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On November 30 2012 01:28 neptunusfisk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2012 23:20 Technique wrote:
Why is it again about some guy making videos for noobies instead of actual pro gamers? What? Day9 and Tasteless were great players before they even considered commentating. (But you perhaps don't consider brood war an esport..?) Day9 placed top 16 (he lost to XellOs) in the WCG back in 2004, and he has made it to three WCG USA finals, of which he won one. He also won the Pan-american Championship in 2007. His daily show (which by the way is awesome) began only a few years ago. + Show Spoiler +He also made a charming episode of the very same daily about himself, his brother and their careers. It's absolutely fascinating.
Wasn't the NA scene of bw even more behind than their sc2 scene? Seems to me like they where good amateurs.
Either way, players need to get the attention and should be asked for quotes instead of always asking these so called ''personalities''.
On November 30 2012 01:26 Crownlol wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2012 01:04 Technique wrote:On November 29 2012 23:39 Crownlol wrote:On November 29 2012 10:23 jmbthirteen wrote:On November 29 2012 10:15 Ettick wrote:the top prize in Starcraft II is $25,000 I want one article to be published on a news site without some sort of misinformation in it lol... Interesting article otherwise, I actually thought the number of people who can play sc2 for a living in the USwould have been lower than they said lol... The $25,000 is referring to MLG. And their number isn't about just sc2. Sundance says about 40 people can make a living off playing video games, not just sc2. As long as the community feels entitled to free-everything and complains about PPV and such, it will remain this way. The reason mainstream sports are so rich is because of the immense amount of money invested by fans, and the fact that the NFL is tax-exempt. I move for the MLG and IPL to push for tax-exempt status, instantly boosting profitability by 25-35%. Here's what the IRS says about tax-exempt leagues: "A business league is an association of persons having some common business interest, the purpose of which is to promote such common interest and not to engage in a regular business of a kind ordinarily carried on for profit. Trade associations and professional associations are business leagues. To be exempt, a business league's activities must be devoted to improving business conditions of one or more lines of business as distinguished from performing particular services for individual persons. No part of a business league's net earnings may inure to the benefit of any private shareholder or individual and it may not be organized for profit to engage in an activity ordinarily carried on for profit (even if the business is operated on a cooperative basis or produces only enough income to be self-sustaining). The term line of business generally refers either to an entire industry or to all components of an industry within a geographic area. It does not include a group composed of businesses that market a particular brand within an industry." (Huffingtonpost.com, "Why does the National Football League Deserve Tax-Exempt Status") Thus, classifying eSports leagues as promoting common interest and improving business conditions for one or more lines of business within the industry would make them tax-exempt. This also couldn't be closer to the truth. I have absolutely no problem supporting the industry that has given me so much entertainment- I buy every MLG, I have MLG, IPL and GSL premium subscriptions, and I'm typing this on my Razer mechanical keyboard and clicking my Razer mechanical mouse on my Team Liquid mousepad. Instead of a community outcry when MLG is ten *whole* dollars, perhaps we should just buy tickets like normal people and come together as an industry. Otherwise, we may eventually have to watch it fade away. Biggest sport in the world, football, can actually be enjoyed for free as well. Of course you also got the option to pay for it, so it's pretty similar to esports right now. I don't see the parallel. Football (EU) is huge because of the vast sums of money being spent on it by its global fans. It has reached a maturity where it has become such a massive industry, that yes, sometimes you can watch it for free. However, most sports bars and home users spend extra money for the premium channels. If football stadiums weren't playing to huge crowds, with massive money in merchandising and advertising, you couldn't watch it for free.
Why did you add EU behind football? There is no need for it... It's a worldwide sport and the only sport that is played with the feet and a ball as far as i know.
Either way, i only mentioned that because he somehow acts esports can't work if not everyone is paying for it.
While the ones who do want to pay already do anyway, for the hd quality... sounds like a good system to me.
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I added the EU because my name is labeled USA, and my first post was about NFL football (US). There is absolutely no reason to get all defensive about the US "mislabeling" their sport, when the NFL brings in twice the revenue of the EPL.
You can act all snooty if you want by saying American Football "isn't football", but from a revenue standpoint, you need to combine the top 5 European leagues' revenues to match the NFL.
Additionally, there's probably a hundred sports played with the balls and feet. Here's a cool one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sepak_takraw
I'm not starting an American Football vs European Football debate here (I'm an equal fan of both actually, my stepfather is Irish and my mom is American), but you can't simply fight the nomenclature because it rubs you wrong. Deal with it.
Let's keep this on eSports and not derail the thread.
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On November 30 2012 02:01 Crownlol wrote:I added the EU because my name is labeled USA, and my first post was about NFL football (US). There is absolutely no reason to get all defensive about the US "mislabeling" their sport, when the NFL brings in twice the revenue of the EPL.
You can act all snooty if you want by saying American Football "isn't football", but from a revenue standpoint, you need to combine the top 5 European leagues' revenues to match the NFL.Additionally, there's probably a hundred sports played with the balls and feet. Here's a cool one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sepak_takrawI'm not starting an American Football vs European Football debate here (I'm an equal fan of both actually, my stepfather is Irish and my mom is American), but you can't simply fight the nomenclature because it rubs you wrong. Deal with it. Let's keep this on eSports and not derail the thread.
What does revenue have to do with anything?
Besides i really don't think you want to act like American rugby brings in more revenue than football do you? :D
Also i still don't get why you try to make this a EU vs NA thing.... Football is worldwide...
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On November 29 2012 21:34 krutopatkin wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2012 16:23 lim1017 wrote:
no one mentions the fact that the picture is of league?... huh? it doesnt only cover starcraft 2, but esports in general.
esports in general is a waste, starcraft2 is the only thing that matters now. Then in a decade or so it'll be starcraft3.
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Interesting article, however it's missing very important information. No mention of Korean eSports? The guys have been doing professional TV shows and insanely popular events for more than a decade. They built the thing, and they developed it. They have players that are disgustingly rich. By reading this article, you'd think that eSports is a recent small-scale NA-only phenomenon. As a lambda reader, I cannot get the full picture and that's very unfortunate.
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On November 30 2012 02:18 DanLee wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2012 21:34 krutopatkin wrote:On November 29 2012 16:23 lim1017 wrote:
no one mentions the fact that the picture is of league?... huh? it doesnt only cover starcraft 2, but esports in general. esports in general is a waste, starcraft2 is the only thing that matters now. Then in a decade or so it'll be starcraft3.
Hahaha what?
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On November 30 2012 02:18 Technique wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2012 02:01 Crownlol wrote:I added the EU because my name is labeled USA, and my first post was about NFL football (US). There is absolutely no reason to get all defensive about the US "mislabeling" their sport, when the NFL brings in twice the revenue of the EPL.
You can act all snooty if you want by saying American Football "isn't football", but from a revenue standpoint, you need to combine the top 5 European leagues' revenues to match the NFL.Additionally, there's probably a hundred sports played with the balls and feet. Here's a cool one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sepak_takrawI'm not starting an American Football vs European Football debate here (I'm an equal fan of both actually, my stepfather is Irish and my mom is American), but you can't simply fight the nomenclature because it rubs you wrong. Deal with it. Let's keep this on eSports and not derail the thread. What does revenue have to do with anything? Besides i really don't think you want to act like American rugby brings in more revenue than football do you? :D Also i still don't get why you try to make this a EU vs NA thing.... Football is worldwide...
I wasn't making it an NA vs EU thing, I was pointing out that I didn't appreciate the ignorant arrogance of his post to claim that a 10billion dollar industry was somehow wrong in naming their product. Seems silly.
I assume DanLee is trolling.
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On November 30 2012 02:23 Crownlol wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2012 02:18 Technique wrote:On November 30 2012 02:01 Crownlol wrote:I added the EU because my name is labeled USA, and my first post was about NFL football (US). There is absolutely no reason to get all defensive about the US "mislabeling" their sport, when the NFL brings in twice the revenue of the EPL.
You can act all snooty if you want by saying American Football "isn't football", but from a revenue standpoint, you need to combine the top 5 European leagues' revenues to match the NFL.Additionally, there's probably a hundred sports played with the balls and feet. Here's a cool one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sepak_takrawI'm not starting an American Football vs European Football debate here (I'm an equal fan of both actually, my stepfather is Irish and my mom is American), but you can't simply fight the nomenclature because it rubs you wrong. Deal with it. Let's keep this on eSports and not derail the thread. What does revenue have to do with anything? Besides i really don't think you want to act like American rugby brings in more revenue than football do you? :D Also i still don't get why you try to make this a EU vs NA thing.... Football is worldwide... I wasn't making it an NA vs EU thing, I was pointing out that I didn't appreciate the ignorant arrogance of his post to claim that a 10billion dollar industry was somehow wrong in naming their product. Seems silly. I assume DanLee is trolling.
So why is it called after the most popular sport in the world?
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On November 30 2012 02:38 Technique wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2012 02:23 Crownlol wrote:On November 30 2012 02:18 Technique wrote:On November 30 2012 02:01 Crownlol wrote:I added the EU because my name is labeled USA, and my first post was about NFL football (US). There is absolutely no reason to get all defensive about the US "mislabeling" their sport, when the NFL brings in twice the revenue of the EPL.
You can act all snooty if you want by saying American Football "isn't football", but from a revenue standpoint, you need to combine the top 5 European leagues' revenues to match the NFL.Additionally, there's probably a hundred sports played with the balls and feet. Here's a cool one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sepak_takrawI'm not starting an American Football vs European Football debate here (I'm an equal fan of both actually, my stepfather is Irish and my mom is American), but you can't simply fight the nomenclature because it rubs you wrong. Deal with it. Let's keep this on eSports and not derail the thread. What does revenue have to do with anything? Besides i really don't think you want to act like American rugby brings in more revenue than football do you? :D Also i still don't get why you try to make this a EU vs NA thing.... Football is worldwide... I wasn't making it an NA vs EU thing, I was pointing out that I didn't appreciate the ignorant arrogance of his post to claim that a 10billion dollar industry was somehow wrong in naming their product. Seems silly. I assume DanLee is trolling. So why is it called after the most popular sport in the world?
Because we are American and we don't give a shit. Capiche?
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On November 30 2012 02:38 Technique wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2012 02:23 Crownlol wrote:On November 30 2012 02:18 Technique wrote:On November 30 2012 02:01 Crownlol wrote:I added the EU because my name is labeled USA, and my first post was about NFL football (US). There is absolutely no reason to get all defensive about the US "mislabeling" their sport, when the NFL brings in twice the revenue of the EPL.
You can act all snooty if you want by saying American Football "isn't football", but from a revenue standpoint, you need to combine the top 5 European leagues' revenues to match the NFL.Additionally, there's probably a hundred sports played with the balls and feet. Here's a cool one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sepak_takrawI'm not starting an American Football vs European Football debate here (I'm an equal fan of both actually, my stepfather is Irish and my mom is American), but you can't simply fight the nomenclature because it rubs you wrong. Deal with it. Let's keep this on eSports and not derail the thread. What does revenue have to do with anything? Besides i really don't think you want to act like American rugby brings in more revenue than football do you? :D Also i still don't get why you try to make this a EU vs NA thing.... Football is worldwide... I wasn't making it an NA vs EU thing, I was pointing out that I didn't appreciate the ignorant arrogance of his post to claim that a 10billion dollar industry was somehow wrong in naming their product. Seems silly. I assume DanLee is trolling. So why is it called after the most popular sport in the world?
Thread derailed. Let's take the topic back to paying money for eSports stuff.
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I thought Day[9]'s mother was a medical doctor...
Oh well, it's nice to know that big journalism publishers don't just publish biased articles about SC2, and instead they actually post fairly accurate pieces of work.
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On November 29 2012 23:39 Crownlol wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2012 10:23 jmbthirteen wrote:On November 29 2012 10:15 Ettick wrote:the top prize in Starcraft II is $25,000 I want one article to be published on a news site without some sort of misinformation in it lol... Interesting article otherwise, I actually thought the number of people who can play sc2 for a living in the USwould have been lower than they said lol... The $25,000 is referring to MLG. And their number isn't about just sc2. Sundance says about 40 people can make a living off playing video games, not just sc2. As long as the community feels entitled to free-everything and complains about PPV and such, it will remain this way. The reason mainstream sports are so rich is because of the immense amount of money invested by fans, and the fact that the NFL is tax-exempt. I move for the MLG and IPL to push for tax-exempt status, instantly boosting profitability by 25-35%. Here's what the IRS says about tax-exempt leagues: "A business league is an association of persons having some common business interest, the purpose of which is to promote such common interest and not to engage in a regular business of a kind ordinarily carried on for profit. Trade associations and professional associations are business leagues. To be exempt, a business league's activities must be devoted to improving business conditions of one or more lines of business as distinguished from performing particular services for individual persons. No part of a business league's net earnings may inure to the benefit of any private shareholder or individual and it may not be organized for profit to engage in an activity ordinarily carried on for profit (even if the business is operated on a cooperative basis or produces only enough income to be self-sustaining). The term line of business generally refers either to an entire industry or to all components of an industry within a geographic area. It does not include a group composed of businesses that market a particular brand within an industry." (Huffingtonpost.com, "Why does the National Football League Deserve Tax-Exempt Status") Thus, classifying eSports leagues as promoting common interest and improving business conditions for one or more lines of business within the industry would make them tax-exempt. This also couldn't be closer to the truth. I have absolutely no problem supporting the industry that has given me so much entertainment- I buy every MLG, I have MLG, IPL and GSL premium subscriptions, and I'm typing this on my Razer mechanical keyboard and clicking my Razer mechanical mouse on my Team Liquid mousepad. Instead of a community outcry when MLG is ten *whole* dollars, perhaps we should just buy tickets like normal people and come together as an industry. Otherwise, we may eventually have to watch it fade away.
Advertising and sponsors bring ten fold the money that the actual consumers bring. The more consumers the more appealing the medium is in the eyes of the advertisers. True consumers bring in their share through purchase of apparel and memorabilia but ticket prizes count really only a marginal amount of the total sum raized in any such event/business.
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On November 29 2012 10:50 KH1031 wrote:
On a somewhat unrelated side note - I remember Artosis used to number his hotkeys Ctrl+1234567890 for his command center. He did this keyboard swipe thing.
He still does this. You can hear it whenever he streams his ladder games on Twitch (which he hasn't done for a while, admittedly...)
I liked this article. It was realistic about the current position of eSports without being dismissive or condescending.
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On November 30 2012 02:23 Crownlol wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2012 02:18 Technique wrote:On November 30 2012 02:01 Crownlol wrote:I added the EU because my name is labeled USA, and my first post was about NFL football (US). There is absolutely no reason to get all defensive about the US "mislabeling" their sport, when the NFL brings in twice the revenue of the EPL.
You can act all snooty if you want by saying American Football "isn't football", but from a revenue standpoint, you need to combine the top 5 European leagues' revenues to match the NFL.Additionally, there's probably a hundred sports played with the balls and feet. Here's a cool one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sepak_takrawI'm not starting an American Football vs European Football debate here (I'm an equal fan of both actually, my stepfather is Irish and my mom is American), but you can't simply fight the nomenclature because it rubs you wrong. Deal with it. Let's keep this on eSports and not derail the thread. What does revenue have to do with anything? Besides i really don't think you want to act like American rugby brings in more revenue than football do you? :D Also i still don't get why you try to make this a EU vs NA thing.... Football is worldwide... I wasn't making it an NA vs EU thing, I was pointing out that I didn't appreciate the ignorant arrogance of his post to claim that a 10billion dollar industry was somehow wrong in naming their product. Seems silly. I assume DanLee is trolling.
wtf... you assume wrong.
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On November 30 2012 01:43 Technique wrote:
Wasn't the NA scene of bw even more behind than their sc2 scene? Seems to me like they where good amateurs.
Either way, players need to get the attention and should be asked for quotes instead of always asking these so called ''personalities''.
You could argue a few of the popular casters are a bit overhyped, but seriously. I'm not a big fan of Day9, but I have to say this; he is legit. He's basically played Starcraft (both the real game and the sequel) seriously since forever. If you stopped whining and actually listened to what he is saying during his (non-newbie-tuesday) shows, you would realise how well he knows the game and the scene.
But, yes, let's interview Korean 16-year-olds that started with starcraft 2 a few months ago and haven't seen anything of the business other than their current team and that tournament they did well in. That would probably be interesting for a non-interested American audience as well.
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On November 30 2012 05:59 neptunusfisk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2012 01:43 Technique wrote:
Wasn't the NA scene of bw even more behind than their sc2 scene? Seems to me like they where good amateurs.
Either way, players need to get the attention and should be asked for quotes instead of always asking these so called ''personalities''. You could argue a few of the popular casters are a bit overhyped, but seriously. I'm not a big fan of Day9, but I have to say this; he is legit. He's basically played Starcraft (both the real game and the sequel) seriously since forever. If you stopped whining and actually listened to what he is saying during his (non-newbie-tuesday) shows, you would realise how well he knows the game and the scene. But, yes, let's interview Korean 16-year-olds that started with starcraft 2 a few months ago and haven't seen anything of the business other than their current team and that tournament they did well in. That would probably be interesting for a non-interested American audience as well.
About 2 years ago (while I was master back then I was absolutely awfull) I kinda realized how newb-oriented his comments were. It seemed to me that he hadn't realized that most players by then (roughly 4 months after release) had finally figured out most of the basic RTS elements, and for non-newb players his comments are of little use. I'd say my skill level was probably close to gold-players of today or so, so unless he has improved his commentary by a lot, I think most gold-leaguers or above will be much better of playing the actual game rather than his commentaries if they want to improve.
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My favorite part:
A well-known team franchise like Evil Geniuses — considered the Yankees of pro gaming — can dole out lucrative contracts
Hahaha, so does that make Team Liquid the Red Sox of pro gaming?
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On November 30 2012 07:14 Hider wrote:
I think most gold-leaguers or above will be much better of playing the actual game rather than his commentaries if they want to improve.
Actually anyone will improve much faster by actually playing instead of watching anything.
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I wish Momma Plott was their manager. Sick writeup.
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On November 30 2012 05:59 neptunusfisk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2012 01:43 Technique wrote:
Wasn't the NA scene of bw even more behind than their sc2 scene? Seems to me like they where good amateurs.
Either way, players need to get the attention and should be asked for quotes instead of always asking these so called ''personalities''. You could argue a few of the popular casters are a bit overhyped, but seriously. I'm not a big fan of Day9, but I have to say this; he is legit. He's basically played Starcraft (both the real game and the sequel) seriously since forever. If you stopped whining and actually listened to what he is saying during his (non-newbie-tuesday) shows, you would realise how well he knows the game and the scene. But, yes, let's interview Korean 16-year-olds that started with starcraft 2 a few months ago and haven't seen anything of the business other than their current team and that tournament they did well in. That would probably be interesting for a non-interested American audience as well.
Any actual player would be better...
Could ask someone like Idra or WhiteRa for quotes if you don't want to ask Koreans (which is silly tbh).
And no i won't listen to day[9], he's very fake in his whole demeanor.
I skip any event he casts tbh... and the moaning... omg...
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EPT
