EPTterran cant beat toss?
emp too weak?
and zerg cant beat a toss player from FFE?
Questions from the Community - David Kim - Page 8
| Forum Index > SC2 General |
|
ThatGuy89
United Kingdom1968 Posts
terran cant beat toss? emp too weak? and zerg cant beat a toss player from FFE? | ||
|
flowSthead
1065 Posts
On January 26 2012 04:53 The Final Boss wrote: Ghosts take 40 seconds to build. High Templar take 5. Ghosts can only build from a Barracks that has a Tech Lab attached to it. High Templar can build anywhere within a pylon radius. EMP does a good job against HT tech--if you micro better than the Protoss--while Ghosts are much less useful against builds in which the Protoss gets Colossi sooner. If a Terran tries to get Ghosts, and the Protoss gets Colossi, timing attacks off of two bases can be devastating because there's almost no way that the Terran can have Vikings to deal with Colossi and upgrades to deal with the massive army. High Templar, on the other hand, do very well against everything in the Terran arsenal. Against Ghosts, you have to micro better, but Ghosts are not a "hard counter" to HTs; it all comes down to who controls better (unless Protoss makes a mistake, in which case that's their fault). Not only do Storm and Archon deal well with any sort of bio push, but Feedback devastates all Terran tech. Thors, Banshees, Ravens, Battlecruisers, Medivacs. All of them get demolished by Feedback in the same way that Snipe can demolish Zerg tech late game; the difference: Feedback is a one click wonder that takes next to nothing to do. EMP targets ground, meaning that in an HT vs Ghost 1v1 fight, while the EMP can hit first, for all intents and purposes the Terran has to control far better and control well. The Protoss just has to click to Feedback the Ghost, then it flies to the Ghost and the second it's in range, the Ghost dies. Plus, if the HT has 150+ energy, then the Feedback is near impossible to stop, even if it does not do the killing blow to the Ghost. Try putting your High Templar in a Warp Prism; it's not the hardest micro, it's not like controlling a big Chargelot/Colossi ball is that difficult, and frankly it almost guarantees that you will get off some storms. Good storms in conjunction with Chargelots will beat Terran. Sure, it all depends on micro, but the comparison is still ridiculous. Feedback is single use while emp can work on every single one of your High Templar. Snipe against Zerg is better than Feedback against Terran. As a Zerg, you cannot stop Ghosts from sniping you without killing them. There is literally no way to stop them from sniping you unless you kill them. If you lose all of the energy on your Thors/Banshees/Battlescruisers, then Feedback does nothing (obviously Medivacs and Ravens need energy to do anything so Feedback is a good counter to those, but it also means you are microing your Raven poorly if it keeps on getting Feedbacked). See if more Terrans would say EMP their Thors and Battlecruisers, maybe Feedback wouldn't be so powerful against late game Terran tech. Look at that. I just solved your Feedback problem for half of your race. Try doing the same for Zerg and snipe. On January 26 2012 05:14 The Final Boss wrote: Taeja is one of the top Terran players in the world and he has claimed that he thinks Protoss is the strongest race. Just sayin'... ^^ This is a ridiculous argument. Many players can have many different opinions, but their expertise does not make their opinions true. The fact that Terrans have won the last 3 GSLs and the Blizzard Cup which consisted of 2 TvTs and 2 TvZs should point to the idea that no, Protoss is not the strongest race. Either that or Protoss players suck, but in either case the other races shouldn't have a problem with this. | ||
|
SgtCoDFish
United Kingdom1520 Posts
My personal thoughts on this: I think the zerg ffe question was weird, but I'm interested in the others and satisfied by the answers. Slow and steady is good :D | ||
|
Lizarb
Denmark307 Posts
On January 26 2012 02:59 Dingodile wrote: "Ghost EMP is Too Weak" Cant believe that this is true, especially at tvp. I saw in every tournament terran always snacked protoss if they used emp very well. He is not saying its true. All the headlines, like Ghost EMP is Too Weak, are statements/feelings that the community has expressed in one way or another. So don't worry, I don't think they will buff EMP. Think so even less when I read his answer. | ||
|
SeriouR
Spain622 Posts
| ||
|
deth2munkies
United States4051 Posts
| ||
|
Bippzy
United States1466 Posts
On January 26 2012 03:05 Treehead wrote: The top level of play in SC2 is certainly a testament to how quickly the human mind can learn to think and adapt in new and abstract environments - which I've always thought is inspiring. Then, I see comments like these: •Protoss Win Rate is Too Low in Tournaments •Terran Can’t Beat Protoss •Forge Fast Expand is Difficult to Stop as Zerg The fact that these three are all "hot topics" - and mutually exclusive - is a testament to just how idiotic the human mind can be in large groups. I suppose you take the good with the bad, eh? This is kinda like politics. While the topics may make gold leaguers feel happy everyone else has to read into it. Protoss win rate too low in tournies-legit Terran cant beat protoss AT LOWER LEVELS Forge fast expand isnt dynamic but doesnt cause balance probs either | ||
|
Roxy
Canada753 Posts
| ||
|
Demonhunter04
1530 Posts
On January 26 2012 03:01 blade55555 wrote: That's how I feel on players saying protoss is to weak. Honestly game balance wise I think the games pretty good. Was an interesting read but not really much was addressed. Sounds like they are probably just going to wait for HOTS for any major changes again. They are "weakest" at lower levels because lower level players can't play terran that great. Its not a balance problem its a skill problem. You could say the same thing about Terran in Brood War, can't you? Since it is the most mechanically challenging race in BW, most players just play Protoss or Zerg, and Terrans of a certain rank are likely better than P/Zs of the same rank. | ||
|
Yorbon
Netherlands4272 Posts
I am not quite the superb player, but i feel most of the matches i watch of gsl etc are actually quite balanced. I only see some terrans play a lot better then the rest in terms of control and macro, which should be quite decisive factors in my opinion. | ||
|
Al Bundy
7257 Posts
On the other hand, protoss matchup win percentages are actually very solid in major tournaments. So while protoss tournament players aren’t winning as many tournaments, their match to match win percentages in the same tournaments look very solid. That reminds me of Naniwa at MLG. iirc he crushed faces left and right, including Nestea, but unfortunately didn't get the gold. | ||
|
Osmoses
Sweden5302 Posts
| ||
|
1st_Panzer_Div.
United States621 Posts
Also it was really cool the idea of battle hellions coming out in that form instead of regular form, a very interesting insight on how they try to balance the game down without affecting high level balance. | ||
|
RogerChillingworth
Chad3132 Posts
On January 26 2012 05:10 Condor Hero wrote: Fine then make Protoss units cost 50% of what they cost now and nobody needs to splash. Who doesn't want to face P in GSL? You clearly didn't watch the Code S Ro16 group nominations. No one wants to face toss right now. | ||
|
Gladiator6
Sweden7024 Posts
| ||
|
Grampz
United States2147 Posts
| ||
|
Cereb
Denmark3388 Posts
Other than that I really admire their work! Blizzard has done an incredibly job. I can't believe lower level players are actually complaining about game balance and talking like the lower level imbalance is gonna be the end of the game. You realise that this game is pretty darn well balanced at all levels, right? When we talk about imbalance it's litterally because there might be slightly more than a measly 5% difference in one mu. The difference is those 5 % can mean the difference between winning 5 000 $ or winning 50 000 $ from a tournament at pro level, whereas for the rest of us it's the difference between being number 20 or number 15 in your randomly assigned division. edit: On January 26 2012 05:38 Osmoses wrote: The thing I want most, that I know will never happen, are actual drastic changes to protoss. Terran are interesting, Zerg are interesting, but protoss just have so many design issues. Cut the colos, make warpgates an agressive choice rather than an obvious first upgrade and chuck the forcefields, then you can actually balance the race instead of relying on what are basically cheap fixes. Words of wisdom!!! There is a reason why zvt is by far the most popular mu! | ||
|
hunts
United States2113 Posts
On January 26 2012 05:48 eYeball wrote: Interesting, however he didn't say anything about the mothership. If they remove it PvZ lategame will be completely different than it is now, maybe for the the greater or maybe not. I guess time will tell us what Blizzards intentions are with the mothership. I don't see how it wouldn't be for the better, without a gimmick that causes a maxed BL/corruptor/infestor army to die in a matter of 1-2 seconds to an inferior army. | ||
|
flowSthead
1065 Posts
On January 26 2012 05:45 RogerChillingworth wrote: You clearly didn't watch the Code S Ro16 group nominations. No one wants to face toss right now. Again, this isn't a good argument. It is very possible that playing against Protoss just causes players to have a lot of anxiety rather than meaning that Protoss is better. Playing against Protoss is more stressful than the idea that they cannot be beaten. A good example of this is Nestea saying he hates playing Protoss but he manages to beat them anyways. Or DRG losing to Genius but beating JYP despite JYP supposedly having one of the PvZs and despite Genius admitting in the Ro16 that he loses to DRG most of the time during practice games. | ||
|
Gheed
United States972 Posts
On January 26 2012 02:47 SgtCoDFish wrote:
What hells the b.net forums must be. | ||
| ||
hmmm Terran cant beat protoss lololol
