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Developers Update : Heart of the Swarm - Page 22

Forum Index > SC2 General
1844 CommentsPost a Reply
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Parodoxx
Profile Joined May 2010
United States549 Posts
April 11 2012 18:52 GMT
#421
All these changes sound really good.

I need to wait and see this Protoss siege tank that hits air and ground before I toss it in as OP...
FeiLing
Profile Joined March 2011
Germany428 Posts
April 11 2012 18:52 GMT
#422
We are also experimenting with an extremely long-ranged terran missile launcher that can be used to break siege tank lines to make terran-vs.-terran factory-based games more dynamic.


Wouldn't that just turn SiegeTank vs SiegeTank battles into EvenLargerRangeAttackUnit vs EvenLargerRangeAttackUnit?

Does any Zerg or Protoss here actually not go crazy when they imagine they're thinking about adding a "EvenLargerRangeThan-A-SiegedTankAttackUnit, that doesn't even have to be set up" to the Terran arsenal?
Nhed
Profile Joined October 2010
France14 Posts
April 11 2012 18:52 GMT
#423
i'm sad that they dont keep the shredder for terran. This unit has a lot of potential
babybell
Profile Joined June 2011
776 Posts
April 11 2012 18:52 GMT
#424
Seems like we get the carrier back yey.
adapt!
Profile Joined April 2011
Israel108 Posts
April 11 2012 18:53 GMT
#425
The overseer is back again, lol
Anyway, sounds like they were listening to us...
Roe
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Canada6002 Posts
April 11 2012 18:53 GMT
#426
1. With the shredder gone I have no idea how Terrans will fight off Zerg counterattacks. I guess the new battle hellions might help. But I don't see how the shredder is confusing or doesn't give warning. It takes a long time to burrow, has to waddle over to the enemy, and can be given a lower hitpoints/armour.

2. The long range missile launcher used to break siege tank lines.....ummm Yamato anyone? Terrans don't need a missile launcher because we already have yamato. Also nukes.

3. Getting energy by feeding off minerals just sounds really weird. I don't know why, it just doesn't feel right.

4. Overseer still in the game? Dustin Browder specifically said you can't have a unit which has supply and spells...and that was the reasoning for taking it out.
Falling
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Canada11367 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-11 18:55:49
April 11 2012 18:53 GMT
#427
Thinking about anti-air mines. I guess? But if they are going for more positional play, air is really not positional at all because there is no terrain blocking them. Unless air is forced to abuse cliffs to survive. If they can roam freely, that's trouble for positional play. Otherwise, it's just wide open unless they run into anti-air. It would probably be better to bring anti-air mines back down again and back off some of the air power in general.

All positional play comes from ground whereas SC2 has much more powerful air. The air that could be more powerful is the fragile sort that needs lots of micro to be effective- but can be REALLY effective. But if left alone will die to stim marines. If air is considered more of a support role to the ground army, would we get different results?

Whatever the case may be... more microability. That's all I want.
Moderator"In Trump We Trust," says the Golden Goat of Mars Lago. Have faith and believe! Trump moves in mysterious ways. Like the wind he blows where he pleases...
BronzeKnee
Profile Joined March 2011
United States5217 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-11 18:55:01
April 11 2012 18:53 GMT
#428
On April 12 2012 03:49 jj33 wrote:
All you guys complaining about blizz, just remember vanilla sc.

It was pretty bad at times, it took bw and a huge patch to really get things going for sc1.

Blizz hasn't done the best job in sc2, but considering how vanilla sc1 was and how sc2 is, they are doing pretty good.


Many of the problems Blizzard is having with SC2 are fixed almost immediately when they listen to the community.

Remember when they wanted to have "rush maps" on the ladder like Slag Pits? And remember when Browder said that tournament maps and ladder maps should be different? Yeah...

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that the Replicant is a horrible unit idea. I've spoken out against it from the start, as have many others. Blizzard wants to "do their own thing" when I always felt their games were so great because they were so basic and simple, not because they were really ground breaking or unique.
BlueLanterna
Profile Joined April 2011
291 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-11 18:55:20
April 11 2012 18:54 GMT
#429
On April 12 2012 03:50 synapse wrote:
Show nested quote +
We are also experimenting with an extremely long-ranged terran missile launcher that can be used to break siege tank lines to make terran-vs.-terran factory-based games more dynamic.


.... TvT is the most dynamic mirror in the game...


Are you kidding? Bronze and silver league players find siege lines so boring, let's give them something they can attack with from halfway across the map without even needing to move out with their army!
TBone-
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States2309 Posts
April 11 2012 18:54 GMT
#430
On April 12 2012 03:50 synapse wrote:
Show nested quote +
We are also experimenting with an extremely long-ranged terran missile launcher that can be used to break siege tank lines to make terran-vs.-terran factory-based games more dynamic.


.... TvT is the most dynamic mirror in the game...


Its the one matchup where EVERY single unit is used. How can you get more dynamic than that?!?
Eve online FC, lover of all competition
Gackt_
Profile Joined March 2010
335 Posts
April 11 2012 18:54 GMT
#431
I dont get why they try to delete mutas out of the game. The terran got 50 mineral marines with stimpack. They got marines and Turrets to defend their base with. If they wanna replace the Thor they dont have to make a überunit that got splash dmg to delete the mutas.

Removing the Shredder and Replicant are VERY good news tho. 2 freaking stupid units. The shredder especially, that unit would've deleted Zerg chances off winning a 10 min+ game in a ZvT.

And I dont get the Tempest thingy..it sounds like they are building a new voidray?? Like comon..
Demonhunter04
Profile Joined July 2011
1530 Posts
April 11 2012 18:55 GMT
#432
On April 12 2012 03:19 Rkie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 12 2012 03:14 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
On April 12 2012 03:11 densha wrote:
I'm concerned that the Viper's "blind" spell is pointless.

It would have been very helpful to break entrenched positions and to help Z engage Protoss armies. Now that it only works on bio units I don't see the point - wouldn't you rather have infestors against bio?


Doesn't it make Terran bio somewhat... worthless? It's a mass optical flare right?


From my understanding, it was both sight and firing range. Optical Flare was just sight I think. If it is what I thought it to be, I don't really see that going into release. It makes any ranged unit that gets hit by it essentially useless, and Protoss needs that range to be able to fight Zerg.


It creates a cloud that you can just move out of...it's not permanent. See disruption web. It also only affects bio, so Protoss will be unaffected except for the case of high templar underneath the cloud.
"If you don't drop sweat today, you will drop tears tomorrow" - SlayerSMMA
xrapture
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
United States1644 Posts
April 11 2012 18:55 GMT
#433
On April 12 2012 03:54 TBone- wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 12 2012 03:50 synapse wrote:
We are also experimenting with an extremely long-ranged terran missile launcher that can be used to break siege tank lines to make terran-vs.-terran factory-based games more dynamic.


.... TvT is the most dynamic mirror in the game...


Its the one matchup where EVERY single unit is used. How can you get more dynamic than that?!?


I guess they want it more like the other mirrors. Thrilling battles like roach vs roach and collosi vs collosi.
Everyone is either delusional, a nihlilst, or dead from suicide.
jj33
Profile Joined April 2011
802 Posts
April 11 2012 18:55 GMT
#434
On April 12 2012 03:53 BronzeKnee wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 12 2012 03:49 jj33 wrote:
All you guys complaining about blizz, just remember vanilla sc.

It was pretty bad at times, it took bw and a huge patch to really get things going for sc1.

Blizz hasn't done the best job in sc2, but considering how vanilla sc1 was and how sc2 is, they are doing pretty good.


The problems Blizzard is having are fixed almost immediately when they listen to the community.

Remember when they wanted to have "rush maps" on the ladder like Slag Pits? And remember when Browder said that tournament maps and ladder maps should be different? Yeah.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that the Replicant is a horrible unit idea. I've spoken out against it from the start, as have many others. Blizzard wants to "do their own thing" when I always felt their games were so great because they were so basic and simple, not because they were really ground breaking or unique.



I agree with you.

blizzard frustrates me as well, but at the least, I try and not stress myself over it yet. I will wait for heart of the swarm to come out and see how it goes with the patches.

I'm just putting into perspective how vanilla sc1 was compared to how sc2 is now.
crms
Profile Joined February 2010
United States11933 Posts
April 11 2012 18:55 GMT
#435
On April 12 2012 03:46 blade55555 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 12 2012 03:36 BigBossX wrote:
On April 12 2012 03:30 zazone wrote:
On April 12 2012 02:44 BigBossX wrote:
On April 12 2012 02:39 crms wrote:
starcraft 2 is not the great game that the starcraft diehard (bw maniacs) deserved. we have fooled ourselves into thinking starcraft2 is an amazing esport title but it's actually a mediocre PC RTS that nobody would play if it wasn't titled 'starcraft'.

It sucks because I was so hyped for SC2, but after the hype dies you start to see the game much more clearly. I'm not convinced that HoTS is going to change any of the inherent problems with SC2.


This has opened my eyes. Best post in this thread. Agree 100%


You don't need a post to open your eyes. After I watched several games of competitive BW, even if I was a SC2 player and started with SC2, I already knew something was wrong and irreversible within the game design. Also this video shows it


we have fooled ourselves into thinking starcraft2 is an amazing esport title but it's actually a mediocre PC RTS that nobody would play if it wasn't titled 'starcraft'.

This is what I meant by having my eyes opened. Yes I realised long time ago something was off especially compared to BW but somehow seeing it written down and explained so simply made it so much more clearer and obvious


It's nice and all that you don't like sc2, but it is a really good game, just because you don't like it doesn't mean it isn't. There are people who don't like bw for whatever reason and think it is worse, it's all opinion. It obviously is a good esport if people think it is, people don't lie to themselves on what they enjoy. There are people who enjoy watching and playing sc2, and some only enjoy watching, they obviously enjoy it as why would you force yourself to watch something you don't like or think is mediocre as you seem to think?

I am fine with bw players not liking sc2, I love both but it is super annoying to see you guys just rip on sc2 constantly and then complain when some people go to the bw forum and say something you disagree with when you do the same thing.



I'm not one of the BW champions that you illustrate, I'm just an esports fan who was very hyped for sc2 as the next big competitive game. I see your point about if people like it, it must be good, but lots of people like reality tv shows, and britney spears. Marketing and cultural influences often supercede any sort of objective reality on 'good' or 'bad'.

What do you think of my challenge? Do you think SC2 would have even a 1/10th the success had it not been a blizzard released sequel to a successful gaming franchise? Do you think the gameplay alone in sc2 could carry it to such heights? If this was StarCommander 2: Next gen Esports RTS, would anyone have cared about it? I don't think so.. and I think anyone being honest with themself would say the same.
http://i.imgur.com/fAUOr2c.png | Fighting games are great
nihlon
Profile Joined April 2010
Sweden5581 Posts
April 11 2012 18:56 GMT
#436
On April 12 2012 03:36 BigBossX wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 12 2012 03:30 zazone wrote:
On April 12 2012 02:44 BigBossX wrote:
On April 12 2012 02:39 crms wrote:
starcraft 2 is not the great game that the starcraft diehard (bw maniacs) deserved. we have fooled ourselves into thinking starcraft2 is an amazing esport title but it's actually a mediocre PC RTS that nobody would play if it wasn't titled 'starcraft'.

It sucks because I was so hyped for SC2, but after the hype dies you start to see the game much more clearly. I'm not convinced that HoTS is going to change any of the inherent problems with SC2.


This has opened my eyes. Best post in this thread. Agree 100%


You don't need a post to open your eyes. After I watched several games of competitive BW, even if I was a SC2 player and started with SC2, I already knew something was wrong and irreversible within the game design. Also this video shows it http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7k3ZM6bQx4


we have fooled ourselves into thinking starcraft2 is an amazing esport title but it's actually a mediocre PC RTS that nobody would play if it wasn't titled 'starcraft'.

This is what I meant by having my eyes opened. Yes I realised long time ago something was off especially compared to BW but somehow seeing it written down and explained so simply made it so much more clearer and obvious


By that standard all rts games other than broodwar is mediocre. That's a horrible logic. No matter what you think of sc2 there aren't any new rts games that's anywhere close.
Banelings are too cute to blow up
TheKefka
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Croatia11752 Posts
April 11 2012 18:56 GMT
#437
On April 12 2012 03:50 synapse wrote:
Show nested quote +
We are also experimenting with an extremely long-ranged terran missile launcher that can be used to break siege tank lines to make terran-vs.-terran factory-based games more dynamic.


.... TvT is the most dynamic mirror in the game...

Exactly,TvT is since the beta the most entertaining mirror to watch for me at least.I have no idea what they are trying to fix here and it seems like a pretty bad idea to introduce new units because of a mirror.
The stalemates in TvT that we have occasionally is caused more because of the maps that are easy to split in half.
Marauders and blue flame hellions are already enough of a instability to make it dynamic in a world of siege tank positioning battles.
Cackle™
BlueLanterna
Profile Joined April 2011
291 Posts
April 11 2012 18:56 GMT
#438
On April 12 2012 03:55 Demonhunter04 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 12 2012 03:19 Rkie wrote:
On April 12 2012 03:14 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
On April 12 2012 03:11 densha wrote:
I'm concerned that the Viper's "blind" spell is pointless.

It would have been very helpful to break entrenched positions and to help Z engage Protoss armies. Now that it only works on bio units I don't see the point - wouldn't you rather have infestors against bio?


Doesn't it make Terran bio somewhat... worthless? It's a mass optical flare right?


From my understanding, it was both sight and firing range. Optical Flare was just sight I think. If it is what I thought it to be, I don't really see that going into release. It makes any ranged unit that gets hit by it essentially useless, and Protoss needs that range to be able to fight Zerg.


It creates a cloud that you can just move out of...it's not permanent. See disruption web. It also only affects bio, so Protoss will be unaffected except for the case of high templar underneath the cloud.


LOL so it really is Dark Swarm but range reduced to 1 instead of 0? GG Blizzard the jig is up
virpi
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Germany3599 Posts
April 11 2012 18:56 GMT
#439
the protoss air thing sounds pretty strange to me. why do they need a long range aoe unit? I'd also agree on the idea of fixing the carrier in some way. I love the ideas they have for zerg, but I think that they should focus on making zerg lategame a little bit more "zerglike", i.e. something besides a broodlord army.
first we make expand, then we defense it.
StrinterN
Profile Joined April 2010
Denmark531 Posts
April 11 2012 18:56 GMT
#440
These changes actually sounds good!
Twitter: @Strintern Stream: http://www.twitch.tv/strintern
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