EPTBasically, mental skills are very much like physical skills, and if you don't practice them and KEEP practicing them regularly then they will decline. That doesn't mean you are actually dumber or slower or anything, it just means that you need to train your mind in those areas to get back to where you used to be. The problem for many gamers is that not everyone has time to do that, however playing StarCraft is definitely a good exercise for your brain =)
Gaming as an adult: Are you too slow? - Page 5
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ApBuLLet
United States604 Posts
Basically, mental skills are very much like physical skills, and if you don't practice them and KEEP practicing them regularly then they will decline. That doesn't mean you are actually dumber or slower or anything, it just means that you need to train your mind in those areas to get back to where you used to be. The problem for many gamers is that not everyone has time to do that, however playing StarCraft is definitely a good exercise for your brain =) | ||
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Black Gun
Germany4482 Posts
specifically, I believe that most forms of cognitive ability are trained by being in school/college. therefore, it seems very natural to me that most people start to lose certain cognitive abilities once they are out of school/college for some years and spend their time in jobs which usually only offer intellectual stimulation on a very narrow field of cognitive tasks. therefore, it appears, at least to me, that the observed begin of mental decline around the late 20ies/early 30ies is no coincidence and also no biological necessity. I have no clue though whether this distinction bears any relevance for the question if the typical decline of gaming skills is the result of external factors like growing up, increasing responsibilities or of aging in the biological sense. | ||
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Silentness
United States2821 Posts
I'm married, I work full time, I try to go to school on the side, pay bills and etc. I don't have all day to play Starcraft 2 and be grandmaster. I really don't think my age is stopping me from being faster. It's my lifestyle that's stopping me from being faster and a better player. This is the main reason why I play random in Starcraft 2. I really don't care to aspire to be pro or anything at one race. I just play casually for fun and hope to win some great long macro games. Not cheese my way to master's like the "stereotypical" random player. | ||
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wishbones
Canada2600 Posts
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ArcticFox
United States1092 Posts
Mentally I'm as sharp at 30 as I was at 20 -- only tempered with more wisdom behind it, and the ability to apply this knowledge to more areas of life than just whether I have enough marines to kill those lurkers or how quickly I can get that buffalo killed so I can shave 2 minutes off my Castle Age time. Mechanically my handspeed is slower, but not because I'm older -- just because I'm not as well-practiced at it as I was back in the olden days. College + Job + all the other adult stuff that comes with making a life for yourself takes time away from keeping up your handspeed in games you haen't played in years. Of course it is improving -- over the past year I've gone from a 60-70 APM SC2 player to a 180-200, simply by playing more -- not necessarily trying to play faster. The higher level I get, the more stuff I *want* to do. When you develop from a player who doesn't even remember to queue their production buildings while they're attacking, to a player who is macroing, building an expansion, and managing 2 drops and a nuke while doing an attack on the front at the same time, the hand speed has to naturally follow. I'm sure a time will come when all this will decline -- but it's not 30, and it for sure isn't 25. | ||
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FallDownMarigold
United States3710 Posts
On January 03 2012 12:13 wishbones wrote: i would post, but it wont be pretty, so ill just put out a few words. its not real. no age limit resi blah blah blah bs. all bs. What's not real? Cognitive decline? Nope -- it's real. What you probably meant was that you think cognitive decline is not the main reason for a decrease in gaming performance after the teens-twenties. I'd agree with that 100%! On January 03 2012 12:15 ArcticFox wrote: I'm sure a time will come when all this will decline -- but it's not 30, and it for sure isn't 25. Yep -- the decline typically begins during the late 20s/30s, but I would imagine it wouldn't be bad enough for quite a while, and wouldn't have a meaningful impact on things like cognition and motor deftness with respect to SC2 performance for a looong time. | ||
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LimeNade
United States2125 Posts
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PhiliBiRD
United States2643 Posts
realistically tho, i dont see why pros retire in late 20s. that just seems kind of silly. especially n ow since SC2 is alot easier than BW, we know the same amount of APM is not required. with practice and consistent effort, i dont see any reason why this should be an issue until your mid-late 30s or 40s even. if randy couture fought till his mid 40's i think someone can play SC2 till the same age. | ||
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LimeNade
United States2125 Posts
On January 03 2012 12:25 PhiliBiRD wrote: 22 so i cant say i have the issue. realistically tho, i dont see why pros retire in late 20s. that just seems kind of silly. especially n ow since SC2 is alot easier than BW, we know the same amount of APM is not required. with practice and consistent effort, i dont see any reason why this should be an issue until your mid-late 30s or 40s even. if randy couture fought till his mid 40's i think someone can play SC2 till the same age. well i think like overall playing field has been made easier in the sense you get this much larger bunch of good to really good players since most can do really well with 80-100 apm. But to be a pro and the top you still need a pretty high apm and im not talking like pro as in you are on a pro team im talking about a force to be reckon with :D | ||
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BuddhaMonk
781 Posts
Pro gamers in esports retire at a comparatively young age for reasons other than brain decline. Or conversely, the reason most top pro gamers are very young is not because their brains are any better, it's because they have the free time to devote to a profession which by almost all standards does not pay very much. When you're an adult, you have responsibilities and you cannot devote 60-80 hours a week playing one video game. | ||
lichter
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
But my hands are just shit now, due to gaming (wrist) and sports (fingers/hands). I am pretty sure that it's the physical toll that practicing 8 hrs a day deals one's hands that really shortens the careers of progamers. Heck I play maybe 2.5 hrs a day tops and my wrist already feels tight. | ||
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Luepert
United States1933 Posts
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ThaZenith
Canada3116 Posts
Saying this expecting to hit 70 and, barring some sort of brain disease or something, but just as quick-thinking as ever. (though my hands will obviously be old and slow lol) | ||
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JoeAWESOME
Sweden1080 Posts
I'm 20 (21 in a day) and I'm feeling at the prime of my video game "career". Both in speed and intellect | ||
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Ubenn
Canada114 Posts
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groms
Canada1017 Posts
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LegendaryZ
United States1583 Posts
On January 03 2012 12:25 PhiliBiRD wrote: i dont see why pros retire in late 20s. that just seems kind of silly. especially n ow since SC2 is alot easier than BW, we know the same amount of APM is not required. with practice and consistent effort, i dont see any reason why this should be an issue until your mid-late 30s or 40s even. if randy couture fought till his mid 40's i think someone can play SC2 till the same age. I'd imagine that it probably has more to do with the fact that after a certain age you start worrying about issues like making money and having some sort of stability in your life. Professional gaming is a ridiculously volatile pursuit and it doesn't get any less competitive as time goes on. And living in a cramped apartment with a bunch of kids and receiving your salary in the form of ramen noodles probably gets old after a while. | ||
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trias_e
United States520 Posts
Reaction time does also decrease with age, and this is important in any fast-paced game. It can be overcome with greater decision making abilities and experience, but again if you pit two people with the same amount of skill and experience against each other (in a game where reaction time matters), I'll bet on the 20 year old over the 30 year old. | ||
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FuRRyChoBo
United States218 Posts
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Sablar
Sweden880 Posts
On January 03 2012 10:44 FallDownMarigold wrote: That's not at all what the topic says. Heh, I'm not sure how many more times I need to snake it into the OP that cognitive decline is different among people, and that some people show no cognitive decline for a long long time. Maybe the 70 year old dude in your video hasn't experienced cognitive decline? That's great for him, but it doesn't mean the topic is "a hoax", whatever you meant by that. If you think the data in the topic drawn from various sources (Nature, etc) is bullshit, that's okay I guess. Nowhere in there do I suggest age as the scapegoat for loss of ability. Am I not arguing the opposite -- that although cognitive decline is real, it probably doesn't impact SC2 success? I have to point out that Musketer while somewhat hostile was very right about the whole causation thing. Cognitive decline is "different among people" but it is also not some sort of disease that you start to get at a certain age and most of all you can't say that aging CAUSES cognitive decline. The graphs don't show that at all, but from your posts you appear to see it as inevitable (at 30, 40 or even 80...). Not how it works. While it is true that the body will deteriorate with age you cannot say that the results shown in the graphs are because of biological aging. Also it's very strange to assume that there would be some sort of onset and that it isn't an ongoing process. So basically I am against your concept of a biological "cognitive decline" as something "real" that you have shown with your graphs (0 data or sources), because you haven't. Otherwise I think we are close in our opinion because I do think there is an ongoing deterioration because of normal aging but that the effects of this is likely very small until very old age. So until then lifestyle choices and environmental factors differentiating between generations will surely have a much greater effect on cognitive decline than any biological process. Of course this is also a hypothesis based on theory and the observed difference between populations. Regarding the piano, as long as you keep playing why would it deteriorate. It's when you stop doing something that the problems are likely to start. With something like the piano that is about movement I guess the skill should stay pretty intact anyway. But instruments are not like computer games because skills from one game doesn't necessarily generalize to other games. Either way I think anyone can get good at SC2 but like pointed out mostly younger players have the possibility to even try to go pro. | ||
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