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TheRabidDeer
United States3806 Posts
On May 03 2012 10:12 Foogazi wrote: if this queen change goes through imagine mass queen broodlord/ultra transfuses with super creep spread Really? Have people lost all sense of logic and thought when they see this? | ||
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Chewbacca.
United States3634 Posts
I like OL change, especially now that most maps are larger the increased speed allows a better early game scout. Queen change seems like a little much, if anything just add 5-10 starting energy, this way you still have to make a choice to inject or spread, but if you choose to spread you wont have to wait quite as long for the inject. I understand why they are doing the queen change...hellions can deny creep for a long time and having an extra tumor would really help, but just getting an extra queen kind of works well enough as it is. | ||
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-Switch-
Canada506 Posts
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-KarakStarcraft-
United States258 Posts
On May 03 2012 10:12 Foogazi wrote: if this queen change goes through imagine mass queen broodlord/ultra transfuses with super creep spread It's 25 STARTING energy. They aren't doubling energy regen or cutting the cost. JUST 25 STARTING. You can't seem to understand this. | ||
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aksfjh
United States4853 Posts
On May 03 2012 10:12 bakedace wrote: An overlord could not block a Fast Expanding player. It's not even close... Terran and Protoss can block with pylon and engibay.. A fast thrid could be delayed in the current meta, but people would just make 1 marine or 1 stalker. It's a little different with a pylon or engineering bay, since you kill the building and you can make an expansion. You kill the overlord and the creep is still there. We're not talking about a 14/15 expand. Also, like he said, it would probably be fast enough to prevent wall offs in close air positions, giving Z the ability to gamble an extremely quick win in some cases. | ||
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S_SienZ
1878 Posts
On May 03 2012 10:14 Karak wrote: It's 25 STARTING energy. They aren't doubling energy regen or cutting the cost. JUST 25 STARTING. You can't seem to understand this. Which means getting Queens late game for the sole purpose for Transfuse will now work the moment they pop. This is basically Khaydarin Amulet / Pathogen Glands for Queens. | ||
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Shiori
3815 Posts
On May 03 2012 10:14 Karak wrote: It's 25 STARTING energy. They aren't doubling energy regen or cutting the cost. JUST 25 STARTING. You can't seem to understand this. That means you can literally just pump Queens and have readily available Transfuses (which is going to absolutely murder Stargate and Banshee openings)... | ||
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heliusx
United States2306 Posts
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theBOOCH
United States832 Posts
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Shiori
3815 Posts
On May 03 2012 10:17 theBOOCH wrote: Interesting. I especially don't think the 50 energy queen is too crazy. 4 queen openings vs terran will be interesting because that's a LOT more creep, but normal openings won't be drastically different. All this late game nonsense is ridiculous. It's 25 energy once, it's something like a 60 second advance on initial creep spread. The overseer change is good for several things (emergency banshee, dt defense), but I doubt it will make much of an overall difference, especially for scouting. Overlord speed is huge, any movement benefit is welcomed. It's also automatic defense against any air opening from any race. | ||
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-Debaser-
United States329 Posts
On May 03 2012 10:14 Karak wrote: It's 25 STARTING energy. They aren't doubling energy regen or cutting the cost. JUST 25 STARTING. You can't seem to understand this. what did i read wrong? | ||
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Nabes
Canada1800 Posts
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khanofmongols
542 Posts
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aksfjh
United States4853 Posts
On May 03 2012 10:18 Shiori wrote: It's also automatic defense against any air opening from any race. Don't forget that it now auto-wins against that Slayers hellion elevator, since planned creepspread was the counter. Now Z just has to make 2 queens to get the creep coverage and not be stupid about it. | ||
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onPHYRE
Bulgaria888 Posts
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AKomrade
United States582 Posts
Faster obs time means the window for any banshee harrass will be gone by the time it hits simply because of the way the common builds go. It'll be game ending in TA first instead of robo first builds still. If they change this, the immortal range and upgrade speed changes should be reverted. Good to take care of the 1/1/1 (something they should've done a year ago), but without taking any of the other changes away (remove Stim nerf, barracks nerf or remove ups time/immortal range) far FAR too powerful. There won't BE a midgame in TvP quickly after this. Queen change is totally unneeded. Creep spread SHOULD be a challenge since the buff (presumed) to overlords will probably be enough to get that scouting needed post expand and help vs certain early marine pressures and its value later in the game is far too valuable to simply hand to Zerg. Any pressure designed to make Zerg sacrifice drone production before or as the third comes up will be stopped simply by scouting and making queens to transfuse each other, while using minimal actual larva to defend, leaving nearly no damage actually dealt and Terran in a much weaker position that they really can't afford to be in. Overlord speed boost totally needed. Only took fucking two years to do anything about it. Come to think of it, didn't the bunker change come out this time last year? | ||
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Kraznaya
United States3711 Posts
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tWR
Canada138 Posts
Turning attention the observer build time... is this too forgiving if protoss fails to scout a 1-1-1? | ||
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sluggaslamoo
Australia4494 Posts
Seriously guys Zerg early game sucks balls, obviously they should do something to fix it. The extra energy in the beginning just allows you to get creep + inject on the first queen that spawns, after that there is not much difference. FFS its not like the queen actually has extra energy overall. And early observer shouldn't be a problem, banshees shouldn't be guaranteed to have 5 kills right off the bat (there's even a joke in korea that a banshee automatically starts with 10 kills), you should be forced to make it work and it should be a decision which should be based on the opponents build, not just going, ok I'm going banshees because it always pays itself off anyway. | ||
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templar rage
United States2509 Posts
On May 03 2012 10:05 aksfjh wrote: But T still has to cripple their economy to kill creep with a scan. The only thing low pressure that can outright win a game for T is if the Z is caught completely flatfooted, which is how the game works. T is also succeptable to low pressure moves from Z, like econ baneling busts, but they don't feel the need to do that since stacking econ will likely win a game outright. If using a scan to kill creep early crippled your economy, do you really think it would be so commonplace? And no, Terrans aren't really susceptible to "low pressure moves" from a Zerg. In fact, I'd argue that there is no such thing. Compared to a Terran, Zergs have to commit substantially more to any form of early aggression (at least any that has a chance of accomplishing something), usually to the point where you're all-in or almost all-in. Zergs pretty much have to choose between putting on early pressure, or working on an economy, at least if you want to do either on them correctly. It's just the way Zerg works. | ||
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