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On December 11 2011 07:05 arfyron wrote: The bias on this forum is amazing. Nani says something untrue about coL and catz but catz is BM for responding. How do you know that it's untrue? Because coL and catz say it? Is that not bias?
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On December 11 2011 07:06 Mordiford wrote:Show nested quote +On December 11 2011 07:01 MasterBlasterCaster wrote:On December 11 2011 06:56 jnsjr wrote:On December 11 2011 06:48 Rubber wrote: Why are so many people acting outraged about CatZ's post... the whole thing seemed pretty sincere and not BM at all. People don't want to hear the truth about their favorite player, and will rationalize away any sort of negative criticism, regardless if its been corroborated by multiple people, teams, and past public experiences. It seems pretty obvious that Catz wasn't trying to put down Naniwa, but rather give his honest assessment on the situation. Both him and merz have more inside knowledge and understanding of the situation, but rather than value their opinion, they have both just been unreasonably attacked. Oh well. Good luck with Quantic. I really hope that this is the environment you were looking for, and you can show us great games in 2012. I hope your amazing talent and dedication becomes the focus in 2012! Actually, it's mainly the fact that CoL feels the need to put him down at every opportunity... kind of makes them look dishonest. Why would they act like they have a grudge if they don't? So far I haven't seen him say anything negative about them at all, yet all I can hear from them is: "I like the guy, he's great, I hope he does well... btw fuck him, he's a POS and you all should know that he's a fucking asshole." Seems kind of stupid to me... but whatever. It started out with them attempted to correct misinformation. Naniwa mentioned additional factors such as money and priorities in his interview, which is what Catz responded to. Specifically the quote about Catz getting 5000 viewers being comparable to Naniwa's MLG finish. Catz also affirmed that Naniwa gets paid around three times as much as him and would likely get paid more if not for his attitude. All of this is relevant and a direct response to some of the stuff Naniwa said in his interview. It's not like Naniwa is coming in and saying, "Well, I'm really excited about being with Sase and look forward to performing in Code S-" and then Complexity just comes in and yells, "Naniwa is a asshole!". They're responding directly to what he's saying. Well... not quite. I read Nani's original statement, and it said nothing negative about coL at all. Then the coL guy comes out and basically says:
We didn't give a shit about him, he was gone no matter what was good for him or not. We dumped him off on the first person we could find, which happens to be Quantic. Oh BTW, Good luck to him in the future!
Which is pretty pathetic if you ask me. Dude would have gotten fired from an NFL team if he released a statement like that about a former player.
I don't see why catz or coL can't just say: "Hey, we're sorry it couldn't work out; hope he does great in the future. BTW, we're sending (whoever) to Korea soon and we will always be on the lookout for new talent!"
Would have been fine. But no, they had to play the pissing contest game with someone who it looks like isn't even taking a piss at them...
Just seems really unprofessional to me.
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On December 11 2011 05:06 On_Slaught wrote: I wonder what all the Naniwa fans will say when he leaves Quantic on bad grounds? It's not like he joined these other teams on terrible terms. They all start well and then... well you know.
How does naniwa have more cred than a prof organization and other, less BM, progamers like Catz? Because you like him he must be right? I don't have any real opinion on the guy (he is a good player), but based on what we know about him he is far from "presumed innocent." Rather, it should be the opposite.
I wonder what all the Obama fans will say when he press the button that kills everyone in the world with nuclear weapons and communism?
Heres the answer: stop making imaginary shit up out of thin air.
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On December 11 2011 04:57 HappyChris wrote:Show nested quote +On December 11 2011 04:24 coL.CatZ wrote: oh wow didn't really take a look at this thread until now, first of all, I feel like people are way misguided here, Naniwa made 3 times as much as I do as far as salary goes, so no, obviously we're not the same. I don't know why Naniwa chose to use me as an example, but what he stated is simply false, and I doubt he was referring to salary. ofc they don't care the same way if he wins a big event than if i have a bunch of viewers on my stream.
I will tell you one more thing, I make 1/3 of what Naniwa makes in salary, but if Naniwa learned to behave, he'd make at least 6 times as much, unfortunately, he's been burning bridges since he started playing this game, and even before that, so no one will offer him the salary he deserves based off of the skill he has as a player, and as sad as it is, he knows that.
I consider Johan a friend and wish him the best of luck in QxG, truth is he has been trying to change for a long time, he has been trying to clear his PR a bit, he tries to bm less, gg more, be less rude in general, but his personality is what it is. He is picky, he is arrogant, he is many things that make him a difficult human being to work with, he is quick to be a smartass and be offensive at times, but he is also quickest to get offended. He as we all are, is a human with a lot of flaws. He is also a very honest person, and most of the time has tons of good intentions, but translating these into actions is hard for him. you know how as little kids everyone says w/e they want and do w/e they want and there's little to no repercussions, but then as you grow up you learn 'oh shit, that was the wrong way to approach this or that' or 'maybe i shouldn't say that' or 'trying to explain this will just cause more confusion', you know, like when a Jehovah's witness knocks on your door you don't tell them 'fuck off, you're wrong about everything you're saying' you're polite about it, then go back inside and rant 'it was just those annoying people trying to sell me their god again' well naniwa didn't learn most of those things, so he's stuck in the phase where he is incredibly hard to deal with. He's not a bad person, and once you get to know him and try to understand him a bit better, he's actually pretty cool, so, Johan, best of luck to you, I hope you find a home in QxG where you're at last comfortable and best of luck to QxG, please be patient and treat carefully! Cats you should not have got involved in this. I respect you alot but this is personaly stuff. You basically calling him a spoiled, social misfit child. Its harsh and it got no place on TL. You defiantly not his friend Catz no matter how much you sugar coat it..
why can't Catz express how he feels about Naniwa? it's not like Catz is making stuff up. everyone knows Naniwa has a bad personality. public forum so let the truth be told.
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On December 11 2011 07:05 arfyron wrote: The bias on this forum is amazing. Nani says something untrue about coL and catz but catz is BM for responding. A huge part of the reason why Nani has so many haters is how brutally (thoughtlessly many would say) honest the man is. Food for thought.
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I'm a NaNi fan(boy) and I don't get why would somebody be butthurt with CatZ post. Some people need to be less sensitive about a forum post that may or may not be filled with truth. It is not that offensive and if it were why would you care? People are still allowed to not love each other.
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On December 11 2011 07:14 ninjamyst wrote:Show nested quote +On December 11 2011 04:57 HappyChris wrote:On December 11 2011 04:24 coL.CatZ wrote: oh wow didn't really take a look at this thread until now, first of all, I feel like people are way misguided here, Naniwa made 3 times as much as I do as far as salary goes, so no, obviously we're not the same. I don't know why Naniwa chose to use me as an example, but what he stated is simply false, and I doubt he was referring to salary. ofc they don't care the same way if he wins a big event than if i have a bunch of viewers on my stream.
I will tell you one more thing, I make 1/3 of what Naniwa makes in salary, but if Naniwa learned to behave, he'd make at least 6 times as much, unfortunately, he's been burning bridges since he started playing this game, and even before that, so no one will offer him the salary he deserves based off of the skill he has as a player, and as sad as it is, he knows that.
I consider Johan a friend and wish him the best of luck in QxG, truth is he has been trying to change for a long time, he has been trying to clear his PR a bit, he tries to bm less, gg more, be less rude in general, but his personality is what it is. He is picky, he is arrogant, he is many things that make him a difficult human being to work with, he is quick to be a smartass and be offensive at times, but he is also quickest to get offended. He as we all are, is a human with a lot of flaws. He is also a very honest person, and most of the time has tons of good intentions, but translating these into actions is hard for him. you know how as little kids everyone says w/e they want and do w/e they want and there's little to no repercussions, but then as you grow up you learn 'oh shit, that was the wrong way to approach this or that' or 'maybe i shouldn't say that' or 'trying to explain this will just cause more confusion', you know, like when a Jehovah's witness knocks on your door you don't tell them 'fuck off, you're wrong about everything you're saying' you're polite about it, then go back inside and rant 'it was just those annoying people trying to sell me their god again' well naniwa didn't learn most of those things, so he's stuck in the phase where he is incredibly hard to deal with. He's not a bad person, and once you get to know him and try to understand him a bit better, he's actually pretty cool, so, Johan, best of luck to you, I hope you find a home in QxG where you're at last comfortable and best of luck to QxG, please be patient and treat carefully! Cats you should not have got involved in this. I respect you alot but this is personaly stuff. You basically calling him a spoiled, social misfit child. Its harsh and it got no place on TL. You defiantly not his friend Catz no matter how much you sugar coat it.. why can't Catz express how he feels about Naniwa? it's not like Catz is making stuff up. everyone knows Naniwa has a bad personality. public forum so let the truth be told.
Because in his post he critized Naniwa for not knowing how to interact in a mannered way, and when to better not say anything at all. While he is lacking exactly this forethought in his post.
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On December 11 2011 07:11 MasterBlasterCaster wrote:Show nested quote +On December 11 2011 07:06 Mordiford wrote:On December 11 2011 07:01 MasterBlasterCaster wrote:On December 11 2011 06:56 jnsjr wrote:On December 11 2011 06:48 Rubber wrote: Why are so many people acting outraged about CatZ's post... the whole thing seemed pretty sincere and not BM at all. People don't want to hear the truth about their favorite player, and will rationalize away any sort of negative criticism, regardless if its been corroborated by multiple people, teams, and past public experiences. It seems pretty obvious that Catz wasn't trying to put down Naniwa, but rather give his honest assessment on the situation. Both him and merz have more inside knowledge and understanding of the situation, but rather than value their opinion, they have both just been unreasonably attacked. Oh well. Good luck with Quantic. I really hope that this is the environment you were looking for, and you can show us great games in 2012. I hope your amazing talent and dedication becomes the focus in 2012! Actually, it's mainly the fact that CoL feels the need to put him down at every opportunity... kind of makes them look dishonest. Why would they act like they have a grudge if they don't? So far I haven't seen him say anything negative about them at all, yet all I can hear from them is: "I like the guy, he's great, I hope he does well... btw fuck him, he's a POS and you all should know that he's a fucking asshole." Seems kind of stupid to me... but whatever. It started out with them attempted to correct misinformation. Naniwa mentioned additional factors such as money and priorities in his interview, which is what Catz responded to. Specifically the quote about Catz getting 5000 viewers being comparable to Naniwa's MLG finish. Catz also affirmed that Naniwa gets paid around three times as much as him and would likely get paid more if not for his attitude. All of this is relevant and a direct response to some of the stuff Naniwa said in his interview. It's not like Naniwa is coming in and saying, "Well, I'm really excited about being with Sase and look forward to performing in Code S-" and then Complexity just comes in and yells, "Naniwa is a asshole!". They're responding directly to what he's saying. Well... not quite. I read Nani's original statement, and it said nothing negative about coL at all. Then the coL guy comes out and basically says: We didn't give a shit about him, he was gone no matter what was good for him or not. We dumped him off on the first person we could find, which happens to be Quantic. Oh BTW, Good luck to him in the future! Which is pretty pathetic if you ask me. Dude would have gotten fired from an NFL team if he released a statement like that about a former player. I don't see why catz or coL can't just say: "Hey, we're sorry it couldn't work out; hope he does great in the future. BTW, we're sending (whoever) to Korea soon and we will always be on the lookout for new talent!" Would have been fine. But no, they had to play the pissing contest game with someone who it looks like isn't even taking a piss at them... Just seems really unprofessional to me.
i guess if thats what you want to pretend happened you can make that argument.
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On December 11 2011 07:06 MasterBlasterCaster wrote:Show nested quote +On December 11 2011 07:05 arfyron wrote: The bias on this forum is amazing. Nani says something untrue about coL and catz but catz is BM for responding. How do you know that it's untrue? Because coL and catz say it? Is that not bias?
Yeah Catz is going to lie about making a third of nani's salary? Nani has a history of being incredibly difficult and BM. I'm sure he's the one that's telling the truth.
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I'm a huge fan of Naniwa and what Catz says about him is probably true and not bm in any way. Some fans need to wake up. I don't like Naniwa because he's the most good manner guy in the scene, I like him because of who he is, regardless of how bm he can be at times.
You don't have to like Naniwa, just find some other player to be a fan of if you can't accept how he is, geez.
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I love how whenever a company / team / person writes something cautiously and keeps stuff to themselves to make sure their words can't be seen as 'bm' and 'negative' towards anyone, everyone goes 'I wish people were just honest and tell us exactly what happens!!', but whenever anyone does exactly that, they get raged at and the same damn people tell them to 'be more courteous' and shizzle. Unless of course the person in question is an 'accomplished' player, in which case it's okay for them to say and do anything they want because apparently winning in a tournament or two gives you a free pass to being a douche to anyone and automatically makes anything you say true and 100% correct.
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On December 11 2011 07:11 MasterBlasterCaster wrote:Show nested quote +On December 11 2011 07:06 Mordiford wrote:On December 11 2011 07:01 MasterBlasterCaster wrote:On December 11 2011 06:56 jnsjr wrote:On December 11 2011 06:48 Rubber wrote: Why are so many people acting outraged about CatZ's post... the whole thing seemed pretty sincere and not BM at all. People don't want to hear the truth about their favorite player, and will rationalize away any sort of negative criticism, regardless if its been corroborated by multiple people, teams, and past public experiences. It seems pretty obvious that Catz wasn't trying to put down Naniwa, but rather give his honest assessment on the situation. Both him and merz have more inside knowledge and understanding of the situation, but rather than value their opinion, they have both just been unreasonably attacked. Oh well. Good luck with Quantic. I really hope that this is the environment you were looking for, and you can show us great games in 2012. I hope your amazing talent and dedication becomes the focus in 2012! Actually, it's mainly the fact that CoL feels the need to put him down at every opportunity... kind of makes them look dishonest. Why would they act like they have a grudge if they don't? So far I haven't seen him say anything negative about them at all, yet all I can hear from them is: "I like the guy, he's great, I hope he does well... btw fuck him, he's a POS and you all should know that he's a fucking asshole." Seems kind of stupid to me... but whatever. It started out with them attempted to correct misinformation. Naniwa mentioned additional factors such as money and priorities in his interview, which is what Catz responded to. Specifically the quote about Catz getting 5000 viewers being comparable to Naniwa's MLG finish. Catz also affirmed that Naniwa gets paid around three times as much as him and would likely get paid more if not for his attitude. All of this is relevant and a direct response to some of the stuff Naniwa said in his interview. It's not like Naniwa is coming in and saying, "Well, I'm really excited about being with Sase and look forward to performing in Code S-" and then Complexity just comes in and yells, "Naniwa is a asshole!". They're responding directly to what he's saying. Well... not quite. I read Nani's original statement, and it said nothing negative about coL at all. Then the coL guy comes out and basically says: We didn't give a shit about him, he was gone no matter what was good for him or not. We dumped him off on the first person we could find, which happens to be Quantic. Oh BTW, Good luck to him in the future! Which is pretty pathetic if you ask me. Dude would have gotten fired from an NFL team if he released a statement like that about a former player. I don't see why catz or coL can't just say: "Hey, we're sorry it couldn't work out; hope he does great in the future. BTW, we're sending (whoever) to Korea soon and we will always be on the lookout for new talent!" Would have been fine. But no, they had to play the pissing contest game with someone who it looks like isn't even taking a piss at them... Just seems really unprofessional to me.
coL and catz are just responding to Naniwa's statement. Naniwa could have avoided all these drama if he just ignored the questions in the interview and not complain about how coL is ran. He started this so props to catZ for reminding us what kind of character Naniwa is.
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On December 11 2011 07:24 Sethronu wrote: I love how whenever a company / team / person writes something cautiously and keeps stuff to themselves to make sure their words can't be seen as 'bm' and 'negative' towards anyone, everyone goes 'I wish people were just honest and tell us exactly what happens!!', but whenever anyone does exactly that, they get raged at and the same damn people tell them to 'be more courteous' and shizzle. Unless of course the person in question is an 'accomplished' player, in which case it's okay for them to say and do anything they want because apparently winning in a tournament or two gives you a free pass to being a douche to anyone and automatically makes anything you say true and 100% correct.
Thank you!
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Lovers, haters, flamers, warmongers and supporters of either sides. Take a fucking chill pill.
You are not a tabloid magazine, don't just invent drama to have something to be upset about. As some people apparently are not aware of: it's perfectly possible to acknowledge flaws of a person and still be his friend. It's ok. Just listen to every time incontrol talks about idra ffs.
I think it was a sincere and honest post by catz and I'll still be supporting Naniwa. Nani hwaiting!
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Meh, it's massively condescending to speculate about the origins of Naniwa's personality. It's borderline if kept just between Catz and Naniwa (since he is after all in a position to speculate), but seems just obnoxious on a public forum.
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complexity sounds like a real joke, mvp clan is too good for those clowns
User was warned for this post
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On December 11 2011 07:24 Sethronu wrote: I love how whenever a company / team / person writes something cautiously and keeps stuff to themselves to make sure their words can't be seen as 'bm' and 'negative' towards anyone, everyone goes 'I wish people were just honest and tell us exactly what happens!!', but whenever anyone does exactly that, they get raged at and the same damn people tell them to 'be more courteous' and shizzle. Unless of course the person in question is an 'accomplished' player, in which case it's okay for them to say and do anything they want because apparently winning in a tournament or two gives you a free pass to being a douche to anyone and automatically makes anything you say true and 100% correct. Absolutes makes for such solid arguments :D
I will go out on a limb and suggest that the people on the two sides are likely not the same, and definitely not 'everyone'.
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On December 11 2011 07:32 BBMorti wrote:Show nested quote +On December 11 2011 07:24 Sethronu wrote: I love how whenever a company / team / person writes something cautiously and keeps stuff to themselves to make sure their words can't be seen as 'bm' and 'negative' towards anyone, everyone goes 'I wish people were just honest and tell us exactly what happens!!', but whenever anyone does exactly that, they get raged at and the same damn people tell them to 'be more courteous' and shizzle. Unless of course the person in question is an 'accomplished' player, in which case it's okay for them to say and do anything they want because apparently winning in a tournament or two gives you a free pass to being a douche to anyone and automatically makes anything you say true and 100% correct. Absolutes makes for such solid arguments :D I will go out on a limb and suggest that the people on the two sides are likely not the same, and definitely not 'everyone'.
Attacking someone for making a perfectly fine argument makes for a solid argument. You know exactly what he was trying to say, but you act like a jerk anyways. Be nice.
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hope it works for him in quantic because hes running out of top tier teams to join really quickly
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On December 11 2011 07:29 Grumbels wrote: Meh, it's massively condescending to speculate about the origins of Naniwa's personality. It's borderline if kept just between Catz and Naniwa (since he is after all in a position to speculate), but seems just obnoxious on a public forum. This. It's extremely obnoxious and unwarranted.
What if one of the guys on coL has a bed-wetting problem? Should Nani tell us about it because "It's the truth!"?
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