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New HotS Units/Abilities in Blizzcon - Page 347

Forum Index > SC2 General
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Lythis_
Profile Joined June 2011
Netherlands16 Posts
October 23 2011 09:21 GMT
#6921
I can understand all the theorycrafting in this thread, but stating things like "this matchup is now broken" "i will raceswitch" makes no sense - you can't tell at this point how the new units and abilities will affect the metagame.
taintmachine
Profile Joined May 2010
United States431 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-23 10:00:21
October 23 2011 09:26 GMT
#6922
i really dislike the "pull" ability of the viper. even if it didn't work on massive, it'd still just be something that you cannot stop and punishes proper positioning.
BandonBanshee
Profile Joined February 2011
Canada437 Posts
October 23 2011 09:34 GMT
#6923
On October 23 2011 17:12 MockHamill wrote:
Burrow charge

The burrow charge ability is horrible, the only thing keeping Ultras from being OP vs Terran is choke points and stutter stepping marauders. In a straight up fight they always been OP.

Now when you cannot longer micro against them they will break the matchup, especially since you will only be able to build one Thor, and none of the new units are good vs Ultras.


1) Current ultras are terrible anywhere unless they are in groups of like 7 +
2) You just said it yourself BARRACKS units counter ultras
3) The fact that ultras can kill marines and marauders signifies zvt being broken for you?
4) Thors never countered ultras...any why do you need a new unit to counter them? Marines , Marauders and ghosts do just fine at the moment.........
ALPINA
Profile Joined May 2010
3791 Posts
October 23 2011 09:37 GMT
#6924
On October 23 2011 18:26 taintmachine wrote:
i really dislike the "pull" ability of the viper. even if it only worked on massive, it'd still just be something that you cannot stop and punishes proper positioning.


Punishes positioning? I think it encourages positioning, because if colossus is in the back of toss army then it won't be easy to pull colossus without risking to lose viper to stalkers.
You should never underestimate the predictability of stupidity
Logros
Profile Joined September 2010
Netherlands9913 Posts
October 23 2011 09:44 GMT
#6925
It feels like currently the new protoss units are really overcosted. But Blizzard can still tweak a lot on costs, damage, hp etc. so I still have good hope.
Zealot Lord
Profile Joined May 2010
Hong Kong748 Posts
October 23 2011 09:55 GMT
#6926
Couldn't they just have remade the carrier to do what the tempest does?? I don't like how they are taking out (imo) one of the most iconic units in SC1 personally =/

I'm not going to comment on the Oracle atm since we really have no idea how it will play out in reality - but that said, I extremely dislike the replicant idea, I hate that I have to use other race units in order to balance the game, just seems incredibly gimmicky to me.
nyshak
Profile Joined May 2010
Germany132 Posts
October 23 2011 09:58 GMT
#6927
I like most of the changes. The only real gripe I have is with the new Hero-Thor. This type of unit just does not belong to SC/SC2. They made the mistake with the mothership, now they repeat it with the Hero-Thor.

The Warhound may make things a lot more interesting in TvT. As a Zerg I just hope that their splash will be significantly weaker than the ones of a Thor, assuming there will be more Warhounds than WoL-Thors around. Otherwise I'm afraid Mutas are out of ZvT.

Battle-Hellion: A lot of it will depend on how fast they will transform and at what point their HP increase will be active (start or end of animation?).

I love the Ultra charge and the new Viper. The Swarm Host looks too weak right now but it might be a nice way to lure a Raven out of a Terran army to detect the host and then just abduct the Raven with a Viper
B-)
taintmachine
Profile Joined May 2010
United States431 Posts
October 23 2011 09:58 GMT
#6928
On October 23 2011 18:37 Alpina wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2011 18:26 taintmachine wrote:
i really dislike the "pull" ability of the viper. even if it only worked on massive, it'd still just be something that you cannot stop and punishes proper positioning.


Punishes positioning? I think it encourages positioning, because if colossus is in the back of toss army then it won't be easy to pull colossus without risking to lose viper to stalkers.


err, i meant if it didn't work on massive. my b im going to edit it.
Daralii
Profile Joined March 2010
United States16991 Posts
October 23 2011 09:59 GMT
#6929
On October 23 2011 18:58 nyshak wrote:
The Warhound may make things a lot more interesting in TvT. As a Zerg I just hope that their splash will be significantly weaker than the ones of a Thor, assuming there will be more Warhounds than WoL-Thors around. Otherwise I'm afraid Mutas are out of ZvT.

The warhound's range is apparently less than that of a thor, so mutas should still be fine if you magic box them. Shredders are probably going to be more of a muta deterrent if they can still hit air come release.
Fear is freedom! Subjugation is liberation! Contradiction is truth!
howLiN
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Portugal1676 Posts
October 23 2011 10:07 GMT
#6930
I don't think the replicant will make it to the final game... It will inevitably come to a point where Protosses find a way to combine their army with another race's unit that will completely break a matchup. Unless they drastically change the possibilities of the replicant, in which case it just might turn it a useless unit. So yeah, I don't see it happening.
Cyber_Cheese
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Australia3615 Posts
October 23 2011 10:09 GMT
#6931
On October 23 2011 18:59 Daralii wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2011 18:58 nyshak wrote:
The Warhound may make things a lot more interesting in TvT. As a Zerg I just hope that their splash will be significantly weaker than the ones of a Thor, assuming there will be more Warhounds than WoL-Thors around. Otherwise I'm afraid Mutas are out of ZvT.

The warhound's range is apparently less than that of a thor, so mutas should still be fine if you magic box them. Shredders are probably going to be more of a muta deterrent if they can still hit air come release.

I doubt that, it's not like you could chuck them in the mineral line or anything.
The moment you lose confidence in yourself, is the moment the world loses it's confidence in you.
Promises
Profile Joined February 2004
Netherlands1821 Posts
October 23 2011 10:12 GMT
#6932
Apart from the replicants i'm not really enthusiastic about the new Protoss units, or more to say I'm mainly sad to see the carrier go. The Tempest to me doesnt look or feel cool, and to have your massive ships be a counter to really a specific one race strategy only (with a decent air to ground attack i'm sure but you don't build capitol ships for "decent") seems a little off. The use of the Oracle has to be seen, I'm guessing that if it's not too expensive and usable early'ish in the game it would make Void-ray strats a lot more dangerous since the spores can be negated, but locking out minerals still feels like a weak-ish way of harass; losing 500 minerals is quite low compared to losing a bunch of workers you'll have to remake plus the minerals they'd mine plus the building time of those workers, and in the end it only delays the mining, it's not an actual chunk taken out of their cash (ie when you kill 5 workers and they need to be rebuilt thats 250 minerals gone, these 500 delayed are still sitting in your base).

The zerg upgrades seem fun and pretty cool to be honest, altho the upgrades being hive tech would appear to make them balanced and the new units look fun.

As for terran, I dont know. The new Hellions are going to make a mech'ish ball so incredibly deadly that I would not know what to do against it, and i'm not sure how soon that upgrade is available but to have a bunch of helions riding into your base to transform there would seem quite harsh, especially for zergs. I have no idea about the radiation unit since it was never targetted, but if that stuff isnt fairly easily killed then it's such an easy way to defend passages and expands it would seem a bit rediculous.

In the end it's all a preview and in the testing stages so lets see what the future brings =)
I'm a man of my word, and that word is "unreliable".
SwiftSpear
Profile Joined February 2010
Canada355 Posts
October 23 2011 10:19 GMT
#6933
Are all the votes against the new Terran units just people who are butthurt that Terran are already OP? I'll agree the protoss units, while they look like they will be really fun to play with, are a bit uninspired. The terran units look amazing and spectacular however. They are gonna change the face of TvT TvZ and TvP.
KrSuma
Profile Joined September 2010
Korea (South)148 Posts
October 23 2011 10:20 GMT
#6934
i think warhounds are a decent addition to the terran unit because it seems like a cool unit vs mech and a good unit to counter against mass muta flocks (20~30+ in mass). pooping out thors but being countered by magic box imo is not a pretty sight + expensive 300/200.

but why no mothership? now terran having a 1 mega-unit now? i dont get it :/
howLiN
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Portugal1676 Posts
October 23 2011 10:31 GMT
#6935
On October 23 2011 19:19 SwiftSpear wrote:
Are all the votes against the new Terran units just people who are butthurt that Terran are already OP? I'll agree the protoss units, while they look like they will be really fun to play with, are a bit uninspired. The terran units look amazing and spectacular however. They are gonna change the face of TvT TvZ and TvP.

Why do you assume that a different opinion than yours is simply a form of butthurt? I don't like the shredder, it's basically a siege tank without the strategy of turning its splash damage against them. The warhound is basically an uglier thor, and I don't see the point of the battle hellion other than giving the terran another marauder in terms of bulkiness.
Provocateur
Profile Joined October 2010
Sweden1665 Posts
October 23 2011 10:41 GMT
#6936
I seriously hope they drop the concept of "one uber unit", it didn't work out with the mothership and I doubt it'll work out with the beefed up hero thor. Interesting additions otherwise, just hope that the low cost and quick production of hellions in combo with the transformation won't break the game.
FrostFire626
Profile Joined April 2010
United States79 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-23 10:46:14
October 23 2011 10:41 GMT
#6937
This Zerg freaking loves HoTS. I was discussing with friends about what changes I would most like to see, and one of them was an ability to break deathballs and heavily defended chokes. Enter ultralisk burrow, reverse dark swarm, and the viper pull ability. I got exactly what I wished for.

As a side note, some people are way, way too afraid of change. Developers should never be afraid to change core gameplay because of players (often exaggerated) fears. The "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" mentality resulted in Modern Warfare #. Blizzard's willingness to go out on a limb and actually be creative is something that should be encouraged, not feared.
bokchoi
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
Korea (South)9498 Posts
October 23 2011 10:45 GMT
#6938
I assumed the Viper was going to be a T3 unit, but with the new lack of mobile detection for Zerg I'm curious to see where it ends up. The Swarm Host definitely isn't as strong as I initially assumed it would be, which is great. I don't think the Viper and Swarm Host will be as good as people are thinking, but the new abilities and upgrades are really gonna be the things to improve Zerg. People forget what made the Defiler so powerful wasn't Swarm and PLAYGUUU. It was consume. The ability to replenish Energy so that it could cast a ton of swarms and a ton of plague and gave Zerg the ability to dictate its own attack timings.
Dalavita
Profile Joined August 2010
Sweden1113 Posts
October 23 2011 10:49 GMT
#6939
On October 23 2011 18:26 taintmachine wrote:
i really dislike the "pull" ability of the viper. even if it didn't work on massive, it'd still just be something that you cannot stop and punishes proper positioning.


It's not proper positioning if you're vulnerable to something.
NeWnAr
Profile Joined April 2010
Singapore231 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-23 10:59:53
October 23 2011 10:56 GMT
#6940
On October 23 2011 19:09 Cyber_Cheese wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 23 2011 18:59 Daralii wrote:
On October 23 2011 18:58 nyshak wrote:
The Warhound may make things a lot more interesting in TvT. As a Zerg I just hope that their splash will be significantly weaker than the ones of a Thor, assuming there will be more Warhounds than WoL-Thors around. Otherwise I'm afraid Mutas are out of ZvT.

The warhound's range is apparently less than that of a thor, so mutas should still be fine if you magic box them. Shredders are probably going to be more of a muta deterrent if they can still hit air come release.

I doubt that, it's not like you could chuck them in the mineral line or anything.



Dude you can. Chuck 2 in the mineral line so that once you pull out your SCVs you can shred the mutas to pieces.



And one more thing. Doesn't Battle Hellion=Firebat???? Hasn't anyone realized that HotS Terran is turning into the Single Player compaign Terran in WoL? I mean, Warhound is practically a Goliath and the new Thor's Tychus' pet Odin?
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