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On October 17 2012 13:59 ch33psh33p wrote:
The sad thing is, a lot of people are going to look at this and see two things
(1) Destiny wrote it
(2) He used mean words
And then proceed to dismiss it, flame his playing skills, and call into question his validity as a human being.
Of course, the actual argument presented will become completely lost, and thats a damn shame.
the real tragedy of this affair is that some un-enlightened readers will take it upon themselves to make meta posts.
despite the aforementioned circumstance, other posters should be encouraged to do a better job than that shit.
...
I wish Destiny would do some more comprehensive research into the SC1 scene, as he always seems eager to mention it without expanding on some of the points he makes when comparing the sequel and the predecessor.
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People, ESPECIALLY people in this community seem to fail to realize that a game's competitive success lives or dies by its casual accessibility. Yeah, in a dream world we all want this ULTRA CUT-THROAT COMPETITIVE FUCK YOUR FACE game where OH MY FUCKING GOD SKILL CEILING SO HIGH NO MULTIPLE BILDING SIELECT FUK AUTO-MICRO OH MY GOD SO COMPETITIVEEE!1111...But in the real world, no one wants to play that game except competitive people.
casuals don't want to watch someone else play the game either, they just want to play.
if you compare the number of people who have downloaded/played LoL (32 million as of 11/16/2011) with the number of people who have purchased/played SC2 (4.5 million as of 11/22/2011), the number of people who watch ESPORTS content relative to the number of people who play (or have played) the game is astoundingly low. yes, LoL gets more viewers, but averaging 2-3 times the viewercount when you have ~7 times the playerbase is hardly a good justification for "dumbing down" the game.
RTS is and always should be more mechanically challenging than MOBA which obviously raises the barrier of entry, stop trying to compare it to something else.
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Even if Sc2 doesnt become huge, I am 100% sure it will always have a small following of hardcore people like me. And the competitive scene in Korea will exist which is the important part. Yes people may not be playing Sc2 too much, but I think it will still be popular on OGN TV.
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Well, the truth is he hs a valid point. But I'm unfortunately convinced that Blizzard will not even care to read this and make no change.
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So..is this just supposed to be a big circlejerk about how we're all cogs in the blizzard wheel and there's nothing we can do?
I mean like most people said I can agree with everything above. Personally I don't even play sc2 anymore but I watch the fuck out of it, mostly because I like competition and DoTA and LoL aren't as appealing as sc2. However, unless I missed a really important point I don't see how there's any plan to change it, or any suggestions how to. If we're powerless and there's nothing we can do then this thread is pointless because there's nothing to discuss..
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I agree minus the "competitive isn't fun part"
I don't understand why he hasn't quit sc2 forever ago, he hasn't enjoyed it or had decent results in a long time. Only around to create drama and complain it seems
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On October 17 2012 14:09 ROOTCatZ wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2012 13:59 Jermman wrote:
So.. if we the viewer can't do anything to help the situation and only blizzard can, what exactly is the point of posting this here. Nothing changes.. we could start a thing, lets all tweet at @BlizzardCS #SaveHOTS + Idea, i'll go first CatZ @ROOTCatZ @BlizzardCS #SaveHOTS make it a new game please, multiplayer is shaping up to be a -bad- Wol patch.
it will be a expensive DLC!
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On October 17 2012 14:10 mrRoflpwn wrote:
Even if Sc2 doesnt become huge, I am 100% sure it will always have a small following of hardcore people like me. And the competitive scene in Korea will exist which is the important part. Yes people may not be playing Sc2 too much, but I think it will still be popular on OGN TV.
I don't think you realize how dead SC2 is in Korea.
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of course the HotS hype was gonna die off fast. Nearly every pro is still gonna focus on WoL because thats their job and thats what every tournament is using. The level of play and the game is just better in this state. Thats why HotS is in beta.
Calm down, the world is not coming to an end.
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Destiny hit the nail on the head, which makes me really sad. I would have loved starcraft 2 to have actual staying power, but Blizzard is too stubborn and incompetent to actually fix the issues that need to be addressed T.T
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I agree with his suggestions (i.e. giving gamers more reason to play with achievements, portraits, decals,etc etc)
Too bad Blizzard only listens to noobs in the b.net forums anways. I disagree about dumbing this game down however, please don`t compare RTS with MOBA.
On a side note, I don`t give a shit if SC2 is doomed in terms of popularity. I will still play the game.
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I think he has major points. If the system does not change drastically next year, SC2 is doomed.
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I've been thinking this as well, hots beta has been a real clusterfuck of pseudo bw units.
Watching the international (dota2) made me really really consider of sc2 being a bubble. I personally really hope that valve or riot creates an rts, because they really seem to be into developing their competitive titles.
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Ok 1, I thought Destiny wasn't posting on reddit any more, 2, most of the things in this article are correct, but I want to focus on something else.
Are 1v1 games/sports intrinsically less interesting than team games/sports? (because humans are social animals)
I don't think Dota/LoL are competitors to SC2 any more than football is a competitor to tennis.
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As much as it pains me, I agree! Beta has been really underwhelming, I was hoping it was just an outsider perspective, then I got in.
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Ya. I agree with this.
It seems bnet 0.2 are one of main faults, however Blizz is stubborn to make any changes.
IMO I hope they stop adding casual friendly features in ladder but focus more on actual bnet changes because no casuals would play ladder in first place and they wont change their mind just because OMG WORKERS AUTO STARTING MINING NOW, OR NOW I FEEL UBER GOSU BECAUSE I HAVE PERFECT SATURATION.
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On October 17 2012 14:16 jalstar wrote:
Ok 1, I thought Destiny wasn't posting on reddit any more, 2, most of the things in this article are correct, but I want to focus on something else.
Are 1v1 games/sports intrinsically less interesting than team games/sports? (because humans are social animals)
I don't think Dota/LoL are competitors to SC2 any more than football is a competitor to tennis.
People watched gladiators and jousters and fencers for hundreds and hundreds of years. I don't necessarily think you don't have a point here, but I also don't think that a sport or game being 1v1 necessarily discounts it, either.
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Well I have to say, the lack of community and custom games was a major confusing downer for me. BW for me and everyone i knew was about just talking to buddies then jumping into custom games. None of that ever materialized with this game, and I agree with Destiny I think it forever hurt the game's future. I'm a pretty competitive gamer so I still did get enjoyment out of SC2, but even my interest died off recently, and my buddies who were big casual BW fans disappeared years ago.
Between SC2 and Diablo 3 it's confusing to see how many opportunities Blizzard wasted. It's very sad, really.
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"BUT FIX THE CLUSTERFUCK ARCADE, casual gamers don't give a fuck about 1v1s!" hah too true when it pertains to casual gamers like a lot of my friends. They won't play Sc2 where they played SC and Wc3 for the UMS since navigating the arcade is a pain in the ass
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Destiny is completely right with what he is saying. Most of the people I know stopped playing and switched over to another game like LoL. Very few people play sc2 at pc bangs and the viewership in Korea is no way near what BW was. HOTS hasn't been impressive and seems to continue down the wrong path. If Blizzard doesn't do something about it then in a matter of time SC2 will die off at least in Korea just like BW did.
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WCS
