddies".
ya well there are 5 million assumptions that go into this "plan for profitability" any one can lose money. the tricky part is making it.
if IPLs plan look like a sure thing to you then put together a group of investors and laugh all ur way to the bank.
It's worth noting that most business (even small ones) are not profitable until a long time after they are established, simply by the nature of start up costs.
While IPL may have put in $1million last year, a lot of that will be the cost of setting up infrastructure, hiring and training the employees, buying the required equipment, etc.
On February 24 2013 08:17 Hikari wrote: Having a large viewership helps maintain the scene economically somewhat, but there are also other ways in which you can save/make money. Having good management, sponsors, and good use of ad spaces will probably be something the scene can work on. I will be honest that a long time ago I did not know there is an energy drink called Nos, and recently I learned of this game called zoozoo bubbles...
that is great, however, hte head of the IPL said they are 5 years from profitability. Ziff Davis said "find another sugar daddy".
and as you know Ziff-Davis is trying to sell the league.
although why any one would buy it to lose money for 5 years is beyond me.
IPLs previous "value proposition" was that it drew traffic to IGN.com. ZD announced their alternative method of attracting that same traffic is by simply reporting on eSPorts events rather than paying out the prize money.
well you said it yourself, 5 years from profitability.. so "losing" money for 5 years isnt really true, rather it means you will make money in the future to compensate for the initial costs. so it has more to do with short versus long term investement strategies rather than "sugar daddies".
ya well there are 5 million assumptions that go into this "plan for profitability" any one can lose money. the tricky part is making it.
if IPLs plan look like a sure thing to you then put together a group of investors and laugh all ur way to the bank.
It's worth noting that most business (even small ones) are not profitable until a long time after they are established, simply by the nature of start up costs.
While IPL may have put in $1million last year, a lot of that will be the cost of setting up infrastructure, hiring and training the employees, buying the required equipment, etc.
and many businesses never see a profit and just go out of business.
so far 2 big corporations are not willing to wait: Newscorp and ZiffDavis. and their actions speak louder than your words.
On February 24 2013 08:17 Hikari wrote: Having a large viewership helps maintain the scene economically somewhat, but there are also other ways in which you can save/make money. Having good management, sponsors, and good use of ad spaces will probably be something the scene can work on. I will be honest that a long time ago I did not know there is an energy drink called Nos, and recently I learned of this game called zoozoo bubbles...
that is great, however, hte head of the IPL said they are 5 years from profitability. Ziff Davis said "find another sugar daddy".
and as you know Ziff-Davis is trying to sell the league.
although why any one would buy it to lose money for 5 years is beyond me.
IPLs previous "value proposition" was that it drew traffic to IGN.com. ZD announced their alternative method of attracting that same traffic is by simply reporting on eSPorts events rather than paying out the prize money.
well you said it yourself, 5 years from profitability.. so "losing" money for 5 years isnt really true, rather it means you will make money in the future to compensate for the initial costs. so it has more to do with short versus long term investement strategies rather than "sugar daddies".
ya well there are 5 million assumptions that go into this "plan for profitability" any one can lose money. the tricky part is making it.
if IPLs plan look like a sure thing to you then put together a group of investors and laugh all ur way to the bank.
It's worth noting that most business (even small ones) are not profitable until a long time after they are established, simply by the nature of start up costs.
While IPL may have put in $1million last year, a lot of that will be the cost of setting up infrastructure, hiring and training the employees, buying the required equipment, etc.
and many businesses never see a profit and just go out of business.
so far 2 big corporations are not willing to wait: Newscorp and ZiffDavis. and their actions speak louder than your words.
Yes...and?
If almost all businesses take a long time to offset start-up costs, and if some businesses close down after a short period, it stands to reason that some businesses close down without being profitable.
This is technically what investing is all about: Losing short term money with the prospect of gaining in the long term.
On February 24 2013 08:17 Hikari wrote: Having a large viewership helps maintain the scene economically somewhat, but there are also other ways in which you can save/make money. Having good management, sponsors, and good use of ad spaces will probably be something the scene can work on. I will be honest that a long time ago I did not know there is an energy drink called Nos, and recently I learned of this game called zoozoo bubbles...
that is great, however, hte head of the IPL said they are 5 years from profitability. Ziff Davis said "find another sugar daddy".
and as you know Ziff-Davis is trying to sell the league.
although why any one would buy it to lose money for 5 years is beyond me.
IPLs previous "value proposition" was that it drew traffic to IGN.com. ZD announced their alternative method of attracting that same traffic is by simply reporting on eSPorts events rather than paying out the prize money.
well you said it yourself, 5 years from profitability.. so "losing" money for 5 years isnt really true, rather it means you will make money in the future to compensate for the initial costs. so it has more to do with short versus long term investement strategies rather than "sugar daddies".
ya well there are 5 million assumptions that go into this "plan for profitability" any one can lose money. the tricky part is making it.
if IPLs plan look like a sure thing to you then put together a group of investors and laugh all ur way to the bank.
It's worth noting that most business (even small ones) are not profitable until a long time after they are established, simply by the nature of start up costs.
While IPL may have put in $1million last year, a lot of that will be the cost of setting up infrastructure, hiring and training the employees, buying the required equipment, etc.
and many businesses never see a profit and just go out of business.
so far 2 big corporations are not willing to wait: Newscorp and ZiffDavis. and their actions speak louder than your words.
Yes...and?
If almost all businesses take a long time to offset start-up costs, and if some businesses close down after a short period, it stands to reason that some businesses close down without being profitable.
This is technically what investing is all about: Losing short term money with the prospect of gaining in the long term.
and IGN and the league it owns, IPL, was shopped around for months and months with Newscorp unable to find a buyer. finally it went to auction.
no one thinks IPL is going to make some big turnaround.
if you do... you should get some friends together and buy it.. because at this point its available for pennies on the dollar.
NewsCorp thought IGN and IPL were a waste of their time and money. No one thought IGN and IPL were worth anything during hte sales process.
The second Ziff Davis buys IGN ... IPL is on the block. Ziff Davis thinks IPL is a waste of their time and money.
you can twist your mind into a pretzel of rationalizations if it will make you feel better. i prefer to keep things simple.
it is highly probably IPL will fold as soon as the contracts for their previous commitments expire.
On February 24 2013 08:17 Hikari wrote: Having a large viewership helps maintain the scene economically somewhat, but there are also other ways in which you can save/make money. Having good management, sponsors, and good use of ad spaces will probably be something the scene can work on. I will be honest that a long time ago I did not know there is an energy drink called Nos, and recently I learned of this game called zoozoo bubbles...
that is great, however, hte head of the IPL said they are 5 years from profitability. Ziff Davis said "find another sugar daddy".
and as you know Ziff-Davis is trying to sell the league.
although why any one would buy it to lose money for 5 years is beyond me.
IPLs previous "value proposition" was that it drew traffic to IGN.com. ZD announced their alternative method of attracting that same traffic is by simply reporting on eSPorts events rather than paying out the prize money.
well you said it yourself, 5 years from profitability.. so "losing" money for 5 years isnt really true, rather it means you will make money in the future to compensate for the initial costs. so it has more to do with short versus long term investement strategies rather than "sugar daddies".
ya well there are 5 million assumptions that go into this "plan for profitability" any one can lose money. the tricky part is making it.
if IPLs plan look like a sure thing to you then put together a group of investors and laugh all ur way to the bank.
It's worth noting that most business (even small ones) are not profitable until a long time after they are established, simply by the nature of start up costs.
While IPL may have put in $1million last year, a lot of that will be the cost of setting up infrastructure, hiring and training the employees, buying the required equipment, etc.
and many businesses never see a profit and just go out of business.
so far 2 big corporations are not willing to wait: Newscorp and ZiffDavis. and their actions speak louder than your words.
Yes...and?
If almost all businesses take a long time to offset start-up costs, and if some businesses close down after a short period, it stands to reason that some businesses close down without being profitable.
This is technically what investing is all about: Losing short term money with the prospect of gaining in the long term.
and IGN and the league it owns IPL was shopped around for months and months with Newscorp unable to find a buyer. finally it went to auction.
no one thinks IPL is going to make some big turnaround.
if you do... you should get some friends together and buy it.. because at this point its available for pennies on the dollar.
OK you seem pretty confident, why don't you put your money where your mouth is. If IPL is sold, you get a 30 day ban. If IPL isn't sold, I get a 30 day ban.
EPT
