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Lol Dustin expects pros to not get hit by the Wwdow mine? How about no one with actual eyesight and mouse control. The timer will have to be drastically reduced if the unit is ever going to be functional.
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pre-ordain makes me giggle about the people that complained about scan. then i looked at the mineral lock that previously had to be used on each mineral patch and note that it locks down the entire minerals at the expansion. it's not even a numbers thing. it's just a rediculous unit. the cost taken of being able to get off the lock-down period is just silly for the lack of risk. unlimited scan is a numbers thing and can be tweaked. cloak on that same unit just blows it over the top.
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i hope ten second timer on spider mines goes away. battles dont even take that long.
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On June 09 2012 09:01 s3rp wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2012 08:59 Kaw wrote:On June 09 2012 08:56 guruPanda wrote:On June 09 2012 08:50 Naphal wrote:
i like how they chose to mainly trash terran fortifications with the new protoss and zerg units -.-
terran units underwhelming in comparison... i mean the mine takes how long to explode? even i could micro units away with the time displayed in the video, better yet, i could even micro these units into the enemy... pick up mines with stalkers and blink them into the bio. Very interesting aspect, but we don't know if the mines have friendly splash yet. We do know that the mines don't go off if the unit dies. If I try to blink a single stalker on top of any mid game terran army it will be dead instantly. If mines don't go off if the units dies it seems pretty meh especially with 10 second timer...
yeah i would at least like to focus roaches with a mine attached so i can get that splash damage done <.<
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On June 09 2012 08:46 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2012 08:38 Dingobloo wrote:On June 09 2012 08:33 Falling wrote:On June 09 2012 07:48 Splynn wrote:
I think I'm in the vast minority on this... but with the new queen look (I didn't like the way the old queen look), I'm really hoping they tweak the roach a little bit, too. To me it just looks too round and with no real features, I really don't like the way roaches look in general. The new queen is awesome, though. Just wish that the roach could look less like a beachball with spikes.
New queen looks pretty good I think. And I definitely think roach design could use an overhaul. I was just enjoying the unit mix in that battle report and thinking how much better hydra look aesthetically as the core unit rather than the roach. Beachball with spikes it is. But hydra, swarmlord, defiler thingy looked pretty cool. Yeah, staying active with that unit is just can be so valuable. I mean, every time you are able to land the shields onto those minerals- that’s guaranteed harassment. It doesn’t matter whether or not they’re fast on the reaction. It’s still a small amount of mining time they won’t be able to access. Rob Simpson from the battle report. Although an interesting idea, this is precisely why I think the oracle harass is not very good similar to FF's. I'm sure it will get balanced. But it will never be the unit interaction like BW storms, reaver shots that were big hits or misses depending on who was faster. Or good map awareness with DTs that didn't trigger an alarm when atttacking workers. But this will always be did I get close enough with out being sniped? If yes, then freeze minerals for x amount of time (x amount being tweaked for balance). If no, then no damage. But it requires very little interaction between units/ players reaction time. Sure taking down minerals requires a reaction, but it's not the same as: Did I get close enough without my shuttle getting sniped? If yes, then quickly unload high templar, unleash 1-2 storms before the opposing player races all his workers away for little to no damage. If the opposing player doesn't react, the entire line of workers get's wiped out. But it's all about who is faster, not just on entry, but also on the attack execution. "that’s guaranteed harassment. It doesn’t matter whether or not they’re fast on the reaction." I don't particularly like this idea for a harassment unit. I agree, but this also isn't as effective as normal harassment, without killing the workers you're not preventing the snowball nature of economic development, you're merely removing income temporarily, I don't think it will be a replacement for effective late game harassment. Agreed and people will adapt to the harassment quickly. If you watch the report. the bubbles only have 75 HP and can be focused down quickly. Also the Oracle only has 20 shields and 80 HP. It will die if something looks at it sideways.
The thing is I think its the fastest thing in the air and it can block static defense so it could still be very useful. I can also see terrans needing to leave a few units behind to deal with it.
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On June 09 2012 09:05 Naphal wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2012 09:01 s3rp wrote:On June 09 2012 08:59 Kaw wrote:On June 09 2012 08:56 guruPanda wrote:On June 09 2012 08:50 Naphal wrote:
i like how they chose to mainly trash terran fortifications with the new protoss and zerg units -.-
terran units underwhelming in comparison... i mean the mine takes how long to explode? even i could micro units away with the time displayed in the video, better yet, i could even micro these units into the enemy... pick up mines with stalkers and blink them into the bio. Very interesting aspect, but we don't know if the mines have friendly splash yet. We do know that the mines don't go off if the unit dies. If I try to blink a single stalker on top of any mid game terran army it will be dead instantly. If mines don't go off if the units dies it seems pretty meh especially with 10 second timer... yeah i would at least like to focus roaches with a mine attached so i can get that splash damage done <.<
The mine is guaranteed to kill the unit that steps on it. I think hoping the mines will single-handedly vaporize entire armies is a little ridiculous.
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I like the majority of what i've seen, i just have a massive issue with the tempest.
Honestly i want them to delete the colossus, make the tempest a ground unit to replace the colossus. Keep the slow big pulse blast attack style but make it an aoe ability. Keep it weak (health wise) and make the range something sensible. I could see a ground variant of the tempest being less deathbally then the colossus. Combined with the other changes implimented it seems like it would make the protoss race so much more enjoyable.
Bring back the carrier but just fix it PLEASE!
blagh! but so far so good, if the carrier go's ill be sad but alas ill still play it lol. But i really dislike the tempest. Its just another deathball unit (unless on a map with alot of airspace). On any map where the tempest has to sit over the ground it needs to be protected thus causing superdeathballx5000 as we all know deathballs are boring as hell!
DAG NABBIT BLIZZARD NOT LIKE THIS! NOT LIKE THIS! Why! WHY! GARFLARGABLE!
grr. i dislike this tempest.
i should probabaly stop rambling but why the tempest? The carrier is so much more elegant awe inspiring and intresting.
stupid tempest ...
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On June 09 2012 09:08 Adreme wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2012 08:46 Plansix wrote:On June 09 2012 08:38 Dingobloo wrote:On June 09 2012 08:33 Falling wrote:On June 09 2012 07:48 Splynn wrote:
I think I'm in the vast minority on this... but with the new queen look (I didn't like the way the old queen look), I'm really hoping they tweak the roach a little bit, too. To me it just looks too round and with no real features, I really don't like the way roaches look in general. The new queen is awesome, though. Just wish that the roach could look less like a beachball with spikes.
New queen looks pretty good I think. And I definitely think roach design could use an overhaul. I was just enjoying the unit mix in that battle report and thinking how much better hydra look aesthetically as the core unit rather than the roach. Beachball with spikes it is. But hydra, swarmlord, defiler thingy looked pretty cool. Yeah, staying active with that unit is just can be so valuable. I mean, every time you are able to land the shields onto those minerals- that’s guaranteed harassment. It doesn’t matter whether or not they’re fast on the reaction. It’s still a small amount of mining time they won’t be able to access. Rob Simpson from the battle report. Although an interesting idea, this is precisely why I think the oracle harass is not very good similar to FF's. I'm sure it will get balanced. But it will never be the unit interaction like BW storms, reaver shots that were big hits or misses depending on who was faster. Or good map awareness with DTs that didn't trigger an alarm when atttacking workers. But this will always be did I get close enough with out being sniped? If yes, then freeze minerals for x amount of time (x amount being tweaked for balance). If no, then no damage. But it requires very little interaction between units/ players reaction time. Sure taking down minerals requires a reaction, but it's not the same as: Did I get close enough without my shuttle getting sniped? If yes, then quickly unload high templar, unleash 1-2 storms before the opposing player races all his workers away for little to no damage. If the opposing player doesn't react, the entire line of workers get's wiped out. But it's all about who is faster, not just on entry, but also on the attack execution. "that’s guaranteed harassment. It doesn’t matter whether or not they’re fast on the reaction." I don't particularly like this idea for a harassment unit. I agree, but this also isn't as effective as normal harassment, without killing the workers you're not preventing the snowball nature of economic development, you're merely removing income temporarily, I don't think it will be a replacement for effective late game harassment. Agreed and people will adapt to the harassment quickly. If you watch the report. the bubbles only have 75 HP and can be focused down quickly. Also the Oracle only has 20 shields and 80 HP. It will die if something looks at it sideways. The thing is I think its the fastest thing in the air and it can block static defense so it could still be very useful. I can also see terrans needing to leave a few units behind to deal with it.
They never said that in the vid... source?
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On June 09 2012 09:09 Kaw wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2012 09:05 Naphal wrote:On June 09 2012 09:01 s3rp wrote:On June 09 2012 08:59 Kaw wrote:On June 09 2012 08:56 guruPanda wrote:On June 09 2012 08:50 Naphal wrote:
i like how they chose to mainly trash terran fortifications with the new protoss and zerg units -.-
terran units underwhelming in comparison... i mean the mine takes how long to explode? even i could micro units away with the time displayed in the video, better yet, i could even micro these units into the enemy... pick up mines with stalkers and blink them into the bio. Very interesting aspect, but we don't know if the mines have friendly splash yet. We do know that the mines don't go off if the unit dies. If I try to blink a single stalker on top of any mid game terran army it will be dead instantly. If mines don't go off if the units dies it seems pretty meh especially with 10 second timer... yeah i would at least like to focus roaches with a mine attached so i can get that splash damage done <.< The mine is guaranteed to kill the unit that steps on it. I think hoping the mines will single-handedly vaporize entire armies is a little ridiculous.
They could tone done the damage .. I mean you lose the mine that has to be build from the factory for mins/gas as well at least make it mean something. Killing 1 lower HP unit doesn't seem very useful.
Right now it looks as useful as Seeker Missile ( not very useful ) great if your opponent doesn't pay attention awful otherwise..
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On June 09 2012 09:00 Vertig0 wrote:
The widow mine looks great, Terran has to figure out the best places to place them, and the opponent has to micro once
really? I cant imagine them being useful under any situation, unless your just playing bronze people all day. Its nice blizzard think about the lower ranked people in development terms, but its certainly doesnt add much to the scene in terms of viability or mixing up current Terran meta
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On June 09 2012 09:05 setzer wrote:
Lol Dustin expects pros to not get hit by the Wwdow mine? How about no one with actual eyesight and mouse control. The timer will have to be drastically reduced if the unit is ever going to be functional.
The timer should be reduced, but I like the idea of it.
It's not intended to be used in large engagements (like banelings) , it's intended to punish mediocre players that a-move a small force into the fog of war without paying proper attention.
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On June 09 2012 09:03 Starshaped wrote:
So, does the warhound no longer have AA capabilities? Because I thought that was the whole point of making them (better AA than thors), to make mech more well-rounded.
Also, why does Protoss and Zerg get these cool and inventive units while Terran is stuck with transformer hellions and the goliath's ugly brother?
If this is more or less what HotS will be I will switch race, lol.
My thoughts exactly. I really like Protoss and might consider switching.
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I Hope they actually give reapers something good the current change seems more like a nerf to me as they just become fragile heillions (that can cliff hop)
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On June 09 2012 09:05 Naphal wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2012 09:01 s3rp wrote:On June 09 2012 08:59 Kaw wrote:On June 09 2012 08:56 guruPanda wrote:On June 09 2012 08:50 Naphal wrote:
i like how they chose to mainly trash terran fortifications with the new protoss and zerg units -.-
terran units underwhelming in comparison... i mean the mine takes how long to explode? even i could micro units away with the time displayed in the video, better yet, i could even micro these units into the enemy... pick up mines with stalkers and blink them into the bio. Very interesting aspect, but we don't know if the mines have friendly splash yet. We do know that the mines don't go off if the unit dies. If I try to blink a single stalker on top of any mid game terran army it will be dead instantly. If mines don't go off if the units dies it seems pretty meh especially with 10 second timer... yeah i would at least like to focus roaches with a mine attached so i can get that splash damage done <.<
Obviously the answer is just to not shoot anything to prevent accidentally killing a unit with a widow mine on it. /sarcasm
Yeah it's gonna be...meh
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On June 09 2012 08:23 Defacer wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2012 08:03 Durp wrote:I imagine the Oracle will force a lot more in-base macro orbitals and more planetaries at the actual mining bases On June 09 2012 08:03 Defacer wrote:On June 09 2012 06:59 Synk wrote:
So if mothership is still in, does that mean that 18 months after they came out and said the archon toilet was broken then did a half assed "fix" for it and failed .. it will still be in the game and just as broken as ever? That was literally the biggest thing I was looking forward to was no more ruined games via vortex/3-4 archons. Actually, in the other thread, they mention that the vortex will only affect ground untils, while there will be a separate stasis spell for air units. The vortex was always overpowered against Cruisers, Broodlords and Corrupters. Personally I think if a toss allows their opponent to reach 200/200 with battlecruisers a la MVP, they deserve to lose. Except that protoss has the relatively weakest anti-air. Voidrays are really flimsy, corruptors > phoenix, viking micro > protoss air. Why do you think the tempest is there? It's like a fucking broodlord that hits ground and air with twice the range. That shit is going to be ridiculous! Can you imagine a small flock of phoenixes flying around mutas with a couple tempests in the background? The mutas would die before getting a shot off.
That scares me - mass Protoss Air. Whew. I'm excited though to be honest. Looks pretty good, though in unfinished form. Liked a bunch of the new animations (as a minor side note).
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On June 09 2012 08:50 Ev0lution wrote:
Add me to the list of dissappointed/not impressed. What is the point of practising to become good at SC2 when they totally change the game every 3 years? I was hoping SC2 would become a timeless game like chess only for future generations. But with the pieces changing (not even for the better, herp derp caster units WC3 derp) alas we see that it is just another money hungry company trying to squeeze every dollar out of your wallet.
...sc --> brood war?
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On June 09 2012 09:14 obsidia wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2012 09:00 Vertig0 wrote:
The widow mine looks great, Terran has to figure out the best places to place them, and the opponent has to micro once
really? I cant imagine them being useful under any situation, unless your just playing bronze people all day. Its nice blizzard think about the lower ranked people in development terms, but its certainly doesnt add much to the scene in terms of viability or mixing up current Terran meta
How is a unit that clearly dilineates the pro's from the joe's a bad thing?
It only punishes bad players. People should be all for it.
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On June 09 2012 09:14 obsidia wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2012 09:00 Vertig0 wrote:
The widow mine looks great, Terran has to figure out the best places to place them, and the opponent has to micro once
really? I cant imagine them being useful under any situation, unless your just playing bronze people all day. Its nice blizzard think about the lower ranked people in development terms, but its certainly doesnt add much to the scene in terms of viability or mixing up current Terran meta
I disagree since the general concept of the spider mine is useful also on pro level (BW proves) and things that make it easily managable on higher level in its current form, like the long time until it goes off and the easy way to identify the unit it is attached to can still change during the beta.
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Everyone still hasn't clued into how deadly those mines could be to a mineral line. Yeah you can thank me for this genius idea.
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On June 09 2012 09:14 obsidia wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2012 09:00 Vertig0 wrote:
The widow mine looks great, Terran has to figure out the best places to place them, and the opponent has to micro once
really? I cant imagine them being useful under any situation, unless your just playing bronze people all day. Its nice blizzard think about the lower ranked people in development terms, but its certainly doesnt add much to the scene in terms of viability or mixing up current Terran meta
When a protoss moves out to attack put mines between his robo and his army. Put mines behind your mineral lines and he loses his 200 gas Oracle for free.
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On June 09 2012 09:19 Kaw wrote:Show nested quote +On June 09 2012 09:14 obsidia wrote:On June 09 2012 09:00 Vertig0 wrote:
The widow mine looks great, Terran has to figure out the best places to place them, and the opponent has to micro once
really? I cant imagine them being useful under any situation, unless your just playing bronze people all day. Its nice blizzard think about the lower ranked people in development terms, but its certainly doesnt add much to the scene in terms of viability or mixing up current Terran meta When a protoss moves out to attack put mines between his robo and his army. Put mines behind your mineral lines and he loses his 200 gas Oracle for free.
I could just place a few Turrets for defense ? The mine right now looks a gigantic gimmick . Why the hell does Terran need another gimmick we already have Ravens/Reapers .Why do we need another Unit with no real use in combat situations ?
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EPT
