EPT1.4.2 Patch notes PTR - Page 54
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below66
United States1761 Posts
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CaptainCrush
United States785 Posts
My worst matchup is BY FAR TvP, these buffs are literally going to drop my win percentage against toss to 10% or less.... terrans cant keep up with the upgrades as it is. Lame.... | ||
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malaan
365 Posts
It's only a little larger hex than the supply depot as someone posted. This means you will need about 3 more emps to carpet a full sized army. Thank the lord I switched to protoss in 1.3 xD! | ||
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SourceOdin
United States126 Posts
On October 26 2011 10:46 CaptainCrush wrote: I love how everyone assumes that just because toss has a poor representation in GSL, then they are automatically underpowered.... you are talking about guys who play all day, every day, and have a natural talent for that sort of thing. The top 1% of players, or likely even less, is not a good spot to judge balance on.... Aren't the reasons you just listed why we should be using the top 1% as the level to balance the game at? They're playing the game at the highest level, and thus, are giving the closest representation of what the game balance is. | ||
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ectonym
United States147 Posts
I worry about these forge upgrades because any Protoss army with upgrades is scary. I only hope someone will write an extensive "counter to the 1.4.2 protoss" guide | ||
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HickleStine
Australia276 Posts
No but actually EMP did need to be nerfed. Just not that much. Also, feedback>EMP... Well at least the maps will be decent! Yay! | ||
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Zidane
United States1692 Posts
On October 26 2011 10:46 CaptainCrush wrote: I love how everyone assumes that just because toss has a poor representation in GSL, then they are automatically underpowered.... you are talking about guys who play all day, every day, and have a natural talent for that sort of thing. The top 1% of players, or likely even less, is not a good spot to judge balance on.... My worst matchup is BY FAR TvP, these buffs are literally going to drop my win percentage against toss to 10% or less.... terrans cant keep up with the upgrades as it is. Lame.... Do you know how dumb this sounds? So lets balance this game around YOU instead of players who play this game PROFESSIONALLY, at the TOP LEVEL, ALL DAY EVERYDAY. | ||
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SillyPrincess
Canada115 Posts
The Protoss upgrades tranition to well anyways. Stalkers, Charge-lots, Immortals or Collosis all share the same upgrades. Where as Zerg if you want to switch from Roach or Mutas into Zergling/Ultralisk you have to invest into a whole new upgrade route. | ||
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Arios7
United States2 Posts
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Tarot
Canada440 Posts
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States46179 Posts
On October 26 2011 10:46 CaptainCrush wrote: I love how everyone assumes that just because toss has a poor representation in GSL, then they are automatically underpowered.... you are talking about guys who play all day, every day, and have a natural talent for that sort of thing. The top 1% of players, or likely even less, is not a good spot to judge balance on.... My worst matchup is BY FAR TvP, these buffs are literally going to drop my win percentage against toss to 10% or less.... terrans cant keep up with the upgrades as it is. Lame.... Actually, your conclusion is completely backwards o.O While all divisions and ladders are certainly taken into account, the game is usually balanced around the best of the best, because those are the people least likely to make mistakes. Therefore, there is the least amount of error when assessing actual race imbalances. If you look at lower-level players, for example, you might never get anywhere with achieving proper balance because flawed macro or micro could get in the way. There are more and more confounding variables as you evaluate worse and worse players when it comes to judging balance. | ||
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below66
United States1761 Posts
On October 26 2011 10:46 CaptainCrush wrote: I love how everyone assumes that just because toss has a poor representation in GSL, then they are automatically underpowered.... you are talking about guys who play all day, every day, and have a natural talent for that sort of thing. The top 1% of players, or likely even less, is not a good spot to judge balance on.... My worst matchup is BY FAR TvP, these buffs are literally going to drop my win percentage against toss to 10% or less.... terrans cant keep up with the upgrades as it is. Lame.... The top 1% is the best people to judge by, as they are the best representation of the potential of each units and how to micro effectively with them. You have to balance the game at the end of the day for high level tournaments over ladder IMO, but blizzard doesn't really think that way and they have shown that they care more about the over-all population than the professional players so I think the 99% are lucky in that regard. Had they geared all there balancing towards how the 1% are fairing, the game would be much better balanced by now. | ||
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tnud
Sweden2233 Posts
On October 26 2011 10:46 CaptainCrush wrote: I love how everyone assumes that just because toss has a poor representation in GSL, then they are automatically underpowered.... you are talking about guys who play all day, every day, and have a natural talent for that sort of thing. The top 1% of players, or likely even less, is not a good spot to judge balance on.... My worst matchup is BY FAR TvP, these buffs are literally going to drop my win percentage against toss to 10% or less.... terrans cant keep up with the upgrades as it is. Lame.... The game should always be balanced around the top. If you do that all imbalance at lower levels are just that, lower level players being bad. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27148 Posts
The upgrade changes are pretty cool as well in that there is a little more room to maneuver in terms of getting your tech and much needed AoE out due to the reduction in upgrade costs (if you're going for a dual forge build) | ||
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Deltablazy
Canada580 Posts
On October 26 2011 10:48 SourceOdin wrote: Aren't the reasons you just listed why we should be using the top 1% as the level to balance the game at? They're playing the game at the highest level, and thus, are giving the closest representation of what the game balance is. Protoss poor GSL representation is the cause of Terran's 1/1/1 all-ins, not EMP owning late game battles. In fact, during blizzcon, a survey was showed about how Protoss players had an easier time holding off 1/1/1 all-ins thanks to the immortal range buff. This nerf is unnecesary. | ||
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Tula
Austria1544 Posts
imho the biggest problem of the matchup currently is that the only Terran unit which can deal with a ton of chargelots are marines (which is fair since they are both mineraldump units). So what does a protoss do? He tries to either Storm them or kill them with colossi. Marauders can deal with Storm just fine, but they die horribly to zealots (or trade cost inefficiently if you have pro gamer micro). So almost every Terran player practices his heart out to make sure he hits all the emps he can, (and has a cloud of vikings to stop colossi if he needs them) because it is the only thing they CAN do. I'd prefer to have another option to deal with chargelots, instead of having to rely on 1 caster unit and hitting perfect emps to win a matchup. Note before you give me some BS about how everyone dodges storms etc. Yes you can dodge the 2nd and 3rd tick of a storm if your good, but if 2 storms land every marine will be dead, no matter how well you dodge. Currently the entire matchup is pretty broken. Terran is forced into a bio&support style because Mech sucks so hard, and protoss can simply forget their stargate unless they want to go for a 1base play because that option sucks badly. I wish they'd fix THAT instead of trying to balance bio&ghost vs. gate/robo armies. If mech was a decent option, i'd be perfectly fine with storms ripping apart any bio forces that are stupid enough to still hang around, at least it would give Terrans something to transition to, as it is we are almost forced to end the game on 3base at the latest, because there is nothing else to reach in our techpath after 3/3 bio + support. | ||
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XRaDiiX
Canada1730 Posts
ZvT pretty much balanced IMO except for ghosts snipe ability. PvT anyone with a brain knows Protoss is getting stomped by Terrans left and right Blizzard solution = Buff Protoss take away some AOE from Terran Emp. Leave Zerg in the Dust like the last few patches | ||
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SolidMoose
United States1240 Posts
On October 26 2011 10:28 SheerStress wrote: we ll see how this patch works out, hopefully protoss can stop complaining after this (looking at you SOTG). I wonder how the emp nerf will affect TvZ though. btw can zergs please shut the hell up about ghosts. Ghosts are problematic vs protoss cause of EMP. I dont understand why zerg complain about ghost. What else outside of ghosts beats broodlord infestor, tell me? the answer is nothing. Ghost counters zerg T3 true, so what? thats the onyl unit that does. The only evidence vs ghosts is one game vs july wehre july thought a million ultras vs an army of ghosts with no support was a good idea. and one where MVP lost super slow to darkforce until darkforce decided to make... *gasp* lings and a moved to victory. Zerg tier 3 should never lose, are you crazy?? Yeah I don't get it either. | ||
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Shiori
3815 Posts
On October 26 2011 10:52 Deltablazy wrote: Protoss poor GSL representation is the cause of Terran's 1/1/1 all-ins, not EMP owning late game battles. In fact, during blizzcon, a survey was showed about how Protoss players had an easier time holding off 1/1/1 all-ins thanks to the immortal range buff. This nerf is unnecesary. i'm sure you know better than every protoss pro railing against the ghost but.....tonnes of pros are blaming the ghost for their losses. the problem really lies in the strength of the marine/marauder composition (and how weak gateway units are by comparison) but ghosts just make it actually unwinnable supposing both players micro properly. | ||
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Tenox
Sweden128 Posts
The game is actually really close to balanced which blizzard obviously knows so they're just trying to find super small tweaks that they can get in that won't completely break anything. And the fact that they are aware of this is what I really like, they're really tippy toeing their way forward now cus they know there's not much left for WoL to be balanced. Won't be of huge importance but maybe a super small tweak like this is just what we need to get those last 10% of Terran favor to swing into balance. | ||
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