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On September 17 2012 22:13 4ZakeN87 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2012 21:47 Play Crack The Sky wrote:On September 17 2012 21:35 4ZakeN87 wrote:On September 17 2012 21:25 Play Crack The Sky wrote:On September 17 2012 19:58 4ZakeN87 wrote:On September 17 2012 19:43 PiGStarcraft wrote:
It's not about skill it's about growing the scene across all countries not just those already thriving.
SC2 is so new that building it up is just as important as rewarding those at the top.
You talk about how it needs to be interesting so not just being all korean but instead suggest "All Korean and all where I'm from, Europe" and even suggest more spots for Europe then Asia. If you want to follow the approach of let's put the highest skilled and most deserving players in it HAS to be 90% Koreans you can't just say "we'll put more koreans then other countries, but not as many as is worth their skill". You can't pick and choose like that either it's all skill or all based on something else like promoting eSports in regions based on games sales. Well I guess my suggestion was a little bit biased but then if you look at it from a country perspective there is no doubt that most skilled countries are in EU and thus is the current system not giving the best representation of the foreign scene. But yeah I agree there is an conflict about scenes growing and the current skill level and removing one seed from SEA might have been a little harsh. Regardless as I finished my post, my point is not that I have come up with a perfect solution, just that I think that the current system is bad and there are better options. As I think have been suggested by several posts already. It is not that hard to suggest a system that is better then the current one imo ^.^ Swedish players just played badly and dropped the ball on home turf. This is the fault of Naniwa and Sase for messing up in qualifying and Thorzain, Sortof and Seiplo for playing so poorly this weekend. It's not Blizzard's fault Swedish players played poorly, stop trying to cheat the system to compensate for their failings. I am not sure where you read all this, but yeah Swedish players did not do great. I agree. That the swedish players failed of course makes it completely reasonable that Germany and Taiwan have direct qualifications to the world final and that US might have equal amount of players as Korea. Cause as your post suggest those two things are tightly linked with one another. Taiwan having a seed makes sense, because otherwise Korea will just take every Asian spot every time. Your post is ridiculous because you're saying the seedings should reflect the quality of your pro scene and then somehow come to this absurd conclusion that EU deserves more spots than Korea, which is laughable. Either it's done based on community size and 'everyone gets a chance' like it is now or it's pure merit of how many good players you have and Korea gets 25 spots in a 32 man tournament. Germany, France and Russia probably shouldn't have got a spot but that's pretty minor and not the real reason Swedes and Ukrainians didn't qualify, they didn't qualify because they played badly when the time came to step up. You can't have it both ways. EU is not as good as Korea and do not deserve more spots in a merit system. So much anger here. Well no Korea deserves more seeds, the system that I suggested would give them more then they have now. But I think most people agree that you cannot have a world final with 25 out 32 players coming from one nation. That would just be another GSL tournament with some additional foreigners being thrown in which is not the point of the event. Even with only 8 players attending Korea would still be the favorite by a hugh margin towards any other country. Regardless is that irrelevant in the case that NA for instance have 9 seeds for the world final. I think you will have a hard time finding any none NA person thinking that it is a good idea. Anyway, yes I think I can have it both ways, it is called a compromise. You should try it sometime.
Exactly, if you have WCS europe which has a bigger Swedish representation, and less UK, Germany. Wouldn't that just be like another Dreamhack/Asus ROG? That is not the point of WCS.
We have plenty of regional tournament that are merit based(MLG/IPL in NA, DH and ROG in European, IEMs, GSL/OSL in Korea) WCG and WCS are the exceptions which happens once a year. I think we should keep them unique.
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honestly if we want to base it on skill, there should be 27 koreans, 5 of any non-korean race, cuz lets be honest, nothing compares to koreans except for a few players
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On September 17 2012 22:11 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2012 22:00 4ZakeN87 wrote:On September 17 2012 21:43 Mandalor wrote:
I agree that giving direct seeds to nations is a stupid and ultimately unfair idea. However, your example of KrasS getting in is a little unfair tbh. It could have just as well been Socke, HasuObs, DarkForce and TLO (or Goody) in the top4, but KrasS made it. So, that argument is a little weak if it wasn't for the fact that a rather unknown player made it.
The thing with weighing nations and areas correctly is that it is extremely hard to do and that skills shift constantly. I don't think Ukraine is that strong currently. A couple months ago, Dimaga, White-Ra and Strelok were amongst the very best players of their respective race, at least in Europe. Now? Not so much imo and while there are "new" very strong players in Ukraine now, I don't think they are as good as the guys mentioned earlier were in their prime. Well to put it short Germany had more qualifications seeds then any other country in addition to having a direct qualification seed. If the system was based on SC2 skill level this would suggest that Germany is the best EU SC2 country with some margin. I am sorry but there is no way that this is justified. If Germany had equal chances to Sweden or Ukraine I would considered it a pretty generous offer for Germany. The system is however not based on skill but number of SC2 licenses, thus are the German players rather privileged. And your original post is so contradictory. Basically you want 'skill' to be the determining factor for the EU spots. But in the global distribution, you want EU to be the same as Asia because otherwise, Korea would get 'too many' spots. So you are proposing 2 different standards. The system is however not based on skill but number of SC2 licenses, thus are the NA/EU players rather privileged.
Yes I know. I do have 2 different standards. Because we have a situation were the current system is bad and at the same time we have a problem that one nation happens to be completely dominating the scene. Thus if you only use skill as a parameter it would make for really boring event as Korea would almost by default take the title. As such a large number of players would be Koreans.
This however does not mean that the current system with NA being privileged and some arbitrary countries getting direct qualifications are good. Thus is it a compromise between the two. But well as I said repeatedly my main message was that the current system is bad and that people should react towards it as everything else is to accept it. It was not that have the ultimate solution for the issue.
My suggestion was mainly an idea adapted to get the best representation of the foreign scene possible while still giving a large number of seeds to Koreans. I simply removed one seed from SEA and two from NA an added one seed to Asia and two to EU. Maybe would have been better to just remove two from NA and add one to EU and one to Asia. Regardless if you do not agree with this it is fine as it was not meant to be the main message of the post.
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On September 17 2012 22:13 4ZakeN87 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2012 21:47 Play Crack The Sky wrote:On September 17 2012 21:35 4ZakeN87 wrote:On September 17 2012 21:25 Play Crack The Sky wrote:On September 17 2012 19:58 4ZakeN87 wrote:On September 17 2012 19:43 PiGStarcraft wrote:
It's not about skill it's about growing the scene across all countries not just those already thriving.
SC2 is so new that building it up is just as important as rewarding those at the top.
You talk about how it needs to be interesting so not just being all korean but instead suggest "All Korean and all where I'm from, Europe" and even suggest more spots for Europe then Asia. If you want to follow the approach of let's put the highest skilled and most deserving players in it HAS to be 90% Koreans you can't just say "we'll put more koreans then other countries, but not as many as is worth their skill". You can't pick and choose like that either it's all skill or all based on something else like promoting eSports in regions based on games sales. Well I guess my suggestion was a little bit biased but then if you look at it from a country perspective there is no doubt that most skilled countries are in EU and thus is the current system not giving the best representation of the foreign scene. But yeah I agree there is an conflict about scenes growing and the current skill level and removing one seed from SEA might have been a little harsh. Regardless as I finished my post, my point is not that I have come up with a perfect solution, just that I think that the current system is bad and there are better options. As I think have been suggested by several posts already. It is not that hard to suggest a system that is better then the current one imo ^.^ Swedish players just played badly and dropped the ball on home turf. This is the fault of Naniwa and Sase for messing up in qualifying and Thorzain, Sortof and Seiplo for playing so poorly this weekend. It's not Blizzard's fault Swedish players played poorly, stop trying to cheat the system to compensate for their failings. I am not sure where you read all this, but yeah Swedish players did not do great. I agree. That the swedish players failed of course makes it completely reasonable that Germany and Taiwan have direct qualifications to the world final and that US might have equal amount of players as Korea. Cause as your post suggest those two things are tightly linked with one another. Taiwan having a seed makes sense, because otherwise Korea will just take every Asian spot every time. Your post is ridiculous because you're saying the seedings should reflect the quality of your pro scene and then somehow come to this absurd conclusion that EU deserves more spots than Korea, which is laughable. Either it's done based on community size and 'everyone gets a chance' like it is now or it's pure merit of how many good players you have and Korea gets 25 spots in a 32 man tournament. Germany, France and Russia probably shouldn't have got a spot but that's pretty minor and not the real reason Swedes and Ukrainians didn't qualify, they didn't qualify because they played badly when the time came to step up. You can't have it both ways. EU is not as good as Korea and do not deserve more spots in a merit system. So much anger here. Well no Korea deserves more seeds, the system that I suggested would give them more then they have now. But I think most people agree that you cannot have a world final with 25 out 32 players coming from one nation. That would just be another GSL tournament with some additional foreigners being thrown in which is not the point of the event. Even with only 8 players attending Korea would still be the favorite by a hugh margin towards any other country. Regardless is that irrelevant in the case that NA for instance have 9 seeds for the world final. I think you will have a hard time finding any none NA person thinking that it is a good idea. Anyway, yes I think I can have it both ways, it is called a compromise. You should try it sometime.
He's absolutely right, you introduce your idea based on the absurdity that NA doesn't match up to the rest of the countries in skill level and therefore needs fewer seeds.
You follow by dismissing the idea that Korea should get more seeds based on skill level, because that doesn't help your argument.
You conclude, essentially, with switching around NA and EU with no real reason except "Because Europe"
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the system is fine.
it gives smaller countries a leg up, which wouldn't normally otherwise have an opportunity to take part in such a wonderful event.
it also doesn't deny major regions another big tournament, which by all accounts has been a roaring success.
think of it like the world cup. sure, south america and europe have better nations, but it wouldn't be as much fun if you didn't get to see senegal shit on france or watch italy choke vs south korea (insert any other minnow upset here).
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I like the concept a lot but I think there should be direct seeds to the world finals for more countries.
Don't necessarily need to cut slots from continental finals to add more direct seeds either. Could just make the world final groups 5 people groups instead of 4 and there would be 8 more slots for direct seeds.
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Why would they do it based off of some random, unjustifiable, unmeasurable, "Well, these countries are better than this country" rubric? No one would ever agree with who they said was the better country, and thus deserved the most slots. And beyond that, they have to change it every year based off of super secret Blizzard memos or something equally stupid. Not to mention the fact that Korea will definitely always hold the highest power base, so WCS will just turn into GSL with Stephano and Scarlett. What a great WORLD FINALS, trololol. And you can't qualify "Well, we'd only give Korea 7 or so," because then it's not a true "Based off merit" system, like you claimed you wanted.
Oh, and I'm surprised I have to say this, but can people stop saying "The US has 9 seeds"? Cuz we don't. NA does. That includes Mexico and Canada. I'm surprised the United States citizen has to make that correction, but for some reason I do. The Europeans are usually so much more on top of shitting on us and reminding us that HuK isn't really American, because he's half Canadian or something equally insulting.
The current license idea is the best because it's the most subjective. I'm sorry Naniwa and Thorizain didn't play well enough to qualify, you'll just have to support another fellow, maybe one of the 7 Europeans who qualified?
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On September 17 2012 22:22 4ZakeN87 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2012 22:11 vthree wrote:On September 17 2012 22:00 4ZakeN87 wrote:On September 17 2012 21:43 Mandalor wrote:
I agree that giving direct seeds to nations is a stupid and ultimately unfair idea. However, your example of KrasS getting in is a little unfair tbh. It could have just as well been Socke, HasuObs, DarkForce and TLO (or Goody) in the top4, but KrasS made it. So, that argument is a little weak if it wasn't for the fact that a rather unknown player made it.
The thing with weighing nations and areas correctly is that it is extremely hard to do and that skills shift constantly. I don't think Ukraine is that strong currently. A couple months ago, Dimaga, White-Ra and Strelok were amongst the very best players of their respective race, at least in Europe. Now? Not so much imo and while there are "new" very strong players in Ukraine now, I don't think they are as good as the guys mentioned earlier were in their prime. Well to put it short Germany had more qualifications seeds then any other country in addition to having a direct qualification seed. If the system was based on SC2 skill level this would suggest that Germany is the best EU SC2 country with some margin. I am sorry but there is no way that this is justified. If Germany had equal chances to Sweden or Ukraine I would considered it a pretty generous offer for Germany. The system is however not based on skill but number of SC2 licenses, thus are the German players rather privileged. And your original post is so contradictory. Basically you want 'skill' to be the determining factor for the EU spots. But in the global distribution, you want EU to be the same as Asia because otherwise, Korea would get 'too many' spots. So you are proposing 2 different standards. The system is however not based on skill but number of SC2 licenses, thus are the NA/EU players rather privileged. Yes I know. I do have 2 different standards. Because we have a situation were the current system is bad and at the same time we have a problem that one nation happens to be completely dominating the scene. Thus if you only use skill as a parameter it would make for really boring event as Korea would almost by default take the title. As such a large number of players would be Koreans. This however does not mean that the current system with NA being privileged and some arbitrary countries getting direct qualifications are good. Thus is it a compromise between the two. But well as I said repeatedly my main message was that current system is bad not that have the ultimate solution for the issue. My suggestion was mainly an idea adapted to get the best representation of the foreign scene possible while still giving a large number of seeds to Koreans. If you do not agree with this it is fine as it was not meant to be the main message of the post.
I think the problem is you are trying to make this into a MLG/IPL/Dreamhack which is not what WCS is meant to be. We have plenty of foreigner vs Korean tournaments.
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Its a bit late to change it now though..
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Korea should definitely have more seeds than it got. Aside from that, I don't really think that giving NA 9 seeds makes any sense. Giving seeds by game license is pretty dumb if the WCS is supposed to be about crowning the world champ, not about doing market research. A decent compromise would be to give Korea its own category, or to give it half of the Asian seeds, or something. It's pretty moronic that the WCS Korea players, who could probably sweep the entire upper bracket at the globals, still need to play out some more to see who qualifies.
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I think Blizzard's method of basing the seeds on the SC2 playerbase population is the best. For one thing it's objective, and the subjectivity involved in OP's method would just cause major backlash from the community because everyone would have a different opinion. It's also just a sensible way of running a world championship because you're accurately representing the SC2 playerbase.
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On September 17 2012 18:39 4ZakeN87 wrote:
Thought I would make a topic about the WCS qualification system as it bothers me quite a bit and there seems not to be too much debate regarding it.
First off I think WCS is an amazing tournament and it is in my mind the first legit world championship tournament in SC2. Thus it annoys me that the system for qualifying to WCS world final is far from ideal. The fact that neither Ukraine nor Sweden has a player in the world final bothers me as these two nations are frequently mentioned when discussing which nation is the strongest behind South Korea. This is of course to a big extent because the players from these nations did not play good enough but also partially a result of an unfair qualification system (imo). If you on the other hand look at US they have 5 players qualified. If China or another Asian country takes two spots in the Asian qualifier there will be as many US players as Koreans in the world final. I am sorry US, but that is just straight up retarded.
My argument would thus be that skill should have a greater role in the seeding/qualification process. Then of course the first thing that comes to mind is why Korea doesn’t get like 20-25 of the 32 seeds. Well first off it would not be a world final with 75% of the players coming from one nation. Second will Korea have probably around 6-7 players represented regardless. I agree that Korea should probably have a few more “seeds”, but still with 6-7 players of the caliber of Creator and Seed Korea have more than a realistic chance to bring home the title regardless.
There are a number of things that annoys me with the qualification system. First I think that the direct qualifications for the winners of some nations qualifiers should be removed. It is just completely unfair and does not reflect the SC2 level of the countries. They only country I possible could think off that should have one is China, as it is kind of unfair that they have to compete against the Koreans already in their continental final. Korea does not need it, they will roll over the Asian qualifiers regardless. And besides Korea does no other country “clearly” deserves one, thus should there not be a arbitrary selection of some countries that have direct qualification.
Second the distribution of seeds over the globe is debatable to say the least. Oceania and SA qualifiers could be discussed. I think for instance giving 2 seeds to Oceania is questionable as they neither have the population nor the SC2 level to make that argument imho. The main thing though is of course NA. NA should not have 9 slots. Okay there are good players in NA and there are many viewers there, but 9 slots? If NA had 7 slots I think it would have served the same purpose without being mind-numbingly unfair against the rest of the world. Having 9 seeds for NA also makes for an overall less interesting world final and some of these “privileged” qualifiers will get stomped once they run into the Koreans.
Finally the same thing for the continental finals. Germany should for instance not have gotten 4 seeds in EU final+ a direct qualification spot. While Ukraine on the other hand got two seeds. The 4th player from Germany, Krass, had I never heard of before and it turns out his most notable achievement is a second place in a zotac tournament. While players such as Naniwa, Sase, Morrow, Fraer, Kas and Dimaga are standing on the side line? I am sorry but at this moment there is no way in hell I could see Krass being a better representative for EU compared to the 6 other players mentioned.
Also the current system based on the amount of licenses of SC2 is just weird. Imagine the Olympics being based on population numbers, India would have had almost 20% of all the “seeds” in the Olympics. Would be more fair right? Too bad it would not make any whatsoever sense from a competition view point. Also I am not even sure that the viewers from the countries with advantageous qualifications will in the end favor the system. As once the world tournament start reality will kick in and a large percentage of the “advantageously” qualified players will be decimated which is not that entertaining.
Maybe it is just me but when I think of an ideal world championship tournament, I think of a battle between the top Koreans against the best players of the world that culminates in a nail biting competition between Korea and the world. I think this is what majority off all the viewer’s actually want. I we want to achieve this the best players must have a decent chance of qualifying.
The current qualification seeds
National winner qualifiers
1 Germany
1 France
1 Russia
1 China
1 Taiwan
1 South Korea
1 USA
1 Canada
Continental qualifications seeds
NA 7
Asia 6
EU 6
SA 3
SEA 2
My suggestion
National winner qualifier
1 China
Continental qualifications seeds
EU 11
Asia 9
NA 7
SA 3
SEA 1
Simpler and better adapted to bring the top players from the world to the final, while at the same time (most probably) increase the number of Korean players attending.
I might as well respond to the fact that I gave EU more seeds then Asia here. From a skill point of view Asia should have most seeds, but then again Asia≈Korea. With 9 seeds Korea is likely to grab around 8. This will still make them by far the most represented country in the world final with 25% of all players. No other country is likely to have more than 3 players. If you give Korea more seeds it will become more and more a game of numbers and make for an overall less interesting event imho.
Finally my main point is not that it should be exactly this way, just that the current system is kind of shit imo ^.^
Yes both nations have very strong players, but this is nothing like the WCG where every country gets a representative.
You have to earn your spot.
You have a point thought with regards to the auto-seeds for the winners of other nations though. I know a lot of players didn't like how the brackets were arranged either (namely HuK).
Ofc your post was biased. No need to point it out man and I understand your frustration because there are a lot of good players missing but that's just how the cookie crumbles sometimes.
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Hai hai, seems people like this system and I agree that vthree has a point regarding it should not be another Dreamhack. I however think that there is different degrees of this "truth".
Still it surprises me people like this system. Well people do not think that we arbitrarily should say that one country is better then the other but... really US having 5 players while UK, Sweden and Ukraine have none? You would have to be pretty hardcore US patriot to not say that the system is not heavily screwed into the favor of US. Last TSL4 NA/EU qualifier these 3 countries had 10 participants while US had 0.
And then Germany, France and Russia getting direct qualifications? In addition to Germany getting 4 seeds already, while countries such as Poland and Ukraine gets two seeds?
I cannot believe that the consensus is that it is a good system. Well I do not like it one bit but I guess it will continue then.
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On September 17 2012 22:50 4ZakeN87 wrote:
Hai hai, seems people like this system and I agree that vthree has a point regarding it should not be another Dreamhack. I however think that there is different degrees of this "truth".
Still it surprises me people like this system. Well people do not think that we arbitrarily should say that one country is better then the other but... really US having 5 players while UK, Sweden and Ukraine have none? You would have to be pretty hardcore US patriot to not say that system is not heavily screwed into the favor of US. Last TSL4 NA/EU qualifier these 3 countries had 10 participants while US had 0.
And then Germany, France and Russia getting direct qualifications? In addition to Germany getting 4 seeds already, while countries such as Poland and Ukraine gets two seeds?
I cannot believe that the consensus is that is a good system. Well I do not like it one bit but I guess it will continue then.
I'm not a huge fan of it either and I understand why Blizzard is outsourcing because they honestly have very little experience with running their own shit.
I just accept it for what it is and the reality is this. A lot of the tournaments we currently have. Whether they be a major or not is bush league crap when it comes to their formats and system.
This goes for everything including the GSTL, PL hybrid format, MLG, etc.
It's a bunch of crap and they'll keep changing it too.
Ideally I would like to have one world circuit and one team league where all the pro's come out to play. Got to package it altogether.
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On September 17 2012 19:15 4ZakeN87 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2012 18:57 Douillos wrote:Admit it, your just mad cause Nani/Sase didnt get in  Not really thread worthy, they had to distribute the seeds, they used a valid idea with the number of sc2 licenses. Imagine if they would have started another NA/EU war over who's better. Shitfest Inc! But really, its funny, cause we all know youre just mad Naniwa's not in :D Well to be honest I am not the biggest Naniwa fan but regardless yeah the fact that no Swedish player qualified defently contributed to me making this post. Cause it made me even more annoyed about the current system. My personal motives for making the post is however irrelevant in the assessment of the current system is ideal or not. And yes I am well aware how the current system work, my post however makes an argument that it is shit if you try reading it. I think for instance that very few viewers could with an honest heart say that US deserve to have 5 players in the world final. Theoretically they might be tied with Korea for most seeds, or potentially be the second well most represented country by some margin.
No Swedish player qualifies, complains that Sweden should get more seed based on their skill.
:4ZakeN87:
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I dont think there is much wrong with the way WCS was setup, the only thing i didn't really like is for exmaple the way the setup the bracket this weekend. We saw to many players from the same country eliminating each other to early in the tournament, when you play a tournament based on countries that shouldn't happen.
And the direct seeding has to disappear, it's ridiculous and not fair. You can do that but then you cant let those players enter a qualifier, they have a edge.
Other then that it's pretty good i think, you can discuss the amount of seeds a continent gets but when you setup a tournament around country's/continents you never get the strongest line-up, we see this in all kinds of sports where the WC is not the primary title for players.
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On September 17 2012 22:57 RageBot wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2012 19:15 4ZakeN87 wrote:On September 17 2012 18:57 Douillos wrote:Admit it, your just mad cause Nani/Sase didnt get in Not really thread worthy, they had to distribute the seeds, they used a valid idea with the number of sc2 licenses. Imagine if they would have started another NA/EU war over who's better. Shitfest Inc! But really, its funny, cause we all know youre just mad Naniwa's not in :D Well to be honest I am not the biggest Naniwa fan but regardless yeah the fact that no Swedish player qualified defently contributed to me making this post. Cause it made me even more annoyed about the current system. My personal motives for making the post is however irrelevant in the assessment of the current system is ideal or not. And yes I am well aware how the current system work, my post however makes an argument that it is shit if you try reading it. I think for instance that very few viewers could with an honest heart say that US deserve to have 5 players in the world final. Theoretically they might be tied with Korea for most seeds, or potentially be the second well most represented country by some margin. No Swedish player qualifies, complains that Sweden should get more seed based on their skill. :4ZakeN87:
I wonder if there would still be complaints from him if the US had the best players outside Korea? Then their seeds would be justified in his world and he would have nothing to complain about, right?
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On September 17 2012 22:57 RageBot wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2012 19:15 4ZakeN87 wrote:On September 17 2012 18:57 Douillos wrote:Admit it, your just mad cause Nani/Sase didnt get in Not really thread worthy, they had to distribute the seeds, they used a valid idea with the number of sc2 licenses. Imagine if they would have started another NA/EU war over who's better. Shitfest Inc! But really, its funny, cause we all know youre just mad Naniwa's not in :D Well to be honest I am not the biggest Naniwa fan but regardless yeah the fact that no Swedish player qualified defently contributed to me making this post. Cause it made me even more annoyed about the current system. My personal motives for making the post is however irrelevant in the assessment of the current system is ideal or not. And yes I am well aware how the current system work, my post however makes an argument that it is shit if you try reading it. I think for instance that very few viewers could with an honest heart say that US deserve to have 5 players in the world final. Theoretically they might be tied with Korea for most seeds, or potentially be the second well most represented country by some margin. No Swedish player qualifies, complains that Sweden should get more seed based on their skill. :4ZakeN87:
Yeah I realized that I would get these responds before I posted it, I think you are something along the fifth in the line. Thus I mentioned it already in the OP that I was influenced by the fact no Swedish player qualified. I also mentioned that my personal motives are not relevant regarding if the system is good or not.
It is however pointless to respond to this because if this thread continues there will be 25 more of these responds and I cannot bother to respond to all 25.
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On September 17 2012 23:04 4ZakeN87 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2012 22:57 RageBot wrote:On September 17 2012 19:15 4ZakeN87 wrote:On September 17 2012 18:57 Douillos wrote:Admit it, your just mad cause Nani/Sase didnt get in Not really thread worthy, they had to distribute the seeds, they used a valid idea with the number of sc2 licenses. Imagine if they would have started another NA/EU war over who's better. Shitfest Inc! But really, its funny, cause we all know youre just mad Naniwa's not in :D Well to be honest I am not the biggest Naniwa fan but regardless yeah the fact that no Swedish player qualified defently contributed to me making this post. Cause it made me even more annoyed about the current system. My personal motives for making the post is however irrelevant in the assessment of the current system is ideal or not. And yes I am well aware how the current system work, my post however makes an argument that it is shit if you try reading it. I think for instance that very few viewers could with an honest heart say that US deserve to have 5 players in the world final. Theoretically they might be tied with Korea for most seeds, or potentially be the second well most represented country by some margin. No Swedish player qualifies, complains that Sweden should get more seed based on their skill. :4ZakeN87: Yeah I realized that I would get these responds before I posted it, I think you are something along the fifth in the line. Thus I mentioned it already in the OP that I was influenced by the fact no Swedish player qualified. I also mentioned that my personal motives are not relevant regarding if the system is good or not. It is however pointless to respond to this because if this thread continues there will be 25 more of these responds and I cannot bother to respond to all 25.
The fact that you mentioned that does not make that true.
The logical fallacy here is obvious, you complain that your country didn't do good enough in a skill based tournemant, and say that they should get more seeds based on their skills.
The only country that has a merit for asking for more players in Spain, because, if not for Stephano (the obvious best European player) they would've had their only two seeds as the top two players, thus they should obviously get more seeds.
If anything, Sweden should get two seeds next time, so that Spain can have three.
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On September 17 2012 23:10 RageBot wrote:Show nested quote +On September 17 2012 23:04 4ZakeN87 wrote:On September 17 2012 22:57 RageBot wrote:On September 17 2012 19:15 4ZakeN87 wrote:On September 17 2012 18:57 Douillos wrote:Admit it, your just mad cause Nani/Sase didnt get in Not really thread worthy, they had to distribute the seeds, they used a valid idea with the number of sc2 licenses. Imagine if they would have started another NA/EU war over who's better. Shitfest Inc! But really, its funny, cause we all know youre just mad Naniwa's not in :D Well to be honest I am not the biggest Naniwa fan but regardless yeah the fact that no Swedish player qualified defently contributed to me making this post. Cause it made me even more annoyed about the current system. My personal motives for making the post is however irrelevant in the assessment of the current system is ideal or not. And yes I am well aware how the current system work, my post however makes an argument that it is shit if you try reading it. I think for instance that very few viewers could with an honest heart say that US deserve to have 5 players in the world final. Theoretically they might be tied with Korea for most seeds, or potentially be the second well most represented country by some margin. No Swedish player qualifies, complains that Sweden should get more seed based on their skill. :4ZakeN87: Yeah I realized that I would get these responds before I posted it, I think you are something along the fifth in the line. Thus I mentioned it already in the OP that I was influenced by the fact no Swedish player qualified. I also mentioned that my personal motives are not relevant regarding if the system is good or not. It is however pointless to respond to this because if this thread continues there will be 25 more of these responds and I cannot bother to respond to all 25. The fact that you mentioned that does not make that true. The logical fallacy here is obvious, you complain that your country didn't do good enough in a skill based tournemant, and say that they should get more seeds based on their skills. The only country that has a merit for asking for more players in Spain, because, if not for Stephano (the obvious best European player) they would've had their only two seeds as the top two players, thus they should obviously get more seeds. If anything, Sweden should get two seeds next time, so that Spain can have three.
What? No it is actually a fact that my personal opinion is irrelevant to if the system is good or not. To say otherwise would mean that the system would improve or become worse depending on my personal thoughts about the system.
I have a very hard time to see how that theoretically could happen so no, it is actually true. Otherwise it would mean I was divine or something along those lines.
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EPT
