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Forikorder
Canada8840 Posts
On August 17 2011 22:53 whateverpeeps wrote: You have to read the fine print of IPL 3. They give flight and accommodation for top 2. NASL's offer is still better if you are looking to bring over 15 Koreans. IPL3 is also guranteed 1000$ prize money too though | ||
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whateverpeeps
United States214 Posts
On August 17 2011 22:52 SCPenguin wrote: Simple opinion: I think the Korean teams are asking for a little much. To have EVERYTHING paid for by the tournament is. . . outlandish. I know sponsorships in the west are a little more generous and numerous than they are in Korea, but I guess that's why we see Koreans joining foreigner teams  That's what it comes down to. Beggers shouldn't be choosers. $2000 should be enough money (and for those saying "it's only 1000!" it's not...the $1000 minimum prize was added AFTER as part of the offer to get Koreans back, and it's just semantics calling it prize pool...NASL expects it will be used for travel expense so even if you don't win any of the larger prizes you do get at least $1000 that you can use with your $1000 travel stipend. Why would you really need more than $2000? Even if you go over, it's only by $100 and $200. And if Korean teams can't afford even that much, despite participating in a tournament that is likely to land them international sponsors and they have a good shot at finals...well that's pretty bad and has nothing to do with NASL and more to do with wtf team managers in Korea are doing. | ||
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whateverpeeps
United States214 Posts
On August 17 2011 22:55 Forikorder wrote: IPL3 is also guranteed 1000$ prize money too though NASL is guaranteeing all 16 players a minimum $1000 prize pool. I'm just saying from a Koreans perspective, which do you have a greater shot of winning...the tournament where you bring 2 Koreans or 15? 15 of course. So you want to bring as many Koreans, which makes NASL a better deal. Somehow I'm not sure Korean teams understand this? It seems like they don't understand/are aware of a lot of what NASL is offering. | ||
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paloo
Switzerland64 Posts
On August 17 2011 22:45 whateverpeeps wrote: + Show Spoiler + On August 17 2011 22:13 paloo wrote: So much of this simply comes down to communication problems, it's just sad :/ NASL posted their opinion on Team Liquid and not through official channels, causing not only the five Korean teams in question but also the rest of the Korean teams to feel that they lost their reputation. This is seen as extremely amateurish in Korea With this I agree very much tho, NASL really should get their act together concerning their website. While posting stuff on TL absolutely makes sense, I feel official announcements/statements should be posted on the nasl.tv site first and foremost, and it seems like NASL has abandoned that practice almost completely. The official website is totally outdated and imo this gives NASL a really bad impression. If you visited the homepage right now you'd think all the korean players are still competing, Player/Team sites still are from S1 (hi ROOT gaming), and none of the recent news can be found. It's just bad and I can see why people would think of NASL as an amateurish organisation. :/ I don't think this whole Korean player debacle should be blamed on NASL entirely, but I think alot things need to change in their organisation, the league definitely has potential, but bad management/ decisionmaking is all over the place and holding it back. :/ E: It's kinda hard to compare... for most foreigners the most important part of going to korea/ competing in GSL is actually just being able to practice in a korean teamhouse environment I'd wager... so the month won't be wasted anyways I disagree. I think it should have also been posted on their website but there's nothing wrong with posting on TL. The thing is, the original post was nothing more than announcement. When you see it for what it is, it makes sense why it was on TL...people make announcements on TL. Where did EG make their announcement? How about IPL? Just because the announcement is not super happy and doesn't make you excited doesn't mean it shouldn't be announced on a forum where the most people are likely to see it. ALSO: If any of you saw FXO's original post, wouldn't you say that's worse and sullied the Koreans 50x worse? Yet most of the people there are saying "Fxo thanks for your transparancy." Seriously I don't see why NASL is being expected to act differently than anyone else. They did what anyone else would have done. To clarify, I don't mean to say "don't post your news on TL" what I meant to say is "don't post your news on TL _only_"... I agree that posting sc2 related news on TL is pretty much necessesary if you want people to know what's going on, but it shouldn't be the only website to get that information. IPL/EG posts stuff on their own websites or at least official twitter channels in addition to TL, while NASL seems to post stuff only on TL, that's what I'm getting at. It shouldn't be mandatory to visit this website to get up to date information about NASL. | ||
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rwadams
United States31 Posts
On August 17 2011 13:08 Xeris wrote: We provided shuttle pickup and drop off services to all players at the finals. I'm not sure why he is commenting about something he wasn't there to witness T_T Im reposting because no one seems to read it. NASL provided travel to and from the airport. I can understand not liking the deposit or the play times, but will people please stop complaining about how the koreans got stranded at LAX with nothing but the clothes on their back. P.S. That last part is an exaggeration. | ||
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whateverpeeps
United States214 Posts
On August 17 2011 23:03 paloo wrote: To clarify, I don't mean to say "don't post your news on TL" what I meant to say is "don't post your news on TL _only_"... I agree that posting sc2 related news on TL is pretty much necessesary if you want people to know what's going on, but it shouldn't be the only website to get that information. IPL/EG posts stuff on their websites or at least official twitter channels in addition to TL, while NASL seems to post stuff only on TL, that's what I'm getting at. It shouldn't be mandatory to visit this website to get up to date information about NASL. Oh yeah that I agree with. That's one thing lacking on NASL website...no place for announcements unless you count news articles. Do you think Koreans would have responded differently though had NASL posted on website first and then TL? I feel like this is the result of the backlash of the public making them defensive and wanting to clear their name, not so much about where NASL posted it. I think they expect/wish NASL hadn't posted it at all, which is unfair as NASL is obligated to make an announcement on this. If you put someone in a situation where thy have to make a sad announcement, then you can't be mad when they do. | ||
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Gotmog
Serbia899 Posts
If their teams want to send them to tournaments, they can do it.... And LOL (LOLOLOLOL) and koreans accusing foreigners (nasl in this case) of professionalism! | ||
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Forikorder
Canada8840 Posts
On August 17 2011 23:05 rwadams wrote: Im reposting because no one seems to read it. NASL provided travel to and from the airport. I can understand not liking the deposit or the play times, but will people please stop complaining about how the koreans got stranded at LAX with nothing but the clothes on their back. P.S. That last part is an exaggeration. i didnt know this and it only makes the Koreans even more hypocrits since that was one of the points MVP said should change so they arrange transport, give them 2000$ for any expenses, and a good shot at 50k and they turn it down at the last minute? sad and unporffesional | ||
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wolverinehokie
United States12 Posts
It was also crappy of NASL to insinuate they offered to increase the travel stipend to $2000 when really that was just decreasing the winnings so it's ends up being the same. I have no doubt it cost well over $2000 to travel from Korea to the US for a tournament. That's why it was such a big deal that MLG paid for Koreans to come. As far as I know, Koreans loved their MLG experience. Why can't NASL do what MLG does for their players? | ||
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mav451
United States1596 Posts
On August 17 2011 23:05 rwadams wrote: Im reposting because no one seems to read it. NASL provided travel to and from the airport. I can understand not liking the deposit or the play times, but will people please stop complaining about how the koreans got stranded at LAX with nothing but the clothes on their back. P.S. That last part is an exaggeration. Yeah, just to build on my post from the previous page...what is the point of Coach Choi's interview here? He was a 3rd party who was uninvolved and is only speaking from rumors and hearsay. Seems to me his purpose is purely to antagonize, which made his closing mark on reconciliation quite funny. | ||
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Forikorder
Canada8840 Posts
On August 17 2011 23:08 wolverinehokie wrote: The thing that always bugged me about NASL was that it seemed to cater to the casters and not the players. When you want players to compete from all over the globe, you have to accommodate them. There is no reason NASL should insist on broadcasting live. If they would just broadcast from replays, that would help the players out tremendously. Then if 2 players are scheduled for a certain time, they can discuss with each other to change the time if needed based on their schedule. Making Koreans get up at 4am, then making them wait 2 hours to play sucks a lot. I would not agree to that if I were them. It was also crappy of NASL to insinuate they offered to increase the travel stipend to $2000 when really that was just decreasing the winnings so it's ends up being the same. I have no doubt it cost well over $2000 to travel from Korea to the US for a tournament. That's why it was such a big deal that MLG paid for Koreans to come. As far as I know, Koreans loved their MLG experience. Why can't NASL do what MLG does for their players? MLG only does it becuase they know they dont offer the prize pool needed to get Koreans, they know bringing koreans raises the viewer count and they know what the GSL offered in return would increase viewers even more unless im mistaken though dont they only pay for the 4 invites via the exchange program? | ||
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DyEnasTy
United States3714 Posts
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RPR_Tempest
Australia7798 Posts
On August 17 2011 23:11 DyEnasTy wrote: Ok, I got some words. This guy has balls. First: Foreigners who are not given a ticket into code S have to deal with all the shit (language barrier, accomodations) that koreans deal with in foreign tournies except worse. No organization should have to completely pay for players to come to their tournament where they will likely win it and be rich. What is wrong with NASL posting their opinion in TL, where most of their fans gather and are going to undoubtedly wonder why their favorite koreans are gone? Im getting tired of their attitudes. Its like their saying: "were the best players in the world, if you want us to grace you with our presence than do EVERYTHING for us" "but if you come here, we'll do some things for you. If you dont like our demands, we dont care cause we already know that we'd win anyway". This is a good point. | ||
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whateverpeeps
United States214 Posts
On August 17 2011 23:08 wolverinehokie wrote: The thing that always bugged me about NASL was that it seemed to cater to the casters and not the players. When you want players to compete from all over the globe, you have to accommodate them. There is no reason NASL should insist on broadcasting live. If they would just broadcast from replays, that would help the players out tremendously. Then if 2 players are scheduled for a certain time, they can discuss with each other to change the time if needed based on their schedule. Making Koreans get up at 4am, then making them wait 2 hours to play sucks a lot. I would not agree to that if I were them. It was also crappy of NASL to insinuate they offered to increase the travel stipend to $2000 when really that was just decreasing the winnings so it's ends up being the same. I have no doubt it cost well over $2000 to travel from Korea to the US for a tournament. That's why it was such a big deal that MLG paid for Koreans to come. As far as I know, Koreans loved their MLG experience. Why can't NASL do what MLG does for their players? I don't think it's fair for the entire studio to change their working schedule for a few players, even if they are Koreans. It takes hundreds if not thousands of dollars to run a studio. I know cause my gf works in one. Besides, the times were changed to be more accommodating to Koreans after speaking to the players for Season 2 so that's not even a point of discussion. And even if they still had to wake up at 4 am, that's kind of part your job description. We regular folk can complain about that but it's expected of global players. I complain about having to drive a long distance, but hey, if I was a truck driver, that complaint becomes whiny because that's my job. If I didn't like it I shouldn't have become a truck driver! "I have no doubt it cost well over $2000 to travel from Korea to the US for a tournament." It doesn't unless you get business class and a nice hotel. | ||
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whateverpeeps
United States214 Posts
On August 17 2011 23:10 mav451 wrote: Yeah, just to build on my post from the previous page...what is the point of Coach Choi's interview here? He was a 3rd party who was uninvolved and is only speaking from rumors and hearsay. Seems to me his purpose is purely to antagonize, which made his closing mark on reconciliation quite funny. Exactly. And it seems like one of NASL's biggest complaints/pleas was that this decision was reached but nobody who was involved in making the decision came to them directly. They asked whoever was involved to speak to them so they can resolve issues. Instead of taking that invite, MVP felt the need to post this public, despite not being in the negotiations nor a part of season 1? He is only basing it on hearsay, and it seems everything he heard wasn't exactly true and was exaggerated. | ||
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Krehlmar
Sweden1149 Posts
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fire_brand
Canada1123 Posts
On August 17 2011 12:50 ThreeActPlay wrote: "Finally, because I’m answering what NASL should change in order for MVP team to participate, NASL should take better care of the players, including pick up from the airport, accomodations, and scheduling, instead of focusing only on the broadcast. If NASL want the tournament to grow, the players’ convenience should be the first priority in order to create great matches so that the fans will become enthusiastic." Sorry, but this is bunk to me. If you have to be wined and dined to compete, tough. NASL should focus on the production and the broadcast, since that's what the fans care about. Well if that's them focusing on production and broadcast then I'd rather see them spend their efforts on players. When I player is taken care of his condition is better and thus his games are better. I don't want to see Koreans come to NASL and give us horrible games. I'm sure they could trim a little money off of their gigantic prize pools to accommodate players better. Fans care about quality of games, and that comes from quality of players. You do what you have to to get the best in the world into your tournament. IPL had absolutely fantastic production, but I barely watched it because it didn't have Koreans playing. Last season in the NASL I mostly only watched Korean games. It's what made the grand finals last year so thrilling. Good games and good players. Do you really think there will be the same excitement if the grand finals have a bunch of North Americans and Europeans in it? | ||
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paloo
Switzerland64 Posts
On August 17 2011 23:06 whateverpeeps wrote: Oh yeah that I agree with. That's one thing lacking on NASL website...no place for announcements unless you count news articles. Do you think Koreans would have responded differently though had NASL posted on website first and then TL? I feel like this is the result of the backlash of the public making them defensive and wanting to clear their name, not so much about where NASL posted it. I think they expect/wish NASL hadn't posted it at all, which is unfair as NASL is obligated to make an announcement on this. If you put someone in a situation where thy have to make a sad announcement, then you can't be mad when they do. No I don't think it would have changed much in this situation, I just wanted to point it out as one of those many smaller flaws that add to the overall unprofessional appearance of NASL. | ||
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Forikorder
Canada8840 Posts
On August 17 2011 23:21 fire_brand wrote: Well if that's them focusing on production and broadcast then I'd rather see them spend their efforts on players. When I player is taken care of his condition is better and thus his games are better. I don't want to see Koreans come to NASL and give us horrible games. I'm sure they could trim a little money off of their gigantic prize pools to accommodate players better. Fans care about quality of games, and that comes from quality of players. You do what you have to to get the best in the world into your tournament. IPL had absolutely fantastic production, but I barely watched it because it didn't have Koreans playing. Last season in the NASL I mostly only watched Korean games. It's what made the grand finals last year so thrilling. Good games and good players. Do you really think there will be the same excitement if the grand finals have a bunch of North Americans and Europeans in it? how are they supposed to accomodate them more? the time doesnt have much wiggle room theres no way to make it convenient for everyone, theyre already offered 2000 dollars and transportation from the airport | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On August 17 2011 23:10 Forikorder wrote: MLG only does it becuase they know they dont offer the prize pool needed to get Koreans, they know bringing koreans raises the viewer count and they know what the GSL offered in return would increase viewers even more unless im mistaken though dont they only pay for the 4 invites via the exchange program? MLG only pays for the 4 LXP players. With the SK-oGs & coL-MVP deals, as well as FXOpen, TL, EG and Fnatic all having Koreans on the teams, MLG will likely have more Korean nationals than the 4 LXP players, consistently. But that's because the visibility is HUGE at an MLG. Which is why TL & EG having a huge chunk of players in the Pool Play is so important to them. The ROI they get is huge. | ||
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