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Honestly, I'm really surprised that the game will be changing so much. All the work we've put in for the metagame will be redundant. There's almost no point in playing now aside from growing mechanically. Oh, and for "fun", but let's be serious here.
I wonder when the beta will come out, I'm itching to try some of these (replicant omfgomfgomfgomfg that video where 5 replicants copy two tanks and contain the terran wow)
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On October 22 2011 11:45 Ballistixz wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 11:43 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 11:42 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 11:40 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 11:38 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 11:35 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 11:25 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 11:19 Woizit wrote:
Um... how's Terran going to do low/high ground siege against Zerg now with a Lair tech pull from the flying Viper?! That seriously sounds OP as hell. so what ur saying is u want zerg to be completly defenseless/cost inefficient against siege tanks like they are now? the problem with siege tanks right now is that marine tank is stupidly cost effective against zerg because they dont have proper defenses against them. dont complain now that we actually have a COST EFFECTIVE unit to deal with tanks now. no longer do we have to suicide thousands and thousands of gas and minerals into a army that is mostly just minerals and barely any gas. infact the only gas comes from the tanks/medivacs. Oh ouch, the race that takes the most bases and has the best worker production has to spend slightly more to counter an army :C The viper isn't going to be cost effective, it's just going to be bullshit. Without any way to counter the viper's spells, ling/bling can just roll through marines while tanks get pulled everywhere~and you can't kill the vipers because corrupters rape every anti-air option T has atm. Zerg have to be cost inefficient to be balanced, because they have the easiest time expanding and the fastest units in the game. Why is it such a problem that it takes a couple more lings/blings than the exact same cost terran army to kill terran? Unrelated note: I'm going to miss the carrier :C so good in PvP :D how will they be bull shit when u have vikings to snipe the vipers from a range of 9? all its going to do is have terrans build vikings earlier which they already do against broodlords anyway. terrans also have the shredders so its not like u terrans have to worry about counter atks anymore... Hey look, corrupters and magic melee range vikings! wonder how this will go! first of all i think the cloud only effects ground units from what ive heard. 2nd of all, u do know u can move vikings out of the cloud range right? derp Hey look, you completely ignored corrupters (again). And moving out of the cloud is still time not shooting, which is going to make them even worse. what are corruptors going to do? u TARGET fire the vipers then kite the corruptors. whats the problem? u seriously think corruptors are good in TvZ?
corrupters are air control. Spread vipers, corrupters get to kill the vikings for maybe 2 vipers? Whoop-de-doo time to unsiege and retreat again!
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On October 22 2011 11:45 SuperYo1000 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 11:43 rpgalon wrote:
If tempest can be kited by vikings, I see no future for protoss in the PvT matchup... tempest actually looked really fast in the video
really? I hope they are at least the same speed as vikings.
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On October 22 2011 11:38 Ballistixz wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 11:35 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 11:25 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 11:19 Woizit wrote:
Um... how's Terran going to do low/high ground siege against Zerg now with a Lair tech pull from the flying Viper?! That seriously sounds OP as hell. so what ur saying is u want zerg to be completly defenseless/cost inefficient against siege tanks like they are now? the problem with siege tanks right now is that marine tank is stupidly cost effective against zerg because they dont have proper defenses against them. dont complain now that we actually have a COST EFFECTIVE unit to deal with tanks now. no longer do we have to suicide thousands and thousands of gas and minerals into a army that is mostly just minerals and barely any gas. infact the only gas comes from the tanks/medivacs. Oh ouch, the race that takes the most bases and has the best worker production has to spend slightly more to counter an army :C The viper isn't going to be cost effective, it's just going to be bullshit. Without any way to counter the viper's spells, ling/bling can just roll through marines while tanks get pulled everywhere~and you can't kill the vipers because corrupters rape every anti-air option T has atm. Zerg have to be cost inefficient to be balanced, because they have the easiest time expanding and the fastest units in the game. Why is it such a problem that it takes a couple more lings/blings than the exact same cost terran army to kill terran? Unrelated note: I'm going to miss the carrier :C so good in PvP :D how will they be bull shit when u have vikings to snipe the vipers from a range of 9? all its going to do is have terrans build vikings earlier which they already do against broodlords anyway. terrans also have the shredders so its not like u terrans have to worry about counter atks anymore...
Except shredders won't be in your base because they don't work when friendly units are in range. They don't appear to have anything to do with counter attacks.
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On October 22 2011 11:45 Ballistixz wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 11:43 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 11:42 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 11:40 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 11:38 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 11:35 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 11:25 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 11:19 Woizit wrote:
Um... how's Terran going to do low/high ground siege against Zerg now with a Lair tech pull from the flying Viper?! That seriously sounds OP as hell. so what ur saying is u want zerg to be completly defenseless/cost inefficient against siege tanks like they are now? the problem with siege tanks right now is that marine tank is stupidly cost effective against zerg because they dont have proper defenses against them. dont complain now that we actually have a COST EFFECTIVE unit to deal with tanks now. no longer do we have to suicide thousands and thousands of gas and minerals into a army that is mostly just minerals and barely any gas. infact the only gas comes from the tanks/medivacs. Oh ouch, the race that takes the most bases and has the best worker production has to spend slightly more to counter an army :C The viper isn't going to be cost effective, it's just going to be bullshit. Without any way to counter the viper's spells, ling/bling can just roll through marines while tanks get pulled everywhere~and you can't kill the vipers because corrupters rape every anti-air option T has atm. Zerg have to be cost inefficient to be balanced, because they have the easiest time expanding and the fastest units in the game. Why is it such a problem that it takes a couple more lings/blings than the exact same cost terran army to kill terran? Unrelated note: I'm going to miss the carrier :C so good in PvP :D how will they be bull shit when u have vikings to snipe the vipers from a range of 9? all its going to do is have terrans build vikings earlier which they already do against broodlords anyway. terrans also have the shredders so its not like u terrans have to worry about counter atks anymore... Hey look, corrupters and magic melee range vikings! wonder how this will go! first of all i think the cloud only effects ground units from what ive heard. 2nd of all, u do know u can move vikings out of the cloud range right? derp Hey look, you completely ignored corrupters (again). And moving out of the cloud is still time not shooting, which is going to make them even worse. what are corruptors going to do? u TARGET fire the vipers then kite the corruptors. whats the problem? u seriously think corruptors are good in TvZ?
I don't think you've ever played a high level tvz ever. You don't want to sac your vikings, even if it does mean taking a significant chunk out of zerg's air threat. Because of larva mechanics if terran loses the majority of their vikings, they will never catch up and will permanently secede air control to zerg. Against broodlords and now vipers, that spells instant GG. And no, terran can't make 10 ghosts after going mass vikings to counter z air and lolroflstomp ghost imba, because snipe, while strong, needs a large energy pool to be effective, and terran doesn't have enough time to get that after losing his vikings.
Oh, shit. I'm a zergling now.
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no carriers... that will make hongun pretty sad 
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On October 22 2011 11:43 rpgalon wrote:
If tempest can be kited by vikings, I see no future for protoss in the PvT matchup...
Why not? They replace carriers which aren't used at all anyway.
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If tempest can be kited by vikings, I see no future for protoss in the PvT matchup...
The tempest is supposed to be pretty fast from what I understand. In a wierd way, the Tempest seems like the opposite of the carrier. Carriers were great against mech but sucked vs. mass anti-air. The Tempest looks like it will own mass air, but a bunch of ground-to-air like the new Goliath will mess it up.
Colossus/Tempest could be crazy potent, actually. Use Tempest to take down everything in the skies, and Colossi to melt ground forces. The only real counter would seem to be something like Battlecruisers.
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Late game Zerg is going to be super scary now. Imagine Viper/Infestor/<insert anything here> against Terran. They have a siege line with mass marines? lol it's ok REVERSE DARK SWARM FUNGAL BOOM
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On October 22 2011 11:47 youngminii wrote:
Honestly, I'm really surprised that the game will be changing so much. All the work we've put in for the metagame will be redundant. There's almost no point in playing now aside from growing mechanically. Oh, and for "fun", but let's be serious here.
I wonder when the beta will come out, I'm itching to try some of these (replicant omfgomfgomfgomfg that video where 5 replicants copy two tanks and contain the terran wow)
How did you not already have that outlook at the very beginning? Did you expect it to be any different when HoTS comes out? Guess what, when HOTS nears the end of its lifetime and the next expansion comes out, you'll feel the same way! Plus, the "work" you put into any metagame always becomes redundant eventually, at least you're constantly improving your mechanics and game sense in the process.
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On October 22 2011 11:48 Active.815 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 11:45 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 11:43 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 11:42 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 11:40 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 11:38 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 11:35 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 11:25 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 11:19 Woizit wrote:
Um... how's Terran going to do low/high ground siege against Zerg now with a Lair tech pull from the flying Viper?! That seriously sounds OP as hell. so what ur saying is u want zerg to be completly defenseless/cost inefficient against siege tanks like they are now? the problem with siege tanks right now is that marine tank is stupidly cost effective against zerg because they dont have proper defenses against them. dont complain now that we actually have a COST EFFECTIVE unit to deal with tanks now. no longer do we have to suicide thousands and thousands of gas and minerals into a army that is mostly just minerals and barely any gas. infact the only gas comes from the tanks/medivacs. Oh ouch, the race that takes the most bases and has the best worker production has to spend slightly more to counter an army :C The viper isn't going to be cost effective, it's just going to be bullshit. Without any way to counter the viper's spells, ling/bling can just roll through marines while tanks get pulled everywhere~and you can't kill the vipers because corrupters rape every anti-air option T has atm. Zerg have to be cost inefficient to be balanced, because they have the easiest time expanding and the fastest units in the game. Why is it such a problem that it takes a couple more lings/blings than the exact same cost terran army to kill terran? Unrelated note: I'm going to miss the carrier :C so good in PvP :D how will they be bull shit when u have vikings to snipe the vipers from a range of 9? all its going to do is have terrans build vikings earlier which they already do against broodlords anyway. terrans also have the shredders so its not like u terrans have to worry about counter atks anymore... Hey look, corrupters and magic melee range vikings! wonder how this will go! first of all i think the cloud only effects ground units from what ive heard. 2nd of all, u do know u can move vikings out of the cloud range right? derp Hey look, you completely ignored corrupters (again). And moving out of the cloud is still time not shooting, which is going to make them even worse. what are corruptors going to do? u TARGET fire the vipers then kite the corruptors. whats the problem? u seriously think corruptors are good in TvZ? corrupters are air control. Spread vipers, corrupters get to kill the vikings for maybe 2 vipers? Whoop-de-doo time to unsiege and retreat again!
lol spreading vipers isnt going to do anything because vikings dont have splash in the first place. not only that but ur main concern is the vipers, not the corruptors. the corrptors are USELESS in zvt if u dont have broodlord tech. as long as u kill the vipers then that means no more cloud. no more clouds means that the marines will utterly rape any corruptors that ur vikings did not kill.
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I'm really interested to see how these new units will be integrated into new and exciting strategies. But I'm not sure I agree with them taking away units.
burrowed banelings that move ♥ holy check
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On October 22 2011 11:49 awesomoecalypse wrote:Show nested quote +If tempest can be kited by vikings, I see no future for protoss in the PvT matchup... The tempest is supposed to be pretty fast from what I understand. In a wierd way, the Tempest seems like the opposite of the carrier. Carriers were great against mech but sucked vs. mass anti-air. The Tempest looks like it will own mass air, but a bunch of ground-to-air like the new Goliath will mess it up. Colossus/Tempest could be crazy potent, actually. Use Tempest to take down everything in the skies, and Colossi to melt ground forces. The only real counter would seem to be something like Battlecruisers.
Yes, very potent, with each Colossus costing 300/200 and each Tempest costing 300/300.
I'm sure you can get lots of both those onto the field.
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Also, I can't believe Blizz is giving Terran the Shredder. That unit looks like it has so much utility, and it looks so fucking strong. Come on, give it to a race that needs it.
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The oracle is a stargate unit. You won't be able to get it immediatly unless you skip robo (and thus detection).
If you skip Robo, build an Oracle, and notice your opponent is teching for Banshees or something, just stasis their tech building to buy yourself time to get an observer out. In other words, Oracles don't protect against cloaking in of themselves, but their ability to delay tech means that if you open Stargate you aren't necessarily screwed if your opponent starts teching right to cloak.
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On October 22 2011 11:51 Ballistixz wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 11:48 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 11:45 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 11:43 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 11:42 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 11:40 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 11:38 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 11:35 Active.815 wrote:On October 22 2011 11:25 Ballistixz wrote:On October 22 2011 11:19 Woizit wrote:
Um... how's Terran going to do low/high ground siege against Zerg now with a Lair tech pull from the flying Viper?! That seriously sounds OP as hell. so what ur saying is u want zerg to be completly defenseless/cost inefficient against siege tanks like they are now? the problem with siege tanks right now is that marine tank is stupidly cost effective against zerg because they dont have proper defenses against them. dont complain now that we actually have a COST EFFECTIVE unit to deal with tanks now. no longer do we have to suicide thousands and thousands of gas and minerals into a army that is mostly just minerals and barely any gas. infact the only gas comes from the tanks/medivacs. Oh ouch, the race that takes the most bases and has the best worker production has to spend slightly more to counter an army :C The viper isn't going to be cost effective, it's just going to be bullshit. Without any way to counter the viper's spells, ling/bling can just roll through marines while tanks get pulled everywhere~and you can't kill the vipers because corrupters rape every anti-air option T has atm. Zerg have to be cost inefficient to be balanced, because they have the easiest time expanding and the fastest units in the game. Why is it such a problem that it takes a couple more lings/blings than the exact same cost terran army to kill terran? Unrelated note: I'm going to miss the carrier :C so good in PvP :D how will they be bull shit when u have vikings to snipe the vipers from a range of 9? all its going to do is have terrans build vikings earlier which they already do against broodlords anyway. terrans also have the shredders so its not like u terrans have to worry about counter atks anymore... Hey look, corrupters and magic melee range vikings! wonder how this will go! first of all i think the cloud only effects ground units from what ive heard. 2nd of all, u do know u can move vikings out of the cloud range right? derp Hey look, you completely ignored corrupters (again). And moving out of the cloud is still time not shooting, which is going to make them even worse. what are corruptors going to do? u TARGET fire the vipers then kite the corruptors. whats the problem? u seriously think corruptors are good in TvZ? corrupters are air control. Spread vipers, corrupters get to kill the vikings for maybe 2 vipers? Whoop-de-doo time to unsiege and retreat again! lol spreading vipers isnt going to do anything because vikings dont have splash in the first place. not only that but ur main concern is the vipers, not the corruptors. the corrptors are USELESS in zvt. as long as u kill the vipers then that means no more cloud. no more clouds means that the marines will utterly rape any corruptors that ur vikings did not kill.
just snipe or cast EMP. jesus people. what counters infestors still work. A way to deal with siege tanks effectively was much needed
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On October 22 2011 11:51 youngminii wrote:
Also, I can't believe Blizz is giving Terran the Shredder. That unit looks like it has so much utility, and it looks so fucking strong. Come on, give it to a race that needs it.
It fits terran pretty good. I think its one of the coolest things the addon is adding. [nope i dont play terran btw :>]
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On October 22 2011 11:49 awesomoecalypse wrote:Show nested quote +If tempest can be kited by vikings, I see no future for protoss in the PvT matchup... The tempest is supposed to be pretty fast from what I understand. In a wierd way, the Tempest seems like the opposite of the carrier. Carriers were great against mech but sucked vs. mass anti-air. The Tempest looks like it will own mass air, but a bunch of ground-to-air like the new Goliath will mess it up. Colossus/Tempest could be crazy potent, actually. Use Tempest to take down everything in the skies, and Colossi to melt ground forces. The only real counter would seem to be something like Battlecruisers.
Is the Tempest massive? What makes you think that mass viking or mass corruptor won't utterly obliterate Colossus/Tempest?
The Tempest looks like it's primarily designed to counter mass-muta. I can't imagine that the single-target DPS will be particularly high if they have that much splash - making them extremely vulnerable to the AA units of the other races.
Not to mention the ASTRONOMICAL amount of gas involved with a colossus/tempest composition - it's almost like advocating a carrier/colossus composition now.
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also terrans still have ravens FFS. USE IT. PDD will also make corruptors useless while u snipe the vipers with ur vikings. it will basically just turn into a battle for air superiority.
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EPT
