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Destiny on where he thinks SC2 is heading. - Page 59

Forum Index > SC2 General
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ljd1131
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
Australia83 Posts
October 18 2012 03:37 GMT
#1161
Sc2 is really getting to a point where everything is getting figured out in wings and it's starting to show how awfully designed the game is zvz can get to a point where if you attack in lategame if'ts prety much saying it's a auto loss,attacking into BL/infestor static. Zvp Late game is already so stupid I really can't handle playing these boring games
Natespank
Profile Joined November 2011
Canada449 Posts
October 18 2012 03:46 GMT
#1162
I wrote an critical article on starcraft and I got banned. Nice work, morons. Your censorship doesn't change the fact that the game is fucked up and needs help.

(awaiting next ban, I don't really care anymore. 1 week next time? forever? suck it.)

User was banned for this post.
TheTenthDoc
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9561 Posts
October 18 2012 03:53 GMT
#1163
On October 18 2012 10:59 joeschmo wrote:
Kill the deathball for a great game.


Can't kill the "deathball" without reconfiguring pathing or killing the sacred cow of macro games.
shizaep
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Canada2920 Posts
October 18 2012 03:54 GMT
#1164
On October 18 2012 12:32 Mackus wrote:
Hi guys just a quick suggestion - If Blizzard scrapped the 200/200 deathballs would you be happy with that and that's it beside the new Units?


One does not simply "scrap" the 200/200 deathballs. A lot of fundamental changes (such as"worse" pathing, which Blizzard said is a no-no) would have to be made in order for gameplay to shift to a less deathball-centered direction.
You mean I just write stuff here and other people can see it?
coolcor
Profile Joined February 2011
520 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-18 03:58:52
October 18 2012 03:56 GMT
#1165
I wanted to ask about Artosis's point here

“Something about the way races are supposed to be, and how Protoss is a mere shadow of its former self”

I’ve seen arguments and threads (especially when people were unhappy with the power of Protoss in early HotS) about Protoss not being the race with big heavy hitters like its supposed to be. WHAT? If you look at SC1, Terran was the least mobile race, normally sitting around turtling nonstop, getting an insanely good mech army up to fight against itself or Protoss. Hell, even sometimes against Zerg. And even against Zerg, the overall standard was to wait for a Science Vessel and 3 Tanks before really doing very much. Yet people welcomed moving around the map all game with Marines and Marauders. The Marauder has nothing to do with the “flavor” of what Terran was in SC1.


Didn't the marauder get quite a lot of hate from the community for not fitting in including from artosis? I seem to remember him saying during a cast that the less he sees of the marauder used the more he wanted to switch to terran but I could be mistaken. And the main complaint of the warhound was that it was a super marauder that fit terran mech even less wasn't it? (mobile high hp unit with little micro required to deal lots of damage. Biggest weakness is can't shoot air)

I'm pretty sure all three races have gotten complaints for not fitting the flavor of broodwar. Protoss just gets the most calls for a redesign due to the protoss match ups seeming to always have more problems than the other 3 in terms of being interesting to play or watch. For example 4-gate, colossus(most disliked unit design?) wars in pvp, turtle deathball style, 1-1-1, vortex deciding the entire game.

I think artosis focused too much on defending the balance of the hots units rather then how they make the game more fun to play or watch with more constant action, less deathball, more chances for pros to show skill in micro or macro. And he didn't address destiny's point that sc2 needed to be better attracting casual gamers (with better support for the UMS scene to become big like bw and and wc3 not necessarily by making 1v1 easier) in order to compete with the MOBAs.

And why is it so hard to figure out when broodwar released for the pros they got this wrong on ITG also??? (it was less than a year after sc came out)
Csong
Profile Joined March 2012
Canada396 Posts
October 18 2012 03:56 GMT
#1166
no... i think its more like we need more kinds of rocks thatd make the game better!
BoxingKangaroo
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
Japan955 Posts
October 18 2012 03:59 GMT
#1167
On October 18 2012 12:32 Mackus wrote:
Hi guys just a quick suggestion - If Blizzard scrapped the 200/200 deathballs would you be happy with that and that's it beside the new Units?


You missed the point. The 'deathball' isn't the reason the casuals are being turned off the game. If anything, getting rid of the deathball will make it harder for casuals (they can't 1a anymore).
nevermindthebollocks
Profile Joined October 2012
United States116 Posts
October 18 2012 04:02 GMT
#1168
On October 18 2012 12:54 shizaep wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 18 2012 12:32 Mackus wrote:
Hi guys just a quick suggestion - If Blizzard scrapped the 200/200 deathballs would you be happy with that and that's it beside the new Units?


One does not simply "scrap" the 200/200 deathballs. A lot of fundamental changes (such as"worse" pathing, which Blizzard said is a no-no) would have to be made in order for gameplay to shift to a less deathball-centered direction.

i think simple buffs to aoe attacks could do it. expand colssi and more damage for siege and larger fungals and quicker nukes and ht storms that move and banes that can leap forward and people will stop moving things in a single ball
Anarchy!
nevermindthebollocks
Profile Joined October 2012
United States116 Posts
October 18 2012 04:04 GMT
#1169
On October 18 2012 12:26 Too_MuchZerg wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 18 2012 10:39 NMHU. wrote:
Dan Stemkoski Dan StemkoskiCertifié ‏@Artosis

My opinions on some of the negativity going around. http://tmblr.co/ZKN0pwVVGwsl


BASED ARTOSIS.


Every GSL caster obviously says SC2 is awesome game etc and complains other games. Why kill their profession where they get paid by saying negative about it.

they have very high incentive to see the game last decades
Anarchy!
LeSamourai
Profile Joined August 2012
United States15 Posts
October 18 2012 04:04 GMT
#1170
I really like Sheth's response to Artosis. I feel like the only way to really force a response from Blizzard is if they were flooded with e-mails daily, otherwise, we probably won't see the changes we've been waiting so long for.
quainter
Profile Joined September 2012
81 Posts
October 18 2012 04:11 GMT
#1171
Right from the start the problem lies with David Kim/Browder. They've screwed up big time thinking that SC2 should be THE competitive game where 1v1 is EVERYTHING and all focus is on unit balance and composition. What happened to making the game fun? It seems like in the process of trying to make the ultimate balanced RTS, they've sucked all creativity and inspiration out of the game. Even HOTS is just mostly little tweaks to fix the game balance.

bokeevboke
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Singapore1674 Posts
October 18 2012 04:13 GMT
#1172
On October 18 2012 10:39 NMHU. wrote:
Dan Stemkoski Dan StemkoskiCertifié ‏@Artosis

My opinions on some of the negativity going around. http://tmblr.co/ZKN0pwVVGwsl


BASED ARTOSIS.


His points are only from competitive player's perspective. I as a casual player want the game to be fun. I don't want to know and execute a perfectly-timed-surgical-micro build to counter a simple unit as a warhound. This is not fun. It basically says one has to 1-a and the other has to work his ass off to survive it. This is not how you attract casuals, and casuals, are the base for successful esports game these days. sad but true.
Its grack
TheTenthDoc
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9561 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-18 04:19:42
October 18 2012 04:17 GMT
#1173
On October 18 2012 13:02 nevermindthebollocks wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 18 2012 12:54 shizaep wrote:
On October 18 2012 12:32 Mackus wrote:
Hi guys just a quick suggestion - If Blizzard scrapped the 200/200 deathballs would you be happy with that and that's it beside the new Units?


One does not simply "scrap" the 200/200 deathballs. A lot of fundamental changes (such as"worse" pathing, which Blizzard said is a no-no) would have to be made in order for gameplay to shift to a less deathball-centered direction.

i think simple buffs to aoe attacks could do it. expand colssi and more damage for siege and larger fungals and quicker nukes and ht storms that move and banes that can leap forward and people will stop moving things in a single ball


So you're saying that in order to kill the deathball we should buff all the units that make their race's deathballs powerful? Don't see that working out.

Look, people need to realize that their insistence on long drawn-out macro games on huge maps is completely at odds with killing deathballs. That's just how it is, you're not going to have both without some incredible redesigning in pathing and resource accumulation going on.

At least games on Steppes were fun to watch.
phodacbiet
Profile Joined August 2010
United States1740 Posts
October 18 2012 04:20 GMT
#1174
On October 18 2012 13:13 bokeevboke wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 18 2012 10:39 NMHU. wrote:
Dan Stemkoski Dan StemkoskiCertifié ‏@Artosis

My opinions on some of the negativity going around. http://tmblr.co/ZKN0pwVVGwsl


BASED ARTOSIS.


His points are only from competitive player's perspective. I as a casual player want the game to be fun. I don't want to know and execute a perfectly-timed-surgical-micro build to counter a simple unit as a warhound. This is not fun. It basically says one has to 1-a and the other has to work his ass off to survive it. This is not how you attract casuals, and casuals, are the base for successful esports game these days. sad but true.


No, his point is someone who wants to keep his job. He knows that if SC2 dies he will be jobless (unless he switches to LoL). He is just trying to do some damage control and usually I would pick his point over Destiny, but this "give it time" thing isnt happening. They said give WoL time for it to be figured out and what did blizzard do? Screw up TvZ, screw up bnet UI, basically, the only thing they are doing seems to be researching different type of rocks for us to destroy.
tubs
Profile Joined March 2010
764 Posts
October 18 2012 04:20 GMT
#1175
I couldn't really pinpoint the reason why I stopped playing SC2, but Destiny's explanation really opened my eyes. I thought it was just BNET 2.0 that I hated, but there was more to it than that. Pretty much agree with everything he said.

Valve is about the only gaming company that seems to have a clue these days, which is a bloody shame. I miss the old Blizzard.
"Roach dies to immortal and rockit black guy" - Tierdal.thex
shizaep
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Canada2920 Posts
October 18 2012 04:23 GMT
#1176
On October 18 2012 13:17 TheTenthDoc wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 18 2012 13:02 nevermindthebollocks wrote:
On October 18 2012 12:54 shizaep wrote:
On October 18 2012 12:32 Mackus wrote:
Hi guys just a quick suggestion - If Blizzard scrapped the 200/200 deathballs would you be happy with that and that's it beside the new Units?


One does not simply "scrap" the 200/200 deathballs. A lot of fundamental changes (such as"worse" pathing, which Blizzard said is a no-no) would have to be made in order for gameplay to shift to a less deathball-centered direction.

i think simple buffs to aoe attacks could do it. expand colssi and more damage for siege and larger fungals and quicker nukes and ht storms that move and banes that can leap forward and people will stop moving things in a single ball


So you're saying that in order to kill the deathball we should buff all the units that make their race's deathballs powerful? Don't see that working out.

Look, people need to realize that their insistence on long drawn-out macro games on huge maps is completely at odds with killing deathballs. That's just how it is, you're not going to have both without some incredible redesigning in pathing and resource accumulation going on.

At least games on Steppes were fun to watch.

But they sure as hell were not fun to play. And literally never winning as zerg was also a bit of a bummer. There are multiple directions for SC2 to head in but bringing back Steppes of War is not one of them.
You mean I just write stuff here and other people can see it?
Mackus
Profile Joined January 2011
England1681 Posts
October 18 2012 04:29 GMT
#1177
On October 18 2012 12:59 BoxingKangaroo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 18 2012 12:32 Mackus wrote:
Hi guys just a quick suggestion - If Blizzard scrapped the 200/200 deathballs would you be happy with that and that's it beside the new Units?


You missed the point. The 'deathball' isn't the reason the casuals are being turned off the game. If anything, getting rid of the deathball will make it harder for casuals (they can't 1a anymore).


Blizzard have said from day #1 that the game should be easy to learn but hard to master and it's still the case right now, yes there's alot of highlighting issues which aren't being addressed but the majority of people are just bandwagoning without a legitimate reason, if you want the game to grow - Bitching about the game is gonna repel viewers away. I love the game but right now knowing the community are too busy half-assed about something in 2 years time and it's really off-putting :/
rysecake
Profile Joined October 2010
United States2632 Posts
October 18 2012 04:36 GMT
#1178
it'll be interesting to see how many people buy hots
The Notorious Winkles
bokeevboke
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Singapore1674 Posts
October 18 2012 04:37 GMT
#1179
On October 18 2012 13:29 Mackus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 18 2012 12:59 BoxingKangaroo wrote:
On October 18 2012 12:32 Mackus wrote:
Hi guys just a quick suggestion - If Blizzard scrapped the 200/200 deathballs would you be happy with that and that's it beside the new Units?


You missed the point. The 'deathball' isn't the reason the casuals are being turned off the game. If anything, getting rid of the deathball will make it harder for casuals (they can't 1a anymore).


Blizzard have said from day #1 that the game should be easy to learn but hard to master and it's still the case right now, yes there's alot of highlighting issues which aren't being addressed but the majority of people are just bandwagoning without a legitimate reason, if you want the game to grow - Bitching about the game is gonna repel viewers away. I love the game but right now knowing the community are too busy half-assed about something in 2 years time and it's really off-putting :/

Repel whom? barely anybody left in SC2. I deleted SC2 9 months ago and stay here only because TL is awesome. If anything we should make our game a candy to attract people, and the only way is to beg blizzard.
Its grack
phodacbiet
Profile Joined August 2010
United States1740 Posts
October 18 2012 04:38 GMT
#1180
On October 18 2012 13:29 Mackus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 18 2012 12:59 BoxingKangaroo wrote:
On October 18 2012 12:32 Mackus wrote:
Hi guys just a quick suggestion - If Blizzard scrapped the 200/200 deathballs would you be happy with that and that's it beside the new Units?


You missed the point. The 'deathball' isn't the reason the casuals are being turned off the game. If anything, getting rid of the deathball will make it harder for casuals (they can't 1a anymore).


Blizzard have said from day #1 that the game should be easy to learn but hard to master and it's still the case right now, yes there's alot of highlighting issues which aren't being addressed but the majority of people are just bandwagoning without a legitimate reason, if you want the game to grow - Bitching about the game is gonna repel viewers away. I love the game but right now knowing the community are too busy half-assed about something in 2 years time and it's really off-putting :/


TL is a place for your dramas/witch hunting needs. Last week was "Stephano + 14 yo" and "Desrow hungry, Desrow no got food, Desrow mad", before that was "Guy no sign contract = no getting moneis back from MoW", then there was "Destiny and Destiny jr being shown online". Just be happy that this week hunt involves something that everybody wants, fixing and making the game good.
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