EPTStephano contract situation - Page 63
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Lack of content, flaming (of the French or anyone) and useless posts will be punished. Please keep it from being too inflammatory and keep discussion on-topic. -semioldguy (p.103) Update: Please read http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=267506#1 and continue the discussion there. | ||
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archonOOid
1983 Posts
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ImHuko
United States996 Posts
On September 20 2011 05:53 Sqq wrote: Thats the bits I've collected about the laws there aswell. It still a douche move by Stephano. And it makes the whole sc2 pro scene look like a big laugh. Stephano is 17, he used to start every game by saying "PINK POWER RANGER GOGO!" or something like that. Calling him a douche because he is just a kid and doesn't understand the importance of everything yet is a bit rude. Stephano just plays the game, apparently he doesn't read any sites like TL or anything, he just enjoys the game. Everything all of a sudden has probably gotten way too involved for him, he just wants to play the game. | ||
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unsaintly
Germany687 Posts
On September 20 2011 05:55 XRaDiiX wrote: And so all the people who attacked us for supporting Stephano realise their mistakes now ...  You're right that means CoL.s announcement on TeamLiquid Yesterday Was pre-mature... Especially if we learned the Contract was not 'Legal' in any way. If its not a legally binding contract. As i said earlier in the Thread CoL.(Complexity) Should not (or cannot) take legal action because it would cause a Shit Storm. Just leave Mill(Millenium) alone let them keep Stephano and leave the Situation alone. Seems to me CoL. was/is trying to exacerbate the situation. Whats funny though is if their Contract wasn't even Legal at all ( which is what is now being said) . Then they have no say in the matter. CoL screwed up Just like their attempted aquiring of vVvTitan. Like i said Earlier... Sneaky Snake.. The Mods on Stephano Stream were saying the Contract wasn't Legal few hours ago. The trolling gets old really fast don't you think? | ||
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FaRess
Tunisia937 Posts
On September 20 2011 05:55 AzurewinD wrote: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=267130¤tpage=50#1000 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=267130¤tpage=54#1073 So according to the translations of the Millenium stream provided by random posters in this thread (DISCLAIMER, prossibly dubious at best considering low post count). The manger of Mil first claims coL never contacted them, but then admits they DID contact him, but can't spare the time to respond because he's busy casting a showmatch (EL OH EL WTF??), then says it's probably not worth responding to them anyway? Finding it difficult to sympathize with Mil here so far. I will talk for myself, what Llewellys said is he didn't get contacted when they signe stephano, it has nothing to do with the fact tha coL sended him an email tonight | ||
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ArnaudF
France993 Posts
On September 20 2011 05:53 Mazer wrote: Even if turns out that MIll is legally 'free' from any action by coL, Mill has made themselves look like idiots and Stephano is getting shafted regardless of the outcome (through his own fault to a good degree) I'm not saying the opposite. This is devastating for both Millenium and Stephano and they both acted like dicks but my point is that coL won't pull anything of that case and all their statements will lead to nothing. | ||
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Baerinho
Germany257 Posts
@UltraDavid: "Site of contract enforcement based on contract terms, choice, natl/local laws, type of contact w/ site, etc. So, hard to say heh" Just a quick reply by him, so basicly everythign is speculating right now | ||
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RajaF
Canada530 Posts
On September 20 2011 05:53 Sqq wrote: Thats the bits I've collected about the laws there aswell. It still a douche move by Stephano. And it makes the whole sc2 pro scene look like a big laugh. Actually it makes the SC2 scene start to look like a real sport, since crap like this goes on at the highest levels of professional sport entertainment, unfortunately. | ||
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ellirc
Sweden3286 Posts
On September 20 2011 05:56 SinTio wrote: Somehow that's my biggest problem here. Stephano and coL had an agreement about the general terms of the contract. The contract itself may have been not "air tight", but that's fixable. Then Millenium comes in and goes "Hey your contract's kinda off, why don't you sign one with us". At least that's what I got out of this thread until now. Feels kinda wrong... You just hit the bullseye. | ||
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ARick
17 Posts
On September 20 2011 05:56 ImHuko wrote: Stephano is 17, he used to start every game by saying "PINK POWER RANGER GOGO!" or something like that. Calling him a douche because he is just a kid and doesn't understand the importance of everything yet is a bit rude. Stephano just plays the game, apparently he doesn't read any sites like TL or anything, he just enjoys the game. Everything all of a sudden has probably gotten way too involved for him, he just wants to play the game. Stephano is 18  | ||
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Snorkle
United States1648 Posts
On September 20 2011 05:55 Paladia wrote: As a law student, I cannot stress enough how bad of an idea it would be to take legal action. Even if both organisations were in the same country the cost could be more than the yearly turnover of both organisations combined. Doing it internationally is simply not a real option. This is without even considering the legal basis of the claim. I've taken a look at some esports contracts between large organisations (such as SK-Gaming) and their players and the contracts are full of major holes and flaws, to say the least. This is after they've recruited a legal firm to "take a look at it". As such, I am 100% sure that CoL will not take any legal action, as it could very likely be the end of them. I think complexity cares more about the principle than the money. And they have sued people before who have backed out of contracts. http://www.gotfrag.com/css/story/37209/ | ||
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AzurewinD
United States569 Posts
On September 20 2011 05:57 FaRess wrote: I will talk for myself, what Llewellys said is he didn't get contacted when they signe stephano, it has nothing to do with the fact tha coL sended him an email tonight Ok thank you for clearing that up. I'll edit my post. | ||
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merz
Sweden2760 Posts
On September 20 2011 05:55 Paladia wrote: As a law student, I cannot stress enough how bad of an idea it would be to take legal action. Even if both organisations were in the same country the cost could be more than the yearly turnover of both organisations combined. Doing it internationally is simply not a real option. This is without even considering the legal basis of the claim. I've taken a look at some esports contracts between large organisations (such as SK-Gaming) and their players and the contracts are full of major holes and flaws, to say the least. This is after they've recruited a legal firm to "take a look at it". As such, I am 100% sure that CoL will not take any legal action, as it could very likely be the end of them. It's not whether or not taking legal action would actually be beneficial in an econonmic manner. It's more like SOMEONE has to do it eventually because otherwise contracts will hold no importance If coL can take legal action without sinking themselves then I'd say go for it. Also: On September 20 2011 05:54 Holy_KR wrote: "Everyone is assuming French law is on Millennium's side (and it may be) but don't jump to conclusions. This was a contractor contract, NOT an employment contract. The jurisdiction was Texas, USA and France has treaties that cover such international contracts. We are still investigating this, but people should not write off our situation just yet. In addition, many spectators have doubted our willingness to follow through with legal proceedings (as I'm sure Millenium does). They need to study history more closely http://www.gotfrag.com/css/story/37209/ Again, no decisions have been made but I don't think certain people involved with this situation are taking it seriously enough." -Jason Lake Regardless if what coL says about Stephano is true, then it's ridiculous how much this is blowing up cause of one selfish player  Thank fuck for that. If people would just please read this and understand that "But French law says X!" doesn't necessarily mean shit. | ||
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sixfour
England11061 Posts
On September 20 2011 05:54 Holy_KR wrote: "Everyone is assuming French law is on Millennium's side (and it may be) but don't jump to conclusions. This was a contractor contract, NOT an employment contract. The jurisdiction was Texas, USA and France has treaties that cover such international contracts. We are still investigating this, but people should not write off our situation just yet. basically this, if they're signing under the jurisdiction of texan law what happens in french law should mean diddly squat | ||
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wats0n
United States509 Posts
A french contract might not uphold to the standards of the U.S. but that doesn't make it invalid. Stephano signed a legal U.S. contract (presumably) with a U.S. team and even a French court would uphold that he submitted to the customs of that country and is not protected by competing laws even if they are that of his own country. | ||
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sixfour
England11061 Posts
On September 20 2011 05:56 ImHuko wrote: Stephano is 17 newsflash - the rest of the world has the month and day the correct way round in dates | ||
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Chargelot
2275 Posts
This is equal to exactly 18 years, 6 months, and 7 days. On September 20 2011 05:59 sixfour wrote: newsflash - the rest of the world has the month and day the correct way round in dates Something is correct because I do it and someone else doesn't. Good argument. | ||
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Bellygareth
France512 Posts
On September 20 2011 05:55 FaRess wrote: You're just wrong about the trial period, it's clearly not mandatory in a contract I never claimed it was mandatory. I said it was usual or customary. And I argued about breaking a CDD for a CDI. It's black and white there : http://vosdroits.service-public.fr/F40.xhtml. On a french government website. | ||
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lvent
United States140 Posts
On September 20 2011 05:52 Sleight wrote: This is truth. Please read this. This is what will happen. Stephano and all of Millenium will NOT be able to go to IPL/NASL/etc... Say a court in florida(i believe this is where complexity is based out apologies if wrong) rules in favor of Complexity and says Millennium corp(or whatever) owes them x amount of $. The money still must come from Millennium, the court can not prevent the gamers who are "contracted" for Millennium to play in a tournament/event. I dont know this as fact but I am pretty sure when Puma won the Nasl, the money was in a check made to his real name and not TSL. As long as the checks payable are made to the players and not the team corporation I dont see how it will make it difficult. Again as I mentioned if the Event/Tournament directors start denying people that will change the ball game. | ||
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DertoQq
France906 Posts
On September 20 2011 05:52 Charger wrote: Thank you, finally a source of some sort. The clause about an employee/employer breaking a contract is only viable if it's included in the contract in the first place. There is no inherent clause that allows for someone to just get out of an otherwise normal contract before the time is up or both parties mutually dissolve the contract. I had a feeling all of the 'In France, you can break a contract whenever you want for whatever reason you want as long as it's under 30 days' talk was bullshit but I remained open minded in case it was in fact true. well, it has to be in the contract, this is true, but if there isn't something about this in the contract, then the contract isn't legal. And from what i'm hearing on the millenium stream, A LOT of things were missing from the contract. But still, I personally think this is stupid from mille even if they are legaly right, that's bad for everyone. | ||
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schreddertt
Germany102 Posts
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