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I played some games today and noticed that 2 rax is incredibly broken on Entombed Valley. Here are some bunker placements I discovered:
1
Ignore the bunker at the ramp as it's not really the important part.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/0x8Nk.png)
Now you can optionally start the bunker at the top left and trap a marine inside first, or you can just make the two bunkers next to the rocks and have a marine behind them. I'm not really sure that the first bunker is necessary, but either way the two at the rock are insanely good. Note: these form a full wall.
Creep really doesn't spread to the ramp fast enough, so it's possible to hop bunkers into range of the hatchery with the bunker at the ramp or near there. One advantage to this positioning is that spine crawlers really cant deal with it effectively compared to bunkering the bottom of the ramp, as the creep isn't close enough.
2
This second placement is possibly even better
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/1w3uC.jpg)
Here you can tuck many marines in the pocket and hop a bunker immediately in range of the hatchery. This placement makes reinforcement incredibly easy and it's very hard to engage these bunkers without multiple spine crawlers. Conveniently this placement also makes it fairly difficult for a zerg to cut off reinforcements.
3
This placement is not particularly great, as it is not in range of the hatchery and is fairly far from reinforcements and the main ramp, but it's possible to bunker hop or just micro back and forth from the bunkers. The main problem is that these bunkers are very likely to finish and possibly even get up without a zerg seeing them if the overlord is spotting for other positions.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Wafzc.jpg)
Note: these bunkers form a full wall.
4
This placement is superior to the previous one, although it's possible that creep will already be there unless it is an 11/11 rax or the zerg did not hatch first. These bunkers form a tight wall making it hard to stop both of them with drones and they are in range of both the hatchery and the ramp. Reinforcement distance is not very far.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/B9JBA.jpg)
One of the biggest problems I see here is that there are simply so many good bunker placements that a single overlord will not spot all of them, nor will a drone patrolling deal with them all. There's also obviously the usual double bunker at the bottom of the ramp that works like any other ladder map. Between these glaring problems, the close horizontal positions for tank pushes, the choke below the natural for tank pushes, and the ease of Terran or Protoss expanding, I think all zerg players should seriously consider vetoing this map immediately. These bunker placements are also potentially useful in TvP, so they're worth learning for any Terran player.
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Would be awesome to see the TL maps in the ladder soon
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I'm really not enjoying the new maps.
Arid plateau just feels awkward to play on, and Entombed's third + rocks are a real bitch for zergs.
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The rocks are the real problem, I think they make ZvT especially in close positions so hard, Siege tanks can be placed behind the rocks at the would be third and they can push up your ramp and you can do nothing about it, however I have had some success making 4-6 extra lings early on to break down the third rocks to stop tank pushes and also take the expansion safely.
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please why would u post this delete asap!! 
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I played some 1v1 vs AI on the new maps and I did not like them at all, saw the 2 rax bunker placement that terran could do so I just vetoed them.
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Yay terran. But really this has already happened to me and its just annoying to play against. I agree put the TL maps in...
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i already have them both on veto.
i guess ill have to play shattered and meta again -_-
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I wish they woulda got rid of the season 1 maps.. they are quite boring to play on now
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Canada13427 Posts
I think we need to remember that island expo in the middle of the map surrounded by 2 strong destructible rocks. Terran gets a free non ground harrassable third
Also, when the rocks do go down the upper part of the ramp is within range of a planetary fortress making attacking the third difficult for almost any race.
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The PvT immortal bust on Arid Plateu is ridiculously hard to survive as there's two narrow entrances to your natural which is easily in forcefield's favour when busting. To surround the natural with bunkers when spotting this is just stupid and too economic damaging for T (lets say 6 bunkers, 3 of them is in use as there's two entrances.). The only option i can see is to lift up and be FF contained when P is macroing happily at home...
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Mid masters Zerg and I'm in love with Entombed Valley...some bunker and cannon placements are a bit awkward to deal with but overall the landscape and amount of open space is amazing, first blizzard map I won't be veto-ing 
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Arid plateau is terrible for Zerg, insane gap between main and nat and easy run by the hellions etc, just a stupid map
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I bet any map is broken when you have to make 4 bunkers.... lmao
Shakuras only needs 3!
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On December 22 2011 08:38 Eraserhead wrote:
I bet any map is broken when you have to make 4 bunkers.... lmao
Shakuras only needs 3!
You only really have to make the two next to the rocks and the game is basically over. The rest are just examples of things that are possible and potentially useful. If you don't want to use them, that's your business, but they certainly are powerful.
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don't like the new maps.
entombed valley is almost like the stupid lava map that got removed really fast and arid plateau feels like beta again.
these maps are nowhere near to be crisp, not in looks and not in gameplay.
the last two maps that got removed were better in both aspects imo, and i really want maps like calm before the storm or xel naga fortress, dual sight, testbug...
come on blizzard, show some balls and integrate some cool non blizzard maps.
i don't get the big deal that it seems to be.
.
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I can't figure out how Zerg is supposed to live on Arid Plateau (and I'm posting this as a Protoss player!). I haven't lost a PvZ here yet doing the most derp strategy (after sentry expand, it's not even all in!). Exhibit:
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/aR9eB.png)
~10 minute attack with +1 sentry stalker and scouting observer. Forcefields make it a total clusterf--- for the Zerg and almost impossible. A few people have put down spine crawlers there, but the bushes make the crawler useless without an overlord...which the stalkers can just snipe. Ordinarily a standard amount of roach ling with crawlers would crush this attack, but the positioning is so laughable.
Am I missing something? Is Zerg's only option to all in counter attack (which is pretty easy to defend with wall + cannon)?
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yeah they leep failing on their maps, just put the GSL ones and every1 would be happy. from bronze to gm
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On December 22 2011 08:56 Sentient wrote:I can't figure out how Zerg is supposed to live on Arid Plateau (and I'm posting this as a Protoss player!). I haven't lost a PvZ here yet doing the most derp strategy. Exhibit: ~10 minute attack with +1 sentry stalker and scouting observer. Forcefields make it a total clusterf--- for the Zerg and almost impossible. A few people have put down spine crawlers there, but the bushes make the crawler useless without an overlord...which the stalkers can just snipe. Ordinarily a standard amount of roach ling with crawlers would crush this attack, but the positioning is so laughable. Am I missing something? Is Zerg's only option to all in counter attack (which is pretty easy to defend with wall + cannon)?
yep too bad that map has some nice ovie placements but the natural is just retarded...
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On December 22 2011 08:56 Sentient wrote:I can't figure out how Zerg is supposed to live on Arid Plateau (and I'm posting this as a Protoss player!). I haven't lost a PvZ here yet doing the most derp strategy (after sentry expand, it's not even all in!). Exhibit: ~10 minute attack with +1 sentry stalker and scouting observer. Forcefields make it a total clusterf--- for the Zerg and almost impossible. A few people have put down spine crawlers there, but the bushes make the crawler useless without an overlord...which the stalkers can just snipe. Ordinarily a standard amount of roach ling with crawlers would crush this attack, but the positioning is so laughable. Am I missing something? Is Zerg's only option to all in counter attack (which is pretty easy to defend with wall + cannon)?
I just put a lot of spine crawlers there and got a good flank when a protoss came at me.he forcefielded my roaches in a box but just ate the spine crawler fire.
It totally sucks. I open speedling on the map just so you can't proxy me and then hope for the best.
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EPT
