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Instead of saying "fix this and that" about bnet....
List what features you would want to have. If you dont like the 'lack of socializing' that bnet has, then what do you think would improve on that? I share the same opinion as most of you people about bnet, but I cant think of 1 thing that would make it better.
I just have 0 friends on the game, and the only contact I have with anyone ont he game is on the ladder. We dont spend the whole game talking (unless they rage out because I didnt say glhf lol) about how our day is going. I cheese, it either works or fails, they promptly explain how bad I am and how I'll always be in platinum and then leave the game, continue messaging me via PM while having me on ignore, and then after they are done they never speak to me again lol.
Explain to me how in the hell i gain friends on this game because I dont think it is possible.
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On February 14 2012 08:29 Interneting wrote:
My little story as to how I lost interest and am joining the people that admit "I just don't care enough to put the work in anymore."
Played T since Beta, ranked into Silver and quickly promoted up to plat. I was loving it. Then Christmas Eve of '10 my roommate accidentally set the house on fire and I lived in a hotel for 3 months after. When I came back, I couldn't compete with others at my skill level and I got demoted to Gold. I started a new job and bounced between Gold/Plat until I had finally widdled down my last thing keeping me from diamond: TvZ. I got some practice partners, but I just couldn't get over this hurdle. TvT and TvP were very solid MU's for me at the time I was mixing up thor rush and MMMGV in TvP. Then thors got nerfed to have energy and HT's were feedbacking me to death. NP I thought, I'll just play standard all the time (as I probably should). Then EMP got nerfed and suddenly I was losing 80% of my TvP's. During this time I finally got over my struggles in TvZ to a degree by utilizing drop play better and being less afraid to take some risks. At this point I was roughly 50% TvT, 50% TvZ, and 20% TvP.
I started working on alternate ways to deal with TvP and then they started making new seasons every other month. This caused my IRL buddies who played 1's to stop playing because they were all so worried about their damn ranking and demotions that they wouldn't play the game hardly at all. It quickly became a matter of "I'll play one game to get my diamond badge back and then not touch 1's until next season." They became so disconnected by this change that they wouldn't even play 1's with me just to practice.
Now I get on bnet and it's a lonely place unless my very casual buddies (Silverish league) want to play 2's. They never want to practice 1v1 because I'll just crush them and they've experienced it enough I guess.
I still don't know how to deal with TvP and frankly I just don't care anymore. Every time I get over a hurdle blizzard throws a new one in my way. Infestor buffs are what caused the TvZ issue to begin with if I remember right. I feel like all of the fun has been sucked out of SC2 through a vaccuum. Every time I learn something it gets changed. I used to play a lot of Capcom Vs. SNK 2 back in the day and the one thing that made the game's inbalances tolerable was that once I learned how to deal with them, I had that knowledge forever. No patch was coming to fix Roll Cancels or A-Groove Bison at the arcade and once I learned how to deal with it, even if unfavorably, that knowledge wasn't being yanked from me as I moved onto the next flaw I wanted to fix in my gameplay.
The final nail in the coffin for my interest was this long break that the procircuits I follow took (MLG, GSL). Now that GSL is going and MLG is on the horizon, I find I need to force myself to get back in the loops which is why I was browsing TL today.
I'm not defending myself or anything like that. I could have worked a lot harder and I could have put more pressure on my friends to keep up with the game and spar more often. I know this game is patched semi-regularly and balance changes happen for a reason. If I want to keep my skill level up in all matchups and advance through the ladder I have to adapt to the changes. The one thing I will defend is people's arguments that Bnet 2.0 is lackluster. All it offers is a minimalist ladder system that serves its main purpose well of finding you equally skilled opponents, and that's it. So much more could be however, and that's the real shame in it.
My friends could never get into the game because they couldnt win on the ladder. They dont want to coninute playing because they have other games that they are better at already and dont feel like feeling handicaped for another number of years before they feel comfortable again.
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On February 14 2012 07:58 ishyishy wrote:
Lets use LoL as a moba example. Again, you dont actually have to be good or improve at the game to keep a constant progression going. All you have to do is keep playing, and you will continuously earn points or credits or whatever that game uses to buy characters or whatever. Your level in that game also goes up, AND NEVER GOES DOWN.
Lol actually does a really good job. You have a mock up of the draft system for people who want to play serious games/simulate ranked games without affecting their rating. There is the blind pick mode which is for even more casual play. Finally there is solo ranked with elo ratings that can go up and down for the competitive lone wolf and the ranked team ladder for 5 man premades. This is in addition to the other game modes and the many things you simply gain by just playing the game which you point out. The fact that it is really social also goes a long way but I feel they have done a really good job with their ladder and custom game lobbies etc. It is also incredibly easy to friend, team up and start playing with people you meet here and there while playing.
Game maybe a lot easier but its definitely a lot of fun and there is something for everyone from the 5 man try-hards with vent all the way to the guy sloshed at midnight and wanting to troll people with teemo. Once you play it, its easy to see why the game has a huge following.
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too much effort for too little gain. you have to play atleast 5 games a day to keep up to date with macro, micro and remembering basic things to get further progress. lack of social features is defintely a huuuge minus as well compared to the ground principles old battle.net was based on.
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On February 14 2012 08:42 babyToSS wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 07:58 ishyishy wrote:
Lets use LoL as a moba example. Again, you dont actually have to be good or improve at the game to keep a constant progression going. All you have to do is keep playing, and you will continuously earn points or credits or whatever that game uses to buy characters or whatever. Your level in that game also goes up, AND NEVER GOES DOWN.
Lol actually does a really good job. You have a mock up of the draft system for people who want to play serious games/simulate ranked games without affecting their rating. There is the blind pick mode which is for even more casual play. Finally there is solo ranked with elo ratings that can go up and down for the competitive lone wolf and the ranked team ladder for 5 man premades. This is in addition to the other game modes and the many things you simply gain by just playing the game which you point out. The fact that it is really social also goes a long way but I feel they have done a really good job with their ladder and custom game lobbies etc. It is also incredibly easy to friend, team up and start playing with people you meet here and there while playing. Game maybe a lot easier but its definitely a lot of fun and there is something for everyone from the 5 man try-hards with vent all the way to the guy sloshed at midnight and wanting to troll people with teemo. Once you play it, its easy to see why the game has a huge following.
I actually played it for 2 months and hated it  But I'm not saying it is a bad game. I just dont like that style of game and I hate the fact that the "north american" server also includes south american countries. I got thrown into a game with 4 brazilians that didnt speak 1 word of english, I left the game and then got banned for a day for leaving a game lol. I quit that day.
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What is your problem with playing with people who don't speak english?
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On February 14 2012 03:54 willoc wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 03:46 VIPIrony wrote:On February 14 2012 03:42 willoc wrote:
Dude, they are playing a real match. I know the NA server is preschool these days but cheeses are the first thing you learn on the Korean server and no one complains there. You are in the "no rush 5 mins plz / BGH " mindset. Please get out and learn how to do and deal with early game aggression. I have no problem with dealing with cheeses in most cases, the problem I however have, is that 1 of 20 games is a macro game where I dont either rape their stupid all-in because they know nothing else, or lose to my own mistake, which is good for learning, but boring when you have 2 options all the time. Coinflips SUCK. - I don't play on the preschool server, I'm on epicwinzlol EU EDIT; I wouldn't mind it if they knew when to cheese, or how to spot a weakness, I mind it 'cause they don't even think. Fair enough. I personally don't like "macro" games as they are even more boring in my eyes. Sitting back and maximizing your econ and army in the most efficient way possible without interacting with the other player seems more like single-player to me than anything. However, to each their own play-style right? I love having to balance advanced micro tactics while maintaining production in my own base but a lot of players just turtle up on 1-2 bases leading to an extra 5-10 minutes of making units and buildings (just like in singleplayer) which leads up to big a-move battle with fancy explosions. This obviously does not appeal to me but I won't let it get in my way of enjoying the game or let me use it as an excuse into "why SC2 sucks".
thats exactly wat bad and boring macro games are like. any good macro game from sc2 and most "macro" games from BW are long epic 20-40 games of nonstop fighting, base killing, harrasing etc. wish sc2 was more of that than it now at all levels of play
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On February 14 2012 08:45 ishyishy wrote:I actually played it for 2 months and hated it But I'm not saying it is a bad game. I just dont like that style of game and I hate the fact that the "north american" server also includes south american countries. I got thrown into a game with 4 brazilians that didnt speak 1 word of english, I left the game and then got banned for a day for leaving a game lol. I quit that day.
Not liking the core game is a whole different issue but if someone does like it then it does a lot more to keep you engaged. Which is my main issue with Battle.net. I did enjoy SC2 a lot when it came and do enjoy the game but you have to put in all the effort to make it fun. Frankly speaking if it wasn't for the awesome community, streams, TL etc. SC2 would be no where as popular as it is right now. These are the only things I find engaging about the game at this point.
As for Lol, Riot has finally agreed to separate out NA and SA servers so you won't have that problem again  .
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Are you serious? .. you should try to play shit like HoN... those stupid freaking BR kids or w/e are notoriously for throwing games 'cause they're so freaking bad and only know how to say "fuck you".... say you're bottom, team fight.. and guess what the stupid ass BR kid is doing... TOP LANE FARMING? OH cool bro. you ever gonna come in a team fight? only time they come is after your team is dead and tries to pick off one of the 5 enemies still alive.. and dies...
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Canada13426 Posts
On February 14 2012 08:45 Copymizer wrote:
too much effort for too little gain. you have to play atleast 5 games a day to keep up to date with macro, micro and remembering basic things to get further progress. lack of social features is defintely a huuuge minus as well compared to the ground principles old battle.net was based on.
It seems like everyone is complaining about social features. Why can't we fix this ourselves with IRC, or using chat channels to create small groups of people who like to play together? If you don't like the in game stuff then head over to the TL IRC and ask a Z to practice ZvZ or something. Its all about what you put in that determines what you get out. Kind of like school I guess, the more effort I put in the more I feel I enjoy and get out of it.
It seems to me more and more that I want to get together with a core of practice partners are sometimes my CSL or club mates are online but when they aren't it is pretty isolating.
It must be really bad for the non-students, at least the students generally have clubs to join. Perhaps we need more low level clans just for fun and practice, with the aim being overall betterment like weekly training sessions or something along those lines?
The Day of defeat community had a very very good model for improving players. You would join a realism clan if you were really into the game. The one I joined had about 100-120 active members at all times. The clan was seperated into a Company (everyone) platoons (30-40 people sections) and squads (10-12 people). There were certain responsibilities to run the Unit given to people who show maturity, and dedication. I myself became a squad leader who would train and teach the game to 10-12 people, and then we would all practice tactics and formations (it was a FPS a la counterstrike when modded). Then squads would play small matches against eachother, platoons etc and the best performing squad or platoons could be chosen to take part in scrims with other clans. There were very few other clans but at least internally we remained competitive, always improving and I don't believe we lost a clan war once in the 6 years the Unit was active in Day of Defeat.
Keeping in mind this was about 5 years ago when the playerbase was larger but even then the playerbase was DEFINITELY less than 700k players in NA alone, and we had a very active community at the very least within the unit itself. Among the 120 people and public players our 2 public servers were always full, the 3 private servers were also almost always in use by at least 10-20 people practicing individually and the training server with target practice map always had a couple people in it as well.
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Since s6 has begun, hopefully the numbers won't decrease by even more. ;/
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On February 14 2012 08:48 chestnutcc wrote:
What is your problem with playing with people who don't speak english?
How am supose to play a team-oriented game when I cannot communicate with the people on my team? If I cant actually play the game the way it is intended to be played, then I'm not having fun, and if I am not having fun then I leave the game, and if I leave the game I apparently receive a 1-day ban for it lol. And this is all because they dont want to put south american countries on their own server. Then you get into the games with the brazilians that DO speak english, and all they do the entire time is bash the United States and fat americans lol. Nice community right?
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Yea i have to agree with what some people have said here, I'm only a diamond protoss, i decided to play some more ladder as i normally play with a mate on gsl maps, first 5 games were pvp, 2 cannon rushes,1 proxy 2gate, 1 korean 4gate and 1 regular 4 gate (Tal'darim). While I deserved to lose some of those games, I didn't enjoy any of them so I didn't see a reason to continue not enjoying my time and went back to what I did before.
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Ive stopped playing mostly simply because i discovered the wonder of LoL.
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On February 14 2012 08:48 chestnutcc wrote:
What is your problem with playing with people who don't speak english?
Its not a prejudice against non-english speakers. The SA players for some reason (probably due to the language barrier) have a reputation for kinda being disconnected from the rest of the team and doing their own thing which is pretty much all it takes for your team to lose against any decent competition. Winning losing elo in Lol is serious business, you should see the tempers that flare up xD. I actually find the rage really funny, coz most of it just nonsensical ranting and flaming, and is part of the appeal for me.
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your personal paradigms are of no importance. the big picture is the following: the game is getting old and it never achieved the status of a classic (bw).
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I have too much schoolwork to play seriously and I dont have enough free time to become active
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Troll the game at least, this sort of problem was really common back in the days of counter strike, quake and age of empire games. I for one am not a fan of region wise servers (besides ping related issues), this leads to v irregular growth of the game. RTS games especially can afford to have world wide servers, and pooling players leads to more variety so the NA= Zerg server and endless zvz stuff ceases to be a big problem.
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No idea why brood war fanatics weigh in so much on this, since the disparity between them and the top korean players is even more massive than in sc2 (one would think that since they stuck on despite that massive ceiling, they should do so here too), and besides that was BROOD WAR, not the original game, wait for the expansion before bringing out the guillotine.
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On February 14 2012 08:09 chestnutcc wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 06:52 sc14s wrote:On February 13 2012 23:08 chestnutcc wrote:
Ladder phobia should be a documented phenomenon. Living it right now TT
PS: Yeah, people who imagine themselves to be the greatest macro players if only they could get past the cheese and all ins irritate the hell out of me. Its ladder phobia disguised as strategic xenophobia. yeah.. no i get tired of getting 1 based all inned and /or getting massive amounts of ZvZ sooo i get tired of doing only those and dont bother laddering? its not that i am the greatest macro player or insert random bullshit that you think as some phobia its called boredom not xenophobia.. Getting tired of it is what I call strategic xenophobia. The reason these strategies don't persist as much the higher up you go is because once you learn to deal with them, you move past the people executing them. Case in point: cheese in the lower leagues, like cannon rushes, proxy gates or six pools in bronze and silver. It seems hopeless to those players, but its simple to defend these (at least with a fighting chance) once you learn the game better. Its the same thing, except these all ins and cheeses take a bit more skill to defend. You can't be a legitimate macro player if you can't defend these strategies. 10 zvzs in a row can be tiring and boring, but does one actually even play 10 games before going enough? The point is avoidance without cause i.e. ladder phobia.
you really don't get the point do you?
okay, i give you an example :
last time i played ladder, i played 4 games. in all of them, i got 1base all-in'd.
i defended and won all those 4 games, yet, it felt like a waste of time.
maybe it's just me, but i simply can't enjoy these games. maybe it's also hard for you to understand,
it really discourages me to play ladder, because i don't want to waste my time like that.
and it also kinda makes me mad, because every of those 4 games could have been an (for me) enjoyable game,
yet wasn't, because those players decided to make a coin-flip and lost.
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EPT
