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On January 31 2012 06:30 ZisforZerg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 05:45 k1mjee wrote:
Stephano's turning into the next Naniwa. He's been worse than Nani for a while, just doesn't get as much media attention for his actions for one reason of another, probably b/c he has a humorous personality whereas Nani seems like a stick in the proverbial mud.
Naniwa is actually pretty funny. Watch his and Thorzain's TL Attack  .
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On January 31 2012 06:37 Gurgl wrote:
The drama potential of the SC2 community never seizes to amaze. Some people have a really strict sleeping schedule, I know several ppl who basically turn into mindless zombies if they stay up too late. He basically said no to alot of money because he was too tired to play that day and they refused to reschedule from what I understand, all gamers aren't robots.
Whether you like/dislike what he did, there's no need for all the drama. There's more drama, rumours and speculation in SC2 threads like this than at a sewing meeting for grumpy old women. This mentality only seems to apply to Starcraft, other games don't have all this drama for every little thing.
Except he knowingly put himself in that situation by accepting invites for two tournaments that run at the same time, and it is partly his fault that the ONOG invitational was running so late to begin with. It's completely his right to drop out of a tournament if he feels he can't physically play in it, whether it's group stage or finals, but he just royally fucked over one of them due to his own complete and utter lack of foresight.
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On January 31 2012 06:39 fourColo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 06:36 Gojira621 wrote:
Tired? Go get an energy drink or something and just deal with it. Upset you can't see a stephano game? Just log in to TL and post about it. Stephano is a child and one of my least favorite pros but at least he's better than the privileged, and often times racist spectators.
explain to me how you sound any better than him? if anything, you're the one sounding 'privileged'.
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On January 31 2012 06:35 s4life wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 06:31 halvorg wrote:
I don't see the problem, Stephano forfeited the finals of a mediocre online tournament when they refused to postpone it. Being upset that Stephano refuses to play when beat up and tired at a very unreasonable time for any person to compete in anything is strange to me.
Oh well, I guess ONOG can ban the best foreign player if they want to. I wish other tournaments would ban him too, this is such a lack of respect for fans and organizers he should be made an example of it imho. Integrity and professionalism should count for something, even in such a young sports discipline as e-sports.
He doesn't owe you anything the man was tired after simultaneously playing two tournaments. If he's too tired/exhausted why force him to play for your entertainment. He isn't a circus clown.
IMO he should be allowed to forfeit if he wants not just play feigned matches.
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On January 31 2012 06:35 magnaflow wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 06:33 rabidbot wrote:
Tyler wasn't deep in the bracket, and he hadn't personally held up an entire tourney to play in that tourney, then quit before it was over. So I'm not sure we need a thread on why he quit. Which you could say was even worse. Stephano actually played, Tyler quit after losing 1 match. I really want to know why Tyler dropped.
I could see why you would be curious as to why he dropped, but to imply it was worse makes no sense to me. Tyler dropped before him dropping was a huge deal. Stephano dropped when it couldn't be a bigger deal, and if he would have had an ounce of forethought he could have dropped before the tourney started since it was clear it was going to be late, and even later since he request they wait on him.
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lmao at how French Stephano is.
And that's not a racist comment, simply a cultural observation by someone who has a 2nd home in France.
User was warned for this post
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On January 31 2012 06:41 Hot_Bid wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 06:30 eYeball wrote:
Waiting for another thread regarding Tyler to show up any second now, TeamLiquid Esports. I am not sure whether people are actually serious about this, do you really think that there should be a thread every time someone forfeits in a tournament? Do you truly think that "Tyler forfeits round 1 of tournament" is worth a thread by itself? It is not a notable news worthy event. The situation with Stephano in the finals of a major invitational (3k prize pool) is something that never happened before, and about a player who is one of the best (if not the best) non-Koreans. Think about what would happen in either scenario: 1. We make a thread just about Tyler forfeiting People complain because it clearly isn't news worthy. Tyler dropping out in the first round doesn't really affect the tournament. Tyler isn't winning championships and didn't forfeit in the finals. People will say its just TL "hyping another one of their players who doesn't get results" etc. 2. We don't make a thread about Tyler forfeiting People react like they are in this thread Tyler forfeiting doesn't fit in this thread, and isn't even close to the level of notability / newsworthiness that this situation with Stephano is. It seems a bit unfair and far too easy to just point and yell bias all the time. I still don't understand whether people actually believe there should be a thread about Tyler's forfeit or whether they just like finding things to complain about.
So you're KESPA ?
HOTBID for RULER !
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On January 31 2012 06:18 MrBazinga wrote:
Hey there, this is Roger Federer. Listen, I can't make it to the Grand Slam on time, you have to delay my match 1 hour.
Phew, I've made it to the final. Oh, but listen you Grand Slam dudes, I dont want to play on Sunday, I'm in no shape. Move the match to Monday or i won't play.
... people like this shouldn't be moved to 4th place, they should be disqualified immediately.
Well in fairness, Djokovic did pull out mid way through his Australian Open QF a few years ago due to heat exhaustion - he was the defending champion at the time. There were a lot of headlines about whether he should have done this or not as many other players were playing in the same circumstances. He obviously wasn't docked a finishing place or prize money as it was "only" a QF and there was plenty more matches to be played. He got a lot of flak but at the end of it all - he did was was best for his health.
To parallel this with ONOG, Kas also played in the SCAN invitation with Stephano before hand but played only 1 match less. Kas also lives in a timezone that made it worse for him - but managed to play them both fine.
Stephano hasn't complained about his punishment as it has been justified in order to cater to the fans of the game. Forfeiting at a group stage or before the finals would probably have only meant a walkover - also fair.
Going back to Tennis, there sometimes are forfeits/injuries in finals (not necessarily GS's) and it is just taken as a "awww shame, really wanted to watch that final!". It's then blown up in the news about how able that player actually was - and depending on how major the event is the players push themselves beyond the limit (just look at Sunday's match). there might be a policy of refunds for ticket holders if there less than x sets of play or something, not really sure. I know there is in cricket if it's called off for rain if less than x overs have been bowled.
That can not be done for e-sports as it's broadcast free. Providing a proper final is the only way to give something back to the viewers for not seeing the final that was scheduled.
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On January 31 2012 06:41 Hot_Bid wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 06:30 eYeball wrote:
Waiting for another thread regarding Tyler to show up any second now, TeamLiquid Esports. I am not sure whether people are actually serious about this, do you really think that there should be a thread every time someone forfeits in a tournament? Do you truly think that "Tyler forfeits round 1 of tournament" is worth a thread by itself? It is not a notable news worthy event. The situation with Stephano in the finals of a major invitational (3k prize pool) is something that never happened before, and about a player who is one of the best (if not the best) non-Koreans. Think about what would happen in either scenario: 1. We make a thread just about Tyler forfeiting People complain because it clearly isn't news worthy. Tyler dropping out in the first round doesn't really affect the tournament. Tyler isn't winning championships and didn't forfeit in the finals. People will say its just TL "hyping another one of their players who doesn't get results" etc. 2. We don't make a thread about Tyler forfeiting People react like they are in this thread Tyler forfeiting doesn't fit in this thread, and isn't even close to the level of notability / newsworthiness that this situation with Stephano is. It seems a bit unfair and far too easy to just point and yell bias all the time. I still don't understand whether people actually believe there should be a thread about Tyler's forfeit or whether they just like finding things to complain about.
There is a poll to help you out. We're SC2 fans, we love information regarding SC2 players... that's kinda the point, frivolous as it seems :D If people aren't interested, then the thread just will fade away.... but if they are, it will be a forum of discussion.
If you check the LR report thread for the ONOG tournement you will see several people asked about Tyler before Stephano withdrew.
You wouldn't need to even make a thread, just offer an explanation in the LR thread.
The point is that TL is making a judgement on interest, but really you're protecting Tyler while at the same time facilitating the crushing of Stephano.
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On January 31 2012 06:41 Ym!r wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 06:36 nam nam wrote:On January 31 2012 06:35 FaRess wrote:On January 31 2012 06:28 mindspike wrote:
Tyler forfeiting is not entirely the same. Yes it was bad form but if Stephano had forfeited at the beginning of the tournament like Tyler had, it wouldn't have been as big of a deal. Poll: Do you want to see the same thread about tyler forfeiting his matches?Yes (121) 71% No (33) 19% Neither should exist ! (16) 9% 170 total votes Your vote: Do you want to see the same thread about tyler forfeiting his matches? (Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
(Vote): Neither should exist !
Does Tyler still plays SC2 ? I thought he forfeited his SC2 career long ago, should try commentating SC2 if he's too lazy to play it/train, but when you cast it's hard to forfeit too 
Tyler, idra, polt, Naniwa, Dimaga, Choya, Lalush, Satinii, Cloud,......
Everybody, or nobody.
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On January 31 2012 06:35 magnaflow wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 06:33 rabidbot wrote:
Tyler wasn't deep in the bracket, and he hadn't personally held up an entire tourney to play in that tourney, then quit before it was over. So I'm not sure we need a thread on why he quit. Which you could say was even worse. Stephano actually played, Tyler quit after losing 1 match. I really want to know why Tyler dropped.
How can you honestly say that is worse? You don't accept an invite from a tournament, make it all the way to the final, then hold the finals hostage with an ultimatum and log off on them. There is seriously not even close to a comparison, if you're going to forfeit at least do it at a respectable time which won't damage the tournament. (which by the way, went out of their way for several months to raise this money, and invite you!)
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On January 31 2012 06:39 Nouar wrote:
Do you see Stephano complaining about the decision somewhere ? No. End of the problem. We can stop talking about it.
What? You realize that along with the tournament hosts and Stephano being involved, everyone else has a reaction to Stephano's behavior, right? And talking about the way Stephano presented and organized himself in this situation is completely justified, because it wasn't appropriate. He screwed over a tournament.
Just because one person isn't complaining doesn't mean the discussion is over for everyone else.
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4713 Posts
Some people really don't understand the principle of this problem.
Just because a player is very, very good doesn't entitle him to do stuff like this, that is why we have rules in place.
If players could just up and forfeit a tournament because, "I'm too good/the best", then it would be total anarchy. Rules need to be in place and they need to be enforced.
If you don't agree with the format of a tournament or the schedule, then don't participate, that simple, but don't participate, and than at the very end, the final, spit in the face of the fans, the organizers, the other players, by doing this. That just shows an incredible lack of ethic and respect.
No one should be above the law/rules, no matter the size of the tournament, how do we expect to grow this industry if we put the players above the rules?
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He made a good decision for his personal health. In the end, he'll play another day. He earned 2nd place though.
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On January 31 2012 06:35 FaRess wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 06:28 mindspike wrote:
Tyler forfeiting is not entirely the same. Yes it was bad form but if Stephano had forfeited at the beginning of the tournament like Tyler had, it wouldn't have been as big of a deal. Poll: Do you want to see the same thread about tyler forfeiting his matches?Yes (121) 71% No (33) 19% Neither should exist ! (16) 9% 170 total votes Your vote: Do you want to see the same thread about tyler forfeiting his matches? (Vote): Yes
(Vote): No
(Vote): Neither should exist !
people disagree with you, at the end of the day, I'm completely fine with ONOG decision that was the right choice, it's just the hypocrisy that is being displayed here that is mind blowing
Hypocrisy wtf are you talking about?
TL is a news/community site that happens to own a team and they post a NEWS STORY about the situation with Stephano because it's blowing up on Reddit and in the LR thread.
This isn't even breaking a news story, this is a compilation of information already out there.
You see any opinion from TL staff on there?
Stop white knighting, nobody cares what you think is hypocrisy.
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On January 31 2012 06:35 s4life wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 06:31 halvorg wrote:
I don't see the problem, Stephano forfeited the finals of a mediocre online tournament when they refused to postpone it. Being upset that Stephano refuses to play when beat up and tired at a very unreasonable time for any person to compete in anything is strange to me.
Oh well, I guess ONOG can ban the best foreign player if they want to. I wish other tournaments would ban him too, this is such a lack of respect for fans and organizers he should be made an example of it imho. Integrity and professionalism should count for something, even in such a young sports discipline as e-sports.
Stephano plays in a lot of tournaments mate, he has forfeited 3-4 times that I'm aware of. Usually because of scheduling conflicts.
Professionalism and integrity is not to accept subpar playing conditions, stop overreacting.
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Braavos36402 Posts
I don't understand how people can say its hypocrisy that there is no thread about Tyler when if it was anyone else who forfeits first round (literally anyone, doesn't have to be Liquid) we wouldn't make a thread about it.
To summarize:
1. Anyone forfeiting first round, no thread, not newsworthy
2. One of the best foreigners forfeiting invitational right before finals, yes thread
#1 doesn't matter if it's Liquid, there wouldn't be a thread about Destiny or Flo or Incontrol or anyone else forfeiting first round, this should be obvious to anyone. There is no special treatment for Tyler.
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On January 31 2012 06:43 Slardar wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 06:35 magnaflow wrote:On January 31 2012 06:33 rabidbot wrote:
Tyler wasn't deep in the bracket, and he hadn't personally held up an entire tourney to play in that tourney, then quit before it was over. So I'm not sure we need a thread on why he quit. Which you could say was even worse. Stephano actually played, Tyler quit after losing 1 match. I really want to know why Tyler dropped. How can you honestly say that is worse? You don't accept an invite from a tournament, make it all the way to the final, then hold the finals hostage with an ultimatum and log off on them. There is seriously not even close to a comparison, if you're going to forfeit at least do it at a respectable time which won't damage the tournament. (which by the way, went out of their way for several months to raise this money, and invite you!)
You don't accept a tournament invite. play 1 game and then decide you no longer want to play. Regardless of posisitioning in the tournament it's the same exact thing.
Since when was forefeiting respectable at all? Were these players not voted in by the fans? Tyler is disrespecting everybody just as much as Stephano did.
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It's clear that a lot of these progamers are pretty young, and thus immature. That isn't even to really say what Stephano did was horrible, but a more experience player would be away of what they can and can't do in a day, and make a decision based on that. Kas was in the SCAN invitational as well, and while he didn't have to play quite as many games, he still played in both tournaments without complaint.
Players need to become more professional for their own sake. Failing that, their team management needs to step up and actually manage their players.
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Professionalism: (n) a state in which someone should do what ever I want them to do for pretty much no reason.
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EPT
