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I don't think this is a good change.
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On September 16 2011 05:00 tkRage wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2011 04:59 SlimeBagly wrote:On September 16 2011 04:56 tkRage wrote:
Look people. The bottom line is that there aren't any effective unit compositions that don't include infestors. We've tried them. All of 'em. Name a unit comp that Zerg hasn't tried. Until the other compositions become viable, you can't nerf infestor to the ground like this or it destroys the balance of the game.
That's my last post here. Someday, someone's gonna say "this is my last post in this thread," and then not post in the thread anymore. I edited it out because I had a few more people I wanted to respond to
Who are you? What makes you think you are an authority on balance? What makes you think your whine is different from any other players?
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On September 16 2011 05:03 tkRage wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2011 05:02 Heavenly wrote:On September 16 2011 04:59 tkRage wrote:On September 16 2011 04:57 Yaotzin wrote:On September 16 2011 04:56 tkRage wrote:
Look people. The bottom line is that there aren't any effective unit compositions that don't include infestors. We've tried them. All of 'em. Name a unit comp that Zerg hasn't tried. Until the other compositions become viable, you can't nerf infestor to the ground like this or it destroys the balance of the game.
That's my last post here. Nestea/Losira rape Protoss players in their sleep while making zero infestors. Good change - shouldn't make mech OP v Z or anything but helps against Toss which obviously needs it. There are no good Korean protoss players other than MC who is not in top shape and only won his two GSLs through absurdly greedy builds that were unpunished like 1gate nexus to colossus tech without adding more gates. nestea losira zvz finals only happened because neither of them faced a good terran player in the entire season; byun and ensnare?? You mean there are just no good protoss players whatsoever in the world, since none of them can beat Nestea or Losira who don't even use infestors, let alone neural parasite. so why again are we nerfing neural? because shitty players can't deal with it effectively? great balance policy
Because Blizzard sees it as imbalanced? You act like protoss and terrans only lose because they aren't 100% mechanically perfect with map hacks, but apparently if you play "perfectly" assuming Nestea and Losira do, you don't need even need neural parasite against any protoss player in the world, so why are you whining so much? If you DO need to use it then Blizzard thinks that is imbalanced. Like I said it has now become a situational spell instead of a great all-around spell, but you're acting like ZvP has now become almost impossible.
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On September 16 2011 05:04 Piledriver wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2011 04:59 tkRage wrote:On September 16 2011 04:57 Yaotzin wrote:On September 16 2011 04:56 tkRage wrote:
Look people. The bottom line is that there aren't any effective unit compositions that don't include infestors. We've tried them. All of 'em. Name a unit comp that Zerg hasn't tried. Until the other compositions become viable, you can't nerf infestor to the ground like this or it destroys the balance of the game.
That's my last post here. Nestea/Losira rape Protoss players in their sleep while making zero infestors. Good change - shouldn't make mech OP v Z or anything but helps against Toss which obviously needs it. There are no good Korean protoss players other than MC who is not in top shape and only won his two GSLs through absurdly greedy builds that were unpunished like 1gate nexus to colossus tech without adding more gates. nestea losira zvz finals only happened because neither of them faced a good terran player in the entire season; byun and ensnare?? Yeah and all zerg players are skill personified,and only lose due to race imbalance, while all toss players are bad. Right? Right? I dont get how this kind of shitty posting and trolling is going about unchecked on the forum. You honestly deserve to be banned till you learn to respect the skill levels of players from other races as well.
thanks for your insightful contribution to the thread (and your backseat moderating)
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good job, Blizzard you finally listened to your fans.
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On September 16 2011 05:00 Siphonn wrote:
I like this change alot better than the oringinal one, and this is coming from a protoss. I feel like getting rid of NP on collosi would be much more drastic and game changing than this.
yeah, because now it "seems" like it is still doable, but I highly doubt it actually is. bringing the fragile infestor that close to the enemy, will very often lead to immadiate death. (and dead infestors cant NP very well  )
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On September 16 2011 05:02 MageWarden wrote:
I didnt think NP needed a change... but i like i can still have a chance vs mech. Also u can NP with flanking armies.
You clearly have not seen PvZ lately then...
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they prolly did it to balance out the infestor vs ht thingy, feedback was at the same range as fungal (9) but hts were slower, so they balanced it by giving hts the range advantage (if zerg gets NP before toss feedbacks the infestor wont die and np will still be active). I think this is a bad change though, there is no way 7 is enough. The infestors will run up and try to neural the colossi and the hts wont even have to move to feedback, they can just stand still and feedback the infestors as they run to try to np. With 9 the protoss had to try to keep their colossi back and try to get the infestors feedbacked, now you can just stand still and the range advantage will do the rest
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I am fine with this change. It is already difficult enough to NP things like colossi as it makes your infestor vulnerable. However they are still useful against things such as immortals, archons, thors, BCs, etc.
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On September 16 2011 05:05 Heavenly wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2011 05:03 tkRage wrote:On September 16 2011 05:02 Heavenly wrote:On September 16 2011 04:59 tkRage wrote:On September 16 2011 04:57 Yaotzin wrote:On September 16 2011 04:56 tkRage wrote:
Look people. The bottom line is that there aren't any effective unit compositions that don't include infestors. We've tried them. All of 'em. Name a unit comp that Zerg hasn't tried. Until the other compositions become viable, you can't nerf infestor to the ground like this or it destroys the balance of the game.
That's my last post here. Nestea/Losira rape Protoss players in their sleep while making zero infestors. Good change - shouldn't make mech OP v Z or anything but helps against Toss which obviously needs it. There are no good Korean protoss players other than MC who is not in top shape and only won his two GSLs through absurdly greedy builds that were unpunished like 1gate nexus to colossus tech without adding more gates. nestea losira zvz finals only happened because neither of them faced a good terran player in the entire season; byun and ensnare?? You mean there are just no good protoss players whatsoever in the world, since none of them can beat Nestea or Losira who don't even use infestors, let alone neural parasite. so why again are we nerfing neural? because shitty players can't deal with it effectively? great balance policy Because Blizzard sees it as imbalanced? You act like protoss and terrans only lose because they aren't 100% mechanically perfect with map hacks, but apparently if you play "perfectly" assuming Nestea and Losira do, you don't need even need neural parasite against any protoss player in the world, so why are you whining so much? If you DO need to use it then Blizzard thinks that is imbalanced. Like I said it has now become a situational spell instead of a great all-around spell, but you're acting like ZvP has now become almost impossible.
Who in the blizzard balance team can beat the average high masters player 1v1? none of them. why do you assume they know anything about the balance of this game?
i'm asking you again, if neural parasite isn't necessary to beat protoss and terran and the top zergs don't use it, why the fuck is it getting nerfed
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And now NP is fair again. It has to get in range of massive units (besides archon) to use NP. Thor 7. Collsai 9. Instead of outranging and being unable to ever get hit. This is very nice and fair, plus the damage nerf.
Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay
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Should have made the mothership invulnerable to neural along with this change.
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On September 16 2011 05:05 Cloud9157 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2011 05:02 MageWarden wrote:
I didnt think NP needed a change... but i like i can still have a chance vs mech. Also u can NP with flanking armies. You clearly have not seen PvZ lately then...
clearly u havnt noticed when u get enough collosi they lol at NP
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On September 16 2011 05:05 tkRage wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2011 05:04 Piledriver wrote:On September 16 2011 04:59 tkRage wrote:On September 16 2011 04:57 Yaotzin wrote:On September 16 2011 04:56 tkRage wrote:
Look people. The bottom line is that there aren't any effective unit compositions that don't include infestors. We've tried them. All of 'em. Name a unit comp that Zerg hasn't tried. Until the other compositions become viable, you can't nerf infestor to the ground like this or it destroys the balance of the game.
That's my last post here. Nestea/Losira rape Protoss players in their sleep while making zero infestors. Good change - shouldn't make mech OP v Z or anything but helps against Toss which obviously needs it. There are no good Korean protoss players other than MC who is not in top shape and only won his two GSLs through absurdly greedy builds that were unpunished like 1gate nexus to colossus tech without adding more gates. nestea losira zvz finals only happened because neither of them faced a good terran player in the entire season; byun and ensnare?? Yeah and all zerg players are skill personified,and only lose due to race imbalance, while all toss players are bad. Right? Right? I dont get how this kind of shitty posting and trolling is going about unchecked on the forum. You honestly deserve to be banned till you learn to respect the skill levels of players from other races as well. thanks for your insightful contribution to the thread (and your backseat moderating)
Go away. You're way out of line.
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On September 16 2011 05:07 tkRage wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2011 05:05 Heavenly wrote:On September 16 2011 05:03 tkRage wrote:On September 16 2011 05:02 Heavenly wrote:On September 16 2011 04:59 tkRage wrote:On September 16 2011 04:57 Yaotzin wrote:On September 16 2011 04:56 tkRage wrote:
Look people. The bottom line is that there aren't any effective unit compositions that don't include infestors. We've tried them. All of 'em. Name a unit comp that Zerg hasn't tried. Until the other compositions become viable, you can't nerf infestor to the ground like this or it destroys the balance of the game.
That's my last post here. Nestea/Losira rape Protoss players in their sleep while making zero infestors. Good change - shouldn't make mech OP v Z or anything but helps against Toss which obviously needs it. There are no good Korean protoss players other than MC who is not in top shape and only won his two GSLs through absurdly greedy builds that were unpunished like 1gate nexus to colossus tech without adding more gates. nestea losira zvz finals only happened because neither of them faced a good terran player in the entire season; byun and ensnare?? You mean there are just no good protoss players whatsoever in the world, since none of them can beat Nestea or Losira who don't even use infestors, let alone neural parasite. so why again are we nerfing neural? because shitty players can't deal with it effectively? great balance policy Because Blizzard sees it as imbalanced? You act like protoss and terrans only lose because they aren't 100% mechanically perfect with map hacks, but apparently if you play "perfectly" assuming Nestea and Losira do, you don't need even need neural parasite against any protoss player in the world, so why are you whining so much? If you DO need to use it then Blizzard thinks that is imbalanced. Like I said it has now become a situational spell instead of a great all-around spell, but you're acting like ZvP has now become almost impossible. Who in the blizzard balance team can beat the average high masters player 1v1? none of them. why do you assume they know anything about the balance of this game? i'm asking you again, if neural parasite isn't necessary to beat protoss and terran and the top zergs don't use it, why the fuck is it getting nerfed
uhh dayvie is GM as random...
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On September 16 2011 05:05 zul wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2011 05:00 Siphonn wrote:
I like this change alot better than the oringinal one, and this is coming from a protoss. I feel like getting rid of NP on collosi would be much more drastic and game changing than this. yeah, because now it "seems" like it is still doable, but I highly doubt it actually is. bringing the fragile infestor that close to the enemy, will very often lead to immadiate death. (and dead infestors cant NP very well )
People suicide casters to do damage all the time, no reason infestors can't do it with NP too. It'll be a hard decision on when to do it, which is nice.
Should have made the mothership invulnerable to neural along with this change.
Yah this is the one part of the massive version I liked. MS actually has potential against Zerg if not for one neural ending it.
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I can't get my ahead around the fact that they go on nerfing basically everything about the unit instead of just reverting it to its status before the Fungal Buff (or reducing the first buff to be more subtle - keep the original damage and change it to 6 seconds or sth. similar).
In order to counteract the overbuffing of FG they had to make the units slower, more vulnerable, nerf FG and nerf Neural Parasite. Honestly, what kind of policy is that? Instead of just admitting their initial mistake they are making the whole units less interesting and less versatile.
The massive use of infestors because of the 'overpowered' FG has let to many new interesting ways of using them no-one would have thought of before: Burrowplay to snipe workers/buildings with FG/IT, Neural as countermeasure against Archons, even dropplay with infestors, Spineswalles in combination with fungal as defensive measure to gain time, ...
Why nerf every single detail of the unit, making them a lot more shallow, instead of just reverting FG... The new ways of using them are still viable, even with old FG.
Damn Blizzards reluctance to admit mistakes...
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On September 16 2011 05:07 tkRage wrote:Show nested quote +On September 16 2011 05:05 Heavenly wrote:On September 16 2011 05:03 tkRage wrote:On September 16 2011 05:02 Heavenly wrote:On September 16 2011 04:59 tkRage wrote:On September 16 2011 04:57 Yaotzin wrote:On September 16 2011 04:56 tkRage wrote:
Look people. The bottom line is that there aren't any effective unit compositions that don't include infestors. We've tried them. All of 'em. Name a unit comp that Zerg hasn't tried. Until the other compositions become viable, you can't nerf infestor to the ground like this or it destroys the balance of the game.
That's my last post here. Nestea/Losira rape Protoss players in their sleep while making zero infestors. Good change - shouldn't make mech OP v Z or anything but helps against Toss which obviously needs it. There are no good Korean protoss players other than MC who is not in top shape and only won his two GSLs through absurdly greedy builds that were unpunished like 1gate nexus to colossus tech without adding more gates. nestea losira zvz finals only happened because neither of them faced a good terran player in the entire season; byun and ensnare?? You mean there are just no good protoss players whatsoever in the world, since none of them can beat Nestea or Losira who don't even use infestors, let alone neural parasite. so why again are we nerfing neural? because shitty players can't deal with it effectively? great balance policy Because Blizzard sees it as imbalanced? You act like protoss and terrans only lose because they aren't 100% mechanically perfect with map hacks, but apparently if you play "perfectly" assuming Nestea and Losira do, you don't need even need neural parasite against any protoss player in the world, so why are you whining so much? If you DO need to use it then Blizzard thinks that is imbalanced. Like I said it has now become a situational spell instead of a great all-around spell, but you're acting like ZvP has now become almost impossible. Who in the blizzard balance team can beat the average high masters player 1v1? none of them. why do you assume they know anything about the balance of this game? i'm asking you again, if neural parasite isn't necessary to beat protoss and terran and the top zergs don't use it, why the fuck is it getting nerfed
Lol, challenge David Kim to a 1v1?
And because if it is used then it is imbalanced, but zerg can still win regardless? Why is this so difficult for you to understand? I said that it's not necessary, in response to you acting like it's impossible to win without neural parasite, so I told you why you can win without neural parasite being as strong as it is. I don't know how much simpler I can explain this.
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On September 16 2011 05:06 flaskposto wrote:
they prolly did it to balance out the infestor vs ht thingy, feedback was at the same range as fungal (9) but hts were slower, so they balanced it by giving hts the range advantage ...
HTs already have the advantage over an infestor that wants to NP. NP has a short casttime and feedback is instant, so the HTs should always win, when both players are equally fast.
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On September 16 2011 05:04 KimJongChill wrote:
I don't think this is a good change.
I agree but this is a much fairer compromise than before. I'll take this before Blizzard shits on us any further.
God the balance team is like an abusive absent parent. They miss our birthday then buy us a carton of cigarettes for Christmas. Then they hit us.
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EPT
