EPTLings of Liberty: The Rise of the Patchzergs - Page 76
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Rojac
United States10 Posts
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Hider
Denmark9341 Posts
On December 12 2012 05:02 Rojac wrote: Lost interest the second the term 'patch zerg' was thrown around then why did you open the thread ? | ||
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On December 12 2012 05:01 Hider wrote: The "interesting" is that when Blizzard nerfed snipe damage, they litterally had no solution (them selves) to how terran would deal with broodlod infestor late game. I guess they probably thought that korean terrans would figure something out as they always did. But when it comes to a a serious nerf of the infestor, they were (for some reason) to scared to do anything signifcant (like they did with HOTS).They really didn't have a lot in faith in the ability of zerg innovating something or coming up with solutions. Vikings. Many of the games before and after the snipe nerf went to BL/Infestor and Terran could deal with it without snipe. Even more, Terran has an army that beats BL/Infestor. Terran has armies that beat BL/Infestor AND any kind of switch (e.g. Ultralisks) afterwards. They are just terribly hard to reach - since the queen nerf - because BL/Infestor timings hit really early these days. | ||
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Reality_Seeker
Bulgaria18 Posts
User was banned for this post. | ||
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bo1b
Australia12814 Posts
On December 12 2012 05:55 Reality_Seeker wrote: Just nerf inject and infestors. also increase roach cost or decrease roach damage so they don't get that much from upgrades and buff hydra. eZ fixes that will make zerg actually require some skill and not just max and amove with fungals Just massively nerf zerg so they can't win, and that way they'll only ever win with skill! + Show Spoiler + moron | ||
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Apples8u
Canada46 Posts
Seriously though, awesome post, I loved the Star Wars references. I think that did it for me. <3 | ||
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CatNzHat
United States1599 Posts
Looks like you put together all of my rants into a less ranty format I believe that the turning point for TvZ was the queen buff, it prevented the hellion openings, terrans lost map control and were forced to play passively (no more safe 2 base timings). This forced both zerg and terran into passive play, leading to infestor brood with zerg having complete map control all game long. | ||
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zheng
United States23 Posts
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Grim Hatter
Poland52 Posts
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Wertheron
France439 Posts
/Sarcasm. How is it possible that TL spotlighted a racist thread like that? | ||
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hillman
United States162 Posts
Is the argument that since queen range was buffed zergs can focus more on economy and thus get more infestors? If so, I think that argument is kind of bogus because queens are still relatively weak against any kind of aggression with teeth. If zergs rely on queens solely for such a long period of time early in the game, then Terrans should be able to engineer something that can counter it. Did zergs just start figuring things out? Zerg seemed to be on the upswing prior to the queen patch and the patch no doubt helped, but I feel like it's kind of silly to say "zergs are winning because of the patch". To be fair, the trend in Code S and Code A has been that zerg has the least amount of representation at the start of the tournaments, but a few standout zergs have been very strong. If you gave the metagame six months without patches I bet Terran would have something worked out. I really hope the author was joking about Blizzard engineering the game to allow foreigners to win...I mean come on, really? | ||
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marttorn
Norway5211 Posts
On December 13 2012 00:31 Wertheron wrote: Science proved that Asian people are more intelligent than white people. White dumb people just can't win, except if Blizz help them. /Sarcasm. How is it possible that TL spotlighted a racist thread like that? Actual results prove that Korean players (as opposed to the far more vague term 'asian people') are better than foreign players, on average, hence the good koreans win the tournaments they go to. So, the article states, blizz make balance changes to dumb down the game to a point where skill matters less and foreigners can win. I'm not sure where racism enters into it. | ||
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Assirra
Belgium4169 Posts
On December 12 2012 16:51 zheng wrote: prabably the best thread i have ever read on tl, and he most well informed and presented also. i tried to make a thread linking yours on blizzard forum and i titled it "state of the game" and it got a few pages instantly then got deleted. Quite obvious since the last part is pure conspiracy and paranoia nonsense. | ||
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CatNzHat
United States1599 Posts
On December 13 2012 00:31 Wertheron wrote: Science proved that Asian people are more intelligent than white people. White dumb people just can't win, except if Blizz help them. /Sarcasm. How is it possible that TL spotlighted a racist thread like that? it's not racist, it's using the koreans as an example of this tip top players, skill wise, and shows (with evidence), how that is true in the context of his argument. It never mentions Asians, just Koreans, never says they are smarter, just says that the very top korean players are better than their foreigner counterparts. This has been considered common knowledge in the Starcraft scene since BW days. | ||
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Hider
Denmark9341 Posts
On December 12 2012 05:15 Big J wrote: Vikings. Many of the games before and after the snipe nerf went to BL/Infestor and Terran could deal with it without snipe. Even more, Terran has an army that beats BL/Infestor. Terran has armies that beat BL/Infestor AND any kind of switch (e.g. Ultralisks) afterwards. They are just terribly hard to reach - since the queen nerf - because BL/Infestor timings hit really early these days. Who are you responding to? Everyone knows vikings don't cut it against fungal + corrupter. Blizzard (hopefully) knew that as well. They had no idea how terrans were going to deal with brood/fungal after the ghosts patch. They just crossted their fungers and hoped for the best. | ||
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Daumen
Germany1073 Posts
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madespecifically
39 Posts
On December 13 2012 10:39 Daumen wrote: I like these graphs, unfortunately the graphs that people like the most are made to be liked the most, often faked ... how accurate are they? The OP listed the games he used to make the graphs, so the graphs very accurately show the glaring balance problem we have been having for the last year. Luckily, even Blizzard reluctantly seems to silently admit they went overboard with zerg (they are patching, aren't they) and now little by little patches will fix it, so we can enjoy dynamic and balanced starcraft once again. | ||
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Quintall
20 Posts
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mclalimace
Canada66 Posts
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On December 13 2012 01:56 Hider wrote: Who are you responding to? Everyone knows vikings don't cut it against fungal + corrupter. Blizzard (hopefully) knew that as well. They had no idea how terrans were going to deal with brood/fungal after the ghosts patch. They just crossted their fungers and hoped for the best. Everyone knows vikings do cut it vs BL/Corruptor and Tanks/Ghost vs Infestors. Blizzard knew that as well. Terrans just closed their eyes and started whining that they weren't able to build a composition that just wins the game against anything anymore. The problem has never been the ghost patch. It's the queen patch and it's implications that made ~15min Broodlords possible in TvZ (compared to the before the patch common ~17min Broodlords, if you rushed them). | ||
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