• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 21:51
CEST 03:51
KST 10:51
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins EWC 202512Tournament Spotlight: FEL Cracow 20259Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202580RSL Season 1 - Final Week9[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15
Community News
[BSL 2025] H2 - Team Wars, Weeklies & SB Ladder2EWC 2025 - Replay Pack2Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced26BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams10Weekly Cups (July 14-20): Final Check-up0
StarCraft 2
General
Serral wins EWC 2025 #1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time Greatest Players of All Time: 2025 Update Power Rank - Esports World Cup 2025 EWC 2025 - Replay Pack
Tourneys
FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $10,000 live event TaeJa vs Creator Bo7 SC Evo Showmatch Esports World Cup 2025 $25,000 Streamerzone StarCraft Pro Series announced $5,000 WardiTV Summer Championship 2025
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 484 Magnetic Pull Mutation #239 Bad Weather Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars Mutation # 482 Wheel of Misfortune
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion [BSL 2025] H2 - Team Wars, Weeklies & SB Ladder BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Afreeca app available on Samsung smart TV Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China CSL Xiamen International Invitational [CSLPRO] It's CSLAN Season! - Last Chance
Strategy
Does 1 second matter in StarCraft? Simple Questions, Simple Answers [G] Mineral Boosting
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Total Annihilation Server - TAForever [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok) Path of Exile
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
UK Politics Mega-thread US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Stop Killing Games - European Citizens Initiative Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Gtx660 graphics card replacement Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Ping To Win? Pings And Their…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Socialism Anyone?
GreenHorizons
Eight Anniversary as a TL…
Mizenhauer
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 533 users

Season 5 Map Pool Changes Announced - Page 37

Forum Index > SC2 General
876 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 35 36 37 38 39 44 Next All
Condor Hero
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States2931 Posts
December 20 2011 18:32 GMT
#721
On December 21 2011 03:02 ArtisaBang wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 21 2011 02:55 Condor Hero wrote:
On December 21 2011 00:30 ArtisaBang wrote:
just checked maps!

forge expand for protoss on both maps:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]
[image loading]


i think Entombed Valley is definitely Terran map,siege positions good as Altarim.
Entombed Valley:
PvT > T favored with siege tank timings and positioning.
PvZ > i think zerg favored because its pretty easy to taking 3rd.
TvZ > terran favored imo!

Arid Plateu
hmm...i think this map is not good for zerg playes pretty okey for terran and protoss.

jesus look how much shit you have to put up just to keep yourself covered vs mild pressure.
that kinda negates the point of forge expand if you have to dump 400+ more minerals just to keep safe.

then you should make 1 gate expand,its blizzard's fault,not mine...

didnt say it was your fault, im saying its a shitty map for pvz.
Canadaehz
Profile Joined April 2011
Canada59 Posts
December 20 2011 18:34 GMT
#722
Has amyone ever come to the realization That Blizzard employees make these maps for a living? If you consider that you should come to the realization that the maps are so bad it is ridiculous. It is stupid how people who have a job or go to school and make maps as a hobby make better maps than people who do it for a living.

For example look at the tileset differences comparing Arid and lets say Ohana (the map that one the TLMC) you probably will say that Ohana looks 100x better. In fact you could probably say that about almost all the maps in the TLMC and almost every good non-blizzard made map. It is apalling to know we have to play on bland, boring disgusting tile sets with no features and no creative design.

Don't even get me started on map design...
I only pose one question. Do you prefer GSL maps (Daybreak, Calm before the Storm, Taldarim Altar etc) or Blizzard maps?
Don't get me wrong, Metalopolis, Antiga Shipyard and Shakuras Plateau are great maps but these new maps they implementing are half-ass pieces of garbage. I think the general consensus is GSL has the best map pool when it comes exciting macro games. If you haven't watched a lot of GSL games please don't comment.

Anyways my map pool would be Daybreak, Calm before the Storm, Taldarim Altar, Metalopolis, ESV Cloud Kingdom, WCG Antiga Shipyard (much improved tile set), Bel'Shir Beach and either Shakuras Plateau or another ESV map.

Disclaimer: This was written on my iPhone so excuse any typos.
FeyFey
Profile Joined September 2010
Germany10114 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-20 18:47:32
December 20 2011 18:44 GMT
#723
On December 21 2011 03:14 L3g3nd_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 21 2011 02:48 AimlessAmoeba wrote:
On December 21 2011 02:42 L3g3nd_ wrote:
Man, i thought Season 4 maps were bad, Season 5 brings on a whole new meaning of bad.


At least they're slowly, slowwwwwwly perfecting a good map pool. We're a long way away from the garbage of season 2 and 3 ^_^.

But yeah, I feel like the new blizz maps every season are thrown together in a week. They're so uninspired, and so boring - they should really hire some of the TL contest guys or start outsourcing to GSL.

it makes me wonder who is actually doing the map pool.... we still have TDA and XNC in the map pool.... Blizzard has a history of taking sc2 maps out of the map pool because they are awful, and a history of putting GSL maps into the map pool, and a history of making bad maps, yet they put their maps in, leave in imbalanced/bad maps, and dont add GSL maps. I really would like to see some justification of their map pool. XNC is one of the most imbalanced maps for ZvT, yet its been in there forever, I guess they could argue that thats what vetos are for, but imo vetos should be for maps you dont like, not for vetoing imbalanced maps


because when it was out every zerg loved xel naga, thats why it was in every tournament for so long. And i think the Blizzard maps are well thought out. As so much stuff that is done on Blizzard maps is picked up by map makers, and the new maps actually do what they are supposed to do and shift out imbalances. (mutas and drop on macro maps for example, yay antiga, that made up the new first bases layout of every new map now)
The restriction for the ladder maps are though that they have to be different from each other. maps that focus on macro or rushing or something in between. So its natural people will hate 3 maps at least and say the map pool is bad. I always enjoy seeing new maps that add some nice ideas and if they are good often make it into tournament maps.
Zeroxk
Profile Joined October 2010
Norway1244 Posts
December 20 2011 18:51 GMT
#724
On December 21 2011 03:34 Canadaehz wrote:
Has amyone ever come to the realization That Blizzard employees make these maps for a living? If you consider that you should come to the realization that the maps are so bad it is ridiculous. It is stupid how people who have a job or go to school and make maps as a hobby make better maps than people who do it for a living.

For example look at the tileset differences comparing Arid and lets say Ohana (the map that one the TLMC) you probably will say that Ohana looks 100x better. In fact you could probably say that about almost all the maps in the TLMC and almost every good non-blizzard made map. It is apalling to know we have to play on bland, boring disgusting tile sets with no features and no creative design.

Don't even get me started on map design...
I only pose one question. Do you prefer GSL maps (Daybreak, Calm before the Storm, Taldarim Altar etc) or Blizzard maps?
Don't get me wrong, Metalopolis, Antiga Shipyard and Shakuras Plateau are great maps but these new maps they implementing are half-ass pieces of garbage. I think the general consensus is GSL has the best map pool when it comes exciting macro games. If you haven't watched a lot of GSL games please don't comment.

Anyways my map pool would be Daybreak, Calm before the Storm, Taldarim Altar, Metalopolis, ESV Cloud Kingdom, WCG Antiga Shipyard (much improved tile set), Bel'Shir Beach and either Shakuras Plateau or another ESV map.

Disclaimer: This was written on my iPhone so excuse any typos.


You speak as if GSL is exempt from bad maps, Crossfire, Bel'shir and Dual Sight are all villains now. And whining about tile sets, really?

I do agree that Blizz needs to add more community/GSL maps, Tal'Darim is the only non-Blizz map in the pool!
Chronald
Profile Joined December 2009
United States619 Posts
December 20 2011 18:53 GMT
#725
bahhhhhhhhh gold bases
Got that.
andaylin
Profile Joined August 2010
United States10830 Posts
December 20 2011 18:55 GMT
#726
On December 21 2011 03:51 Zeroxk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 21 2011 03:34 Canadaehz wrote:
Has amyone ever come to the realization That Blizzard employees make these maps for a living? If you consider that you should come to the realization that the maps are so bad it is ridiculous. It is stupid how people who have a job or go to school and make maps as a hobby make better maps than people who do it for a living.

For example look at the tileset differences comparing Arid and lets say Ohana (the map that one the TLMC) you probably will say that Ohana looks 100x better. In fact you could probably say that about almost all the maps in the TLMC and almost every good non-blizzard made map. It is apalling to know we have to play on bland, boring disgusting tile sets with no features and no creative design.

Don't even get me started on map design...
I only pose one question. Do you prefer GSL maps (Daybreak, Calm before the Storm, Taldarim Altar etc) or Blizzard maps?
Don't get me wrong, Metalopolis, Antiga Shipyard and Shakuras Plateau are great maps but these new maps they implementing are half-ass pieces of garbage. I think the general consensus is GSL has the best map pool when it comes exciting macro games. If you haven't watched a lot of GSL games please don't comment.

Anyways my map pool would be Daybreak, Calm before the Storm, Taldarim Altar, Metalopolis, ESV Cloud Kingdom, WCG Antiga Shipyard (much improved tile set), Bel'Shir Beach and either Shakuras Plateau or another ESV map.

Disclaimer: This was written on my iPhone so excuse any typos.


You speak as if GSL is exempt from bad maps, Crossfire, Bel'shir and Dual Sight are all villains now. And whining about tile sets, really?

I do agree that Blizz needs to add more community/GSL maps, Tal'Darim is the only non-Blizz map in the pool!

Crossfire, Bel'shir, and Dual Sight have all been improved and even prior to that was host to some of the best GSL games.
"Hard work beats talent when talent fails to work hard." - Kevin Durant
Canadaehz
Profile Joined April 2011
Canada59 Posts
December 20 2011 18:55 GMT
#727
On December 21 2011 03:51 Zeroxk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 21 2011 03:34 Canadaehz wrote:
Has amyone ever come to the realization That Blizzard employees make these maps for a living? If you consider that you should come to the realization that the maps are so bad it is ridiculous. It is stupid how people who have a job or go to school and make maps as a hobby make better maps than people who do it for a living.

For example look at the tileset differences comparing Arid and lets say Ohana (the map that one the TLMC) you probably will say that Ohana looks 100x better. In fact you could probably say that about almost all the maps in the TLMC and almost every good non-blizzard made map. It is apalling to know we have to play on bland, boring disgusting tile sets with no features and no creative design.

Don't even get me started on map design...
I only pose one question. Do you prefer GSL maps (Daybreak, Calm before the Storm, Taldarim Altar etc) or Blizzard maps?
Don't get me wrong, Metalopolis, Antiga Shipyard and Shakuras Plateau are great maps but these new maps they implementing are half-ass pieces of garbage. I think the general consensus is GSL has the best map pool when it comes exciting macro games. If you haven't watched a lot of GSL games please don't comment.

Anyways my map pool would be Daybreak, Calm before the Storm, Taldarim Altar, Metalopolis, ESV Cloud Kingdom, WCG Antiga Shipyard (much improved tile set), Bel'Shir Beach and either Shakuras Plateau or another ESV map.

Disclaimer: This was written on my iPhone so excuse any typos.


You speak as if GSL is exempt from bad maps, Crossfire, Bel'shir and Dual Sight are all villains now. And whining about tile sets, really?

Crossfire is actually balanced if you look at the ratios. Even I didn't expect that. And they also fixed Belshir and Dual Sight is 10x better than Arid or Entombed.

And tile sets make the maps more appealing. I rather play on a beautiful map then a piece of dog s***.

I do agree that Blizz needs to add more community/GSL maps, Tal'Darim is the only non-Blizz map in the pool!

Roxy
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada753 Posts
December 20 2011 18:56 GMT
#728
The maps are so stale
I want more map changes... especially for the 2's, 3's and 4's maps

http://sc2ranks.com/us/941824/Roxy - Masters Protoss: "Respect my authoritai"
Canadaehz
Profile Joined April 2011
Canada59 Posts
December 20 2011 19:04 GMT
#729
For some reason it wont let me quote properly but Crossfire is actually balanced despite what people think if you look at statistics.

Belshir Beach has been fixed.

Dual Sight is a lot more balanced than Arid and Entombed.

Also tile sets arent the biggest of problems compared to balance but quickly compare Belshir Beach or any GSL map for that matter to Arid, Entombed, Nerazim or Abyssal. Please dont tell me you think the Blizzard maps are appealing.
TheOGBlitzKrieg
Profile Joined June 2010
United States346 Posts
December 20 2011 23:03 GMT
#730
honestly when i first read this i thought it was a joke... 2 maps in the course of, what has it been since we've seen new maps, around 6 months?? no new maps in season 4, and just 2 in season 5. a custom games system that allows me to only play the shattered temple or xel'naga caverns if i don't have a partner... i mean literally this is a joke, blizzard seriously needs to get off their ass and do something because i honestly take these two new maps as a slap in the face. we should have all new maps, every season. AND we NEED a better custom games method, and that should be done like NOW. it's been over a year and we've had literally no changes whatsoever to the custom games method. I mean, i guess blizzard just must be really happy with the shattered temple and xel'naga caverns.
HystericaLaughter
Profile Joined September 2011
Australia720 Posts
December 20 2011 23:16 GMT
#731
At a first glance Arid Plateau looks promising, it kind of reminds me of belshir beach with the horizontal expanding style.

Entombed valley appears to be ok, but its kind of awkward with the rock positioning on the third base, and I don't like the idea of horizontal spawns TvZ. I feel like Terran can just be like 'Sup Zerg base?' in about 10 seconds.
My wife for hire! - Zealot
Solo Terran
Profile Joined November 2011
367 Posts
December 21 2011 01:31 GMT
#732
Why are so many people hating on Arid Plateau? I personally think that it is a really good map and is quite balanced for all races. Zergs complain because of the natural and I understand that it is pretty bad for zerg, but look at the rush distance. Zerg should have some patrolling zerglings and overlords and shoudl always spot rushes coming with enough time to react. I think as long as zergs invest in an early roach warren they should be able to defend any early pushes by z or p if they react in time. Then once zerg makes it into the mid game I think that the map is actually almost zerg favoured. The expansions are quite long distances away from another making ling run by's/ counter attacks very useful and the map is really good for mutas.

Then as long as the zerg take the initiative to attack on the t/p's side of the map with good macro even if they are not cost effective they come out ahead as long as they do significant damage to either production or the army of t/p since it takes so long to remake armies as t/p.

I think everyone should give Arid Plateau a chance.
Spekulatius
Profile Joined January 2011
Germany2413 Posts
December 21 2011 01:56 GMT
#733
Those maps look really, really good compared to what we're used to see from Blizz.
Always smile~
rd
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States2586 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-21 02:06:04
December 21 2011 02:04 GMT
#734
They removed two decent PvZ maps for two new maps that could potentially suck. Arid plateau is basically the same natural as xel'naga caverns. Entombed Valley has a great, defendable third, that also leaves your wall-off vulnerable via the rocks. If those rocks don't have enough health that map is equally suck.

Looks great PvT though. PvP looks okay, so many nice places to sneak a pylon on Entombed Valley.
Xenomorph
Profile Joined May 2010
United States137 Posts
December 21 2011 02:13 GMT
#735
Seems like a step back to me, onto the TL maps!
Intrepid Traveler
neoghaleon55
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7435 Posts
December 21 2011 03:02 GMT
#736
Entombed Valley is absolute garbage for zergs.
Cliffs and chokes everywhere, hard to take down expansions if Terrans just have a planetary and 2 tanks at every base.
Heavy chokes means force field will be much more effective.
Each of the additional bases are held in small pockets that are hard to get a surround on...

It feels like a worse version of Back Water Gulge
moo...for DRG
IPA
Profile Joined August 2010
United States3206 Posts
December 21 2011 03:07 GMT
#737
Can any master level zergs give an opinion of the new maps? Should I veto after I return from holidays?
Time held me green and dying though I sang in my chains like the sea.
iHirO
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United Kingdom1381 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-21 04:27:16
December 21 2011 03:09 GMT
#738
GraphicsThis is for all you new people: I only have one rule. Everyone fights. No one quits. You don't do your job, I'll shoot you myself. You get me?
lim1017
Profile Joined April 2010
Canada1278 Posts
December 21 2011 03:24 GMT
#739
On December 21 2011 12:02 neoghaleon55 wrote:
Entombed Valley is absolute garbage for zergs.
Cliffs and chokes everywhere, hard to take down expansions if Terrans just have a planetary and 2 tanks at every base.
Heavy chokes means force field will be much more effective.
Each of the additional bases are held in small pockets that are hard to get a surround on...

It feels like a worse version of Back Water Gulge



This its impossible to break a terran with tanks on Entombed valley without broods.
The_Templar
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
your Country52797 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-12-21 04:25:00
December 21 2011 04:24 GMT
#740
On December 21 2011 10:31 Solo Terran wrote:
Why are so many people hating on Arid Plateau? I personally think that it is a really good map and is quite balanced for all races. Zergs complain because of the natural and I understand that it is pretty bad for zerg, but look at the rush distance. Zerg should have some patrolling zerglings and overlords and shoudl always spot rushes coming with enough time to react. I think as long as zergs invest in an early roach warren they should be able to defend any early pushes by z or p if they react in time. Then once zerg makes it into the mid game I think that the map is actually almost zerg favoured. The expansions are quite long distances away from another making ling run by's/ counter attacks very useful and the map is really good for mutas.

Then as long as the zerg take the initiative to attack on the t/p's side of the map with good macro even if they are not cost effective they come out ahead as long as they do significant damage to either production or the army of t/p since it takes so long to remake armies as t/p.

I think everyone should give Arid Plateau a chance.

You might have 2 lings just spawned and 8 drones at your natural when a bunker rush comes with a 15 hatchery. If he comes in with 3-4 scvs and builds 2 bunkers at the choke at the narrow side, you absolutely CAN NOT kill him. By the time you go around the choke, his bunkers will almost be done.


On December 21 2011 12:09 iHirO wrote:
Theres a new 3v3 map called Dirt Side... so many gold bases!

That is not new.
Moderatorshe/her
TL+ Member
Prev 1 35 36 37 38 39 44 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 8h 10m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
SpeCial 226
Nina 206
Livibee 97
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 4145
Aegong 74
Sexy 44
Icarus 4
Dota 2
monkeys_forever605
LuMiX1
League of Legends
JimRising 681
Counter-Strike
Fnx 2053
Coldzera 170
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox646
Other Games
summit1g11989
shahzam1416
Day[9].tv455
C9.Mang0301
ToD244
Maynarde227
kaitlyn29
RuFF_SC215
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1640
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 77
• davetesta75
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Doublelift8006
• Stunt1196
Other Games
• Day9tv455
Upcoming Events
Sparkling Tuna Cup
8h 10m
WardiTV European League
14h 10m
PiGosaur Monday
22h 10m
OSC
1d 10h
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 14h
The PondCast
2 days
Online Event
2 days
Korean StarCraft League
4 days
CranKy Ducklings
4 days
Online Event
4 days
[ Show More ]
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL 20 Non-Korean Championship
FEL Cracow 2025
Underdog Cup #2

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL 20 Team Wars
CC Div. A S7
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25

Upcoming

BSL 21 Qualifiers
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #1
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #2
ASL Season 20
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
WardiTV Summer 2025
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
HCC Europe
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.