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poorcloud
Singapore2748 Posts
On November 12 2012 14:12 DidYuhim wrote: So, nothing to do in StarCraft 2 until BWC finishes. Thanks, DB. Agree with this. Hate to be a whiner but the quality of games have really dropped for me. Blizzard reacted too quickly to nerf the tools that other races had but somehow taking their time on this. | ||
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SarcasmMonster
3136 Posts
On November 12 2012 14:12 DidYuhim wrote: So, nothing to do in StarCraft 2 until BWC finishes. Thanks, DB. It's only 5 days. | ||
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TimENT
United States1425 Posts
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Ballistixz
United States1269 Posts
On November 12 2012 12:09 xAdra wrote: To the zergs still defending infestors: I really want to know. Do you actually find them fun to watch? Do you find some sick pleasure in seeing P/T units unable to move, taking heavy damage, and being raped by broodlords? Do you actually feel proud for your pros, marvelling at the skill they needed to cast that simple spell (taking up no more than 2, maybe 3 actions)? Do you find it cool when the zergs are completely outplayed for the whole game, yet can have a ball to move across the map and kill the opponent, without so much as repeatedly using an aoe stunning spell on already stunned units? Honestly, I couldn't care less about racial distributions in tournaments, or ladder distributions (which actually matter even less). If Zerg games were fun to watch, I'd be okay. As it stands now, only Leenock is remotely "fun" to watch, and that's because his early game aggression is innovative and skill-full, as opposed to the other zergs who just turtle to infestor broodlord, then win with minimal micro while the other player is forced to have perfect play, or else die. Terran at least has a composition that can go head to head with infestor/bl, even if it takes MUCH more micro to use than the simple amove+fungal composition. Protoss has to rely on the coin flippy vortex, which relies on the zerg being dumb enough to not neural or fungal the slow as crap mothership, or the zerg messing up significantly by clumping all the units together. Right now, infestors are neither cool, balanced, fair, interesting, fun to watch, or require skill to use. I would fully support nerfing them to the ground and buffing less powerful zerg units, such as hydralisks and ultralisks. do u find watching someone massing tanks and marines fun? do u find watching toss players massing a bunch of colos and A moving to win fun? do u find watching archon toilet fun? exactly let me put it like this to all of u infestor haters so u can understand how the zerg race works. play a few games as zerg against a serious protoss or terran player WITHOUT making a single infestor. once you do that come back and tell me all of the stupid and utterly digusting ways u have lost the game purely because u didnt make infestors. | ||
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lbmaian
United States689 Posts
On November 12 2012 14:14 TimENT wrote: DB, whatever "data" you get, please ignore it. Watch the last 50 tournaments AND read the comments. Fungals are ruining SC2. ...so you're telling DB to ignore the data from the last 50 tournaments and comments? | ||
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TimENT
United States1425 Posts
On November 12 2012 14:21 lbmaian wrote: ...so you're telling DB to ignore the data from the last 50 tournaments and comments? No...they look at overall tournament/ladder data for all the races. | ||
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Celestia
Mexico376 Posts
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Ballistixz
United States1269 Posts
On November 12 2012 14:14 TimENT wrote: DB, whatever "data" you get, please ignore it. Watch the last 50 tournaments AND read the comments. Fungals are ruining SC2. please stop posting BS. fungals are not ruining SC2. atm infestors are to zerg as sentires are to protoss. force fields have needed a nerf for ages yet they cant do anything about it because of how flawed this fucking game is. having 1 single unit be the back bone of an entire race, as is the case with sentry and infestor, was a stupid idea from day 1. | ||
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SniXSniPe
United States1938 Posts
On November 12 2012 14:19 Ballistixz wrote: do u find watching someone massing tanks and marines fun? do u find watching toss players massing a bunch of colos and A moving to win fun? do u find watching archon toilet fun? exactly let me put it like this to all of u infestor haters so u can understand how the zerg race works. play a few games as zerg against a serious protoss or terran player WITHOUT making a single infestor. once you do that come back and tell me all of the stupid and utterly digusting ways u have lost the game purely because u didnt make infestors. Okay, I've beaten protoss/Terrans as Zerg without infestors a number of times. What is your point? It's not impossible, although it may be more difficult depending on the scenario. Don't even try using marine/tank in a comparison vs infestors. Marine/tank is far more interesting to watch because there is a higher degree of skill involved in positioning and control vs infestors. | ||
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rd
United States2586 Posts
On November 12 2012 14:14 poorcloud wrote: Agree with this. Hate to be a whiner but the quality of games have really dropped for me. Blizzard reacted too quickly to nerf the tools that other races had but somehow taking their time on this. Therefore every patch then onwards must be nerfed with the same disregard for balance, out of spite, and simply because the community has been exceptionally vocal in their whine? How about the previous overreaction nerfs were mistakes which should stop, starting here. People will whine over anything now. | ||
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Arco
United States2090 Posts
Props to Blizzard for finally acknowledging and being so transparent with their thinking regarding the Infestor. I'm eager to see the change happen, but I don't want to see the pro players who put so much time into the game get screwed over. | ||
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haka
United States1414 Posts
On November 12 2012 14:19 Ballistixz wrote: do u find watching someone massing tanks and marines fun? do u find watching toss players massing a bunch of colos and A moving to win fun? do u find watching archon toilet fun? exactly You may not be addressing me, but I like seeing what players DO with their tanks, marines, colossi, and whatever else. Also, you're not addressing the core of the argument which is that fungal growth, as it stands, is not fun to watch. A player selects an infestor, clicks fungal, the fungal lands, things turn green, another fungal lands, things turn green, another fungal lands, more things turn green, another fungal lands, everything dies. That being said, I find it hilarious when casters use a positive adjective with fungal. Yeah, yeah, they're trying to hype up the games, but man... no matter who the player is, I can never get up and cheer like I can for a well-placed storm or emp. | ||
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Mataza
Germany5364 Posts
On November 12 2012 14:24 Ballistixz wrote: please stop posting BS. fungals are not ruining SC2. Just to chime in: What composition doesn´t get totally screwed over by fungals? For anti air, you don´t make hydras, you make infestor. For harass, you burrow infestors into the enemy base. For base defense, keep 1-2 infestors at home. For defense against midgame armies, infestor. It is evident that something else needs to be buffed when the infestor isn´t the "one size fits all" unit anymore. You wouldn´t say the marine are awesome and balanced because right now terran rely on its strength, would you? | ||
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Ballistixz
United States1269 Posts
On November 12 2012 14:25 SniXSniPe wrote: Okay, I've beaten protoss/Terrans as Zerg without infestors a number of times. What is your point? It's not impossible, although it may be more difficult depending on the scenario. Don't even try using marine/tank in a comparison vs infestors. Marine/tank is far more interesting to watch because there is a higher degree of skill involved in positioning and control vs infestors. positioning siege tanks behind ur army and then leaving them there to siege takes skill? once u position siege tanks u pretty much dont have to worry about them as long as u have an army to support them. infestors however u have to constantly worry about. and marines are just not interesting to watch sorry. sure they may have there burst of good moments like splitting against banelings, but u can say the same thing about infestors. neither unit is interesting to watch unless a pro player utilizes them in a good way. | ||
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TimENT
United States1425 Posts
On November 12 2012 14:31 Mataza wrote: Just to chime in: What composition doesn´t get totally screwed over by fungals? For anti air, you don´t make hydras, you make infestor. For harass, you burrow infestors into the enemy base. For base defense, keep 1-2 infestors at home. For defense against midgame armies, infestor. It is evident that something else needs to be buffed when the infestor isn´t the "one size fits all" unit anymore. You wouldn´t say the marine are awesome and balanced because right now terran rely on its strength, would you? Reason! This man sees reason! On November 12 2012 14:32 Ballistixz wrote: positioning siege tanks behind ur army and then leaving them there to siege takes skill? once u position siege tanks u pretty much dont have to worry about them as long as u have an army to support them. infestors however u have to constantly worry about. and marines are just not interesting to watch sorry. sure they may have there burst of good moments like splitting against banelings, but u can say the same thing about infestors. neither unit is interesting to watch unless a pro player utilizes them in a good way. ROFL you have no idea how Terran works if you think Terran players leave siege tanks after they are positioned ROFL get out bro. | ||
Whitewing
United States7483 Posts
On November 12 2012 14:19 Ballistixz wrote: do u find watching someone massing tanks and marines fun? do u find watching toss players massing a bunch of colos and A moving to win fun? do u find watching archon toilet fun? exactly let me put it like this to all of u infestor haters so u can understand how the zerg race works. play a few games as zerg against a serious protoss or terran player WITHOUT making a single infestor. once you do that come back and tell me all of the stupid and utterly digusting ways u have lost the game purely because u didnt make infestors. Nobody is saying you should play completely infestorless, just that they shouldn't be as overpowered as they are. Sheesh, the amount of over-reacting in this thread is ridiculous. A unit being nerfed doesn't mean it doesn't exist anymore or that you can never build it again. It's like if blizzard released a unit that does 1,000 dps at range 30 with full map vision, then decided to nerf it to 50 dps at range 10 with a normal vision range. That's a massive nerf, but that unit is still very strong. | ||
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Ballistixz
United States1269 Posts
On November 12 2012 14:31 Mataza wrote: Just to chime in: What composition doesn´t get totally screwed over by fungals? For anti air, you don´t make hydras, you make infestor. For harass, you burrow infestors into the enemy base. For base defense, keep 1-2 infestors at home. For defense against midgame armies, infestor. It is evident that something else needs to be buffed when the infestor isn´t the "one size fits all" unit anymore. You wouldn´t say the marine are awesome and balanced because right now terran rely on its strength, would you? What composition doesn´t get totally screwed over by fungals? thats a easy one. the protoss death ball. For anti air, you don´t make hydras, you make infestor. no shit, hydras are the worse unit in the entire game right now. and it just so happens that it is our only form of ground to air AA unit aside from infestors. For harass, you burrow infestors into the enemy base. zergs are capable of many types of harassment. drops, mutas, nydus, baneling run bys, ling run bys, etc. why do u just solo out infestor as the only form of harassment? For base defense, keep 1-2 infestors at home. 1-2 infestors is not going to defend an entire base unless u are stupid with ur medivacs and dont pay attention when u are dropping. that means not shift clicking + forget medivacs into a base. -_- For defense against midgame armies, infestor. lets pretend infestors dont exist. what are zergs suppose to make against to combat death ball armies or marine+marauder+tank armies? | ||
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Jimbo77
139 Posts
Give a hydra speed upgrade at a hive and nerf infestor to death. Million problems solved - playability, balance, fun-to-watch, creativity (you will have to start to think what unit to build, not just mass one that serves to everything!!!) db is a simple noob. | ||
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TimENT
United States1425 Posts
On November 12 2012 14:38 Ballistixz wrote: thats a easy one. the protoss death ball. no shit, hydras are the worse unit in the entire game right now. and it just so happens that it is our only form of ground to air AA unit aside from infestors. zergs are capable of many types of harassment. drops, mutas, nydus, baneling run bys, ling run bys, etc. why do u just solo out infestor as the only form of harassment? 1-2 infestors is not going to defend an entire base unless u are stupid with ur medivacs and dont pay attention when u are dropping. that means not shift clicking + forget medivacs into a base. -_- lets pretend infestors dont exist. what are zergs suppose to make against to combat death ball armies or marine+marauder+tank armies? Do you play/watch SC2? 1. The Protoss deathball dies to fungals+broods 100% of the time if there isn't a lucky vortex 2. Ye, nerf infestors and buff hydras 3. Except, infestors are better at harassing than basically all of those 4. Yes, 2 infestors is good enough to stop any harass because creep spread+overlords show everything, and infested terran+fungal stops everything. 5. This is the thing that is probably confusing Blizzard right now. Players like DRG and Leenock can still rape with muta ling bling, but other zergs are too busy loling their way to victory with infestors. | ||
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whatevername
471 Posts
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