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On August 17 2011 14:54 Azzur wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2011 14:53 deerpark87 wrote:On August 17 2011 14:50 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:49 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:48 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:45 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:40 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:34 deerpark87 wrote:On August 17 2011 14:22 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:17 Kaneh wrote:
[quote]
does the GSL then make posts all over playXP about how the foreigners wronged them and are being babies like how NASL did on TL? GSL doesn't make posts because the foreigners did nothing wrong. If the koreans simply "chose not to participate" (e.g. boxer), that is totally fine and there will be no posts on TL. In fact, Boxer and NASL are on good terms. Wrong wrong wrong. GOMTV GAVE 5 star treatments to foreigners. Remember the 2011 GSL World Championship? All foreigner airplane tickets+ housing was cover by GOMTV http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2011_GSL_World_Championship. They were guarantee 2.7k as long as they play and win the preliminaries. Well guess what? Some foreigners didn't bother to show up for the preliminaries and gave walk over to those that did. Fact: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2011_GSL_World_Championship/PreliminariesGuess what GOMTV did? nothing. They didn't bash them like what NASL. So yes, foreigners do wrong too, just GOMTV have the don't bash them like what NASL do public. Anyways, what GOM does is a moot point (i.e. you may be right/wrong, but the discussion of what they did is not relevant to the current discussions). NASL bashed the koreans because the koreans violated a SIGNED contract enmasse. It wasn't just one korean, it was many. Could the NASL have organised the tournement better? Yes. Could their PR be better? Yes. But it still doesn't change the fact that the koreans pulled out because of MONEY and affected ALOT of people in the process. If GOM isn't relevant, then don't defend a guy when he brings up GOM. And this topic is about the korean response to NASL and how it actually isn't about money. That's the supposed 'fact' this interview sheds light on. It's much more about how NASL treated the players and how poorly it was organzied - so poorly that the majority of koreans took offense and withdrew. If it wasn't about money, the koreans would've straight up withdrew. Instead, they went to the negotiating table and demanded airfare + hotel. But since their demands were not met, they pulled out. This showed that money could've swayed them. and they got airfare and hotel paid for as the post by NASL revealed. but still withdrew, so it seems that it really wasn't about airfare and hotel. They received $1000 prize money + $1000 travel stipend. The koreans wanted more than that. They also don't want to wake up and 4am then wait 2-3hrs to play a laggy game cross servers. What is your point? No one is forcing them to participate. The issue is that they agreed to and signed a contract stating that they will.
My point is that NASL is run so unprofessional that you don't need to give a crap about the damn contract. Happy?
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On August 17 2011 14:48 Kaneh wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2011 14:46 Slider954 wrote:On August 17 2011 14:40 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:31 whateverpeeps wrote:On August 17 2011 14:20 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:18 whateverpeeps wrote:On August 17 2011 14:17 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:15 L3gendary wrote:On August 17 2011 14:02 zeehar wrote:On August 17 2011 14:00 emythrel wrote:
Well if the koreans get the 5 star treatment, you would have to give everyone else the same treatment. GSL doesn't even pay for flights for people who want to compete unless its via the MLG partnership, and they expect things to be different for them? Bullshit.
What about the Europeans? Could you imagine them making demands like this? No. Its costs just as much to fly from Europe to compete. ...and that is why they're not choosing to compete this time, in the same way you guys justify the lack of foreigners in GSL by saying "there's not enough financial incentive" to invest in it. grow up. Yes but do foreigners make demands to the gsl about it? No. They dont sign contracts saying they will play and then back out at the last moment either. They simply dont go. does the GSL then make posts all over playXP about how the foreigners wronged them and are being babies like how NASL did on TL? Did NASL do that? Quote please. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253750or did you miss then entire community news thing. The whole post is just bashing on the korean/korean teams. EDIT:: to be more precise, the whole thing reads like an angry/raging joe average poster instead of the representative of a league annoucing news All I have to say buddy is that you are reading something into that post that really isn't there. I saw not one phrase of bashing. All I saw was, "This is what happened. We are disappointed." Disappointed is probably the closest you actually get to a negative emotion, and it simply refers to the face that they're not happy with how negotiations turned out. This article does more "bashing" and even it's not actually bashing. from the NASL post We are disappointed that the Korean Committee waited until the final hour, not only to make these demands but also to notify us of their withdrawal. We would like to apologize to our fans who wanted to see these players participate in the NASL and to the Korean players who hoped to participate. While we do respect the Committee’s decision, we wish it had been made in a more timely manner that did not interrupt the start of our season. straight up "son I'm dissapoint" from NASL. Not a single hard fact in that entire paragraph. The entire post was trying to drum up emotions instead of being factual news. This is the exact kinda stuff that makes NASL appear like a very amateur organization to me and a signifigant number of people. Please do your research, that is exactly what happened. The koreans played their qualifiers, before the S1 grand finals. Then even after they saw how they were "treated" they still went ahead and signed the contracts for S2. Then after that is when they brought up their concerns to NASL right before S2 was about to start, and then pulled out after 2 days of filming had already happened. That's pretty much the definition of waiting till the final hour. i agree. it is what happened. I'm making the point that NASL handled it very, very, very poorly and that the post is inflammatory and not professional.
Then why say that there was 'Not a single hard fact in that entire paragraph.' when it was actually factual. And I don't see anything that is inflammatory or not professional. Please highlight what parts you feel are inflammatory.
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On August 17 2011 14:54 Azzur wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2011 14:53 deerpark87 wrote:On August 17 2011 14:50 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:49 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:48 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:45 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:40 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:34 deerpark87 wrote:On August 17 2011 14:22 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:17 Kaneh wrote:
[quote]
does the GSL then make posts all over playXP about how the foreigners wronged them and are being babies like how NASL did on TL? GSL doesn't make posts because the foreigners did nothing wrong. If the koreans simply "chose not to participate" (e.g. boxer), that is totally fine and there will be no posts on TL. In fact, Boxer and NASL are on good terms. Wrong wrong wrong. GOMTV GAVE 5 star treatments to foreigners. Remember the 2011 GSL World Championship? All foreigner airplane tickets+ housing was cover by GOMTV http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2011_GSL_World_Championship. They were guarantee 2.7k as long as they play and win the preliminaries. Well guess what? Some foreigners didn't bother to show up for the preliminaries and gave walk over to those that did. Fact: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2011_GSL_World_Championship/PreliminariesGuess what GOMTV did? nothing. They didn't bash them like what NASL. So yes, foreigners do wrong too, just GOMTV have the don't bash them like what NASL do public. Anyways, what GOM does is a moot point (i.e. you may be right/wrong, but the discussion of what they did is not relevant to the current discussions). NASL bashed the koreans because the koreans violated a SIGNED contract enmasse. It wasn't just one korean, it was many. Could the NASL have organised the tournement better? Yes. Could their PR be better? Yes. But it still doesn't change the fact that the koreans pulled out because of MONEY and affected ALOT of people in the process. If GOM isn't relevant, then don't defend a guy when he brings up GOM. And this topic is about the korean response to NASL and how it actually isn't about money. That's the supposed 'fact' this interview sheds light on. It's much more about how NASL treated the players and how poorly it was organzied - so poorly that the majority of koreans took offense and withdrew. If it wasn't about money, the koreans would've straight up withdrew. Instead, they went to the negotiating table and demanded airfare + hotel. But since their demands were not met, they pulled out. This showed that money could've swayed them. and they got airfare and hotel paid for as the post by NASL revealed. but still withdrew, so it seems that it really wasn't about airfare and hotel. They received $1000 prize money + $1000 travel stipend. The koreans wanted more than that. They also don't want to wake up and 4am then wait 2-3hrs to play a laggy game cross servers. What is your point? No one is forcing them to participate. The issue is that they agreed to and signed a contract stating that they will.
and i think the reason for higher deposit is because of players not showing up in their schedule
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On August 17 2011 14:53 vertical101 wrote:
the only korean team who handle this professionaly is SlayerS they back out before the contract they keep communicating with NASL. funny this team is not in SC2con but act more professionaly than SC2con teams. seriously we need slayers_jessica as head of SC2con
Boxer is the model of conduct.
Speculation: This is why Slayers have sponsors - sponsors only want to negotiate with professional teams.
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On August 17 2011 14:57 deerpark87 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2011 14:54 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:53 deerpark87 wrote:On August 17 2011 14:50 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:49 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:48 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:45 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:40 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:34 deerpark87 wrote:On August 17 2011 14:22 Azzur wrote:
[quote]
GSL doesn't make posts because the foreigners did nothing wrong. If the koreans simply "chose not to participate" (e.g. boxer), that is totally fine and there will be no posts on TL. In fact, Boxer and NASL are on good terms. Wrong wrong wrong. GOMTV GAVE 5 star treatments to foreigners. Remember the 2011 GSL World Championship? All foreigner airplane tickets+ housing was cover by GOMTV http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2011_GSL_World_Championship. They were guarantee 2.7k as long as they play and win the preliminaries. Well guess what? Some foreigners didn't bother to show up for the preliminaries and gave walk over to those that did. Fact: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2011_GSL_World_Championship/PreliminariesGuess what GOMTV did? nothing. They didn't bash them like what NASL. So yes, foreigners do wrong too, just GOMTV have the don't bash them like what NASL do public. Anyways, what GOM does is a moot point (i.e. you may be right/wrong, but the discussion of what they did is not relevant to the current discussions). NASL bashed the koreans because the koreans violated a SIGNED contract enmasse. It wasn't just one korean, it was many. Could the NASL have organised the tournement better? Yes. Could their PR be better? Yes. But it still doesn't change the fact that the koreans pulled out because of MONEY and affected ALOT of people in the process. If GOM isn't relevant, then don't defend a guy when he brings up GOM. And this topic is about the korean response to NASL and how it actually isn't about money. That's the supposed 'fact' this interview sheds light on. It's much more about how NASL treated the players and how poorly it was organzied - so poorly that the majority of koreans took offense and withdrew. If it wasn't about money, the koreans would've straight up withdrew. Instead, they went to the negotiating table and demanded airfare + hotel. But since their demands were not met, they pulled out. This showed that money could've swayed them. and they got airfare and hotel paid for as the post by NASL revealed. but still withdrew, so it seems that it really wasn't about airfare and hotel. They received $1000 prize money + $1000 travel stipend. The koreans wanted more than that. They also don't want to wake up and 4am then wait 2-3hrs to play a laggy game cross servers. What is your point? No one is forcing them to participate. The issue is that they agreed to and signed a contract stating that they will. My point is that NASL is run so unprofessional that you don't need to give a crap about the damn contract. Happy?
Unfortunately that's not how the world works...
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On August 17 2011 14:57 deerpark87 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2011 14:54 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:53 deerpark87 wrote:On August 17 2011 14:50 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:49 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:48 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:45 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:40 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:34 deerpark87 wrote:On August 17 2011 14:22 Azzur wrote:
[quote]
GSL doesn't make posts because the foreigners did nothing wrong. If the koreans simply "chose not to participate" (e.g. boxer), that is totally fine and there will be no posts on TL. In fact, Boxer and NASL are on good terms. Wrong wrong wrong. GOMTV GAVE 5 star treatments to foreigners. Remember the 2011 GSL World Championship? All foreigner airplane tickets+ housing was cover by GOMTV http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2011_GSL_World_Championship. They were guarantee 2.7k as long as they play and win the preliminaries. Well guess what? Some foreigners didn't bother to show up for the preliminaries and gave walk over to those that did. Fact: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2011_GSL_World_Championship/PreliminariesGuess what GOMTV did? nothing. They didn't bash them like what NASL. So yes, foreigners do wrong too, just GOMTV have the don't bash them like what NASL do public. Anyways, what GOM does is a moot point (i.e. you may be right/wrong, but the discussion of what they did is not relevant to the current discussions). NASL bashed the koreans because the koreans violated a SIGNED contract enmasse. It wasn't just one korean, it was many. Could the NASL have organised the tournement better? Yes. Could their PR be better? Yes. But it still doesn't change the fact that the koreans pulled out because of MONEY and affected ALOT of people in the process. If GOM isn't relevant, then don't defend a guy when he brings up GOM. And this topic is about the korean response to NASL and how it actually isn't about money. That's the supposed 'fact' this interview sheds light on. It's much more about how NASL treated the players and how poorly it was organzied - so poorly that the majority of koreans took offense and withdrew. If it wasn't about money, the koreans would've straight up withdrew. Instead, they went to the negotiating table and demanded airfare + hotel. But since their demands were not met, they pulled out. This showed that money could've swayed them. and they got airfare and hotel paid for as the post by NASL revealed. but still withdrew, so it seems that it really wasn't about airfare and hotel. They received $1000 prize money + $1000 travel stipend. The koreans wanted more than that. They also don't want to wake up and 4am then wait 2-3hrs to play a laggy game cross servers. What is your point? No one is forcing them to participate. The issue is that they agreed to and signed a contract stating that they will. My point is that NASL is run so unprofessional that you don't need to give a crap about the damn contract. Happy?
Did NASL violate the contract? They could've done better but they fulfilled what they said they would do.
Your post "probably" sums up what the koreans are thinking. And that is unethical and wrong.
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On August 17 2011 14:58 Azzur wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2011 14:53 vertical101 wrote:
the only korean team who handle this professionaly is SlayerS they back out before the contract they keep communicating with NASL. funny this team is not in SC2con but act more professionaly than SC2con teams. seriously we need slayers_jessica as head of SC2con Boxer is the model of conduct. Speculation: This is why Slayers have sponsors - sponsors only want to negotiate with professional teams.
I can also speculate that reason why only MLG, IPL, and GOM has sponsors. Sponsor only wants to negotiate with professional leagues.
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United States214 Posts
On August 17 2011 14:57 deerpark87 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2011 14:54 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:53 deerpark87 wrote:On August 17 2011 14:50 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:49 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:48 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:45 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:40 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:34 deerpark87 wrote:On August 17 2011 14:22 Azzur wrote:
[quote]
GSL doesn't make posts because the foreigners did nothing wrong. If the koreans simply "chose not to participate" (e.g. boxer), that is totally fine and there will be no posts on TL. In fact, Boxer and NASL are on good terms. Wrong wrong wrong. GOMTV GAVE 5 star treatments to foreigners. Remember the 2011 GSL World Championship? All foreigner airplane tickets+ housing was cover by GOMTV http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2011_GSL_World_Championship. They were guarantee 2.7k as long as they play and win the preliminaries. Well guess what? Some foreigners didn't bother to show up for the preliminaries and gave walk over to those that did. Fact: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2011_GSL_World_Championship/PreliminariesGuess what GOMTV did? nothing. They didn't bash them like what NASL. So yes, foreigners do wrong too, just GOMTV have the don't bash them like what NASL do public. Anyways, what GOM does is a moot point (i.e. you may be right/wrong, but the discussion of what they did is not relevant to the current discussions). NASL bashed the koreans because the koreans violated a SIGNED contract enmasse. It wasn't just one korean, it was many. Could the NASL have organised the tournement better? Yes. Could their PR be better? Yes. But it still doesn't change the fact that the koreans pulled out because of MONEY and affected ALOT of people in the process. If GOM isn't relevant, then don't defend a guy when he brings up GOM. And this topic is about the korean response to NASL and how it actually isn't about money. That's the supposed 'fact' this interview sheds light on. It's much more about how NASL treated the players and how poorly it was organzied - so poorly that the majority of koreans took offense and withdrew. If it wasn't about money, the koreans would've straight up withdrew. Instead, they went to the negotiating table and demanded airfare + hotel. But since their demands were not met, they pulled out. This showed that money could've swayed them. and they got airfare and hotel paid for as the post by NASL revealed. but still withdrew, so it seems that it really wasn't about airfare and hotel. They received $1000 prize money + $1000 travel stipend. The koreans wanted more than that. They also don't want to wake up and 4am then wait 2-3hrs to play a laggy game cross servers. What is your point? No one is forcing them to participate. The issue is that they agreed to and signed a contract stating that they will. My point is that NASL is run so unprofessional that you don't need to give a crap about the damn contract. Happy?
Breaching contracts, bringing up negotiations and then hiding behind 2nd and 3rd parities is totally professional. Businesses and sponsors love that. That's why Korean teams are doing well and don't need NASL...
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Okay, I know a lot of you are losing respect for the korean teams.. but at the end of the day, they're the best starcraft 2 players, and they're the ones everyone wants to watch. That being said, the simple fact is.. NASL will not make as much money/fewer people will actually watch the stream now that koreans are no longer participating in their league.
NASL should listen to this, and fix their league accordingly, instead of blaming everything on the koreans. You wanna make money NASL? Get the koreans back into your league, because now that koreans aren't even participating, I know for damn certain i'm not going to be watching NASL this season.
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United States214 Posts
On August 17 2011 15:01 deerpark87 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2011 14:58 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:53 vertical101 wrote:
the only korean team who handle this professionaly is SlayerS they back out before the contract they keep communicating with NASL. funny this team is not in SC2con but act more professionaly than SC2con teams. seriously we need slayers_jessica as head of SC2con Boxer is the model of conduct. Speculation: This is why Slayers have sponsors - sponsors only want to negotiate with professional teams. I can also speculate that reason why only MLG, IPL, and GOM has sponsors. Sponsor only wants to negotiate with professional leagues.
NASL has sponsors and nothing they did in this matter was unprofessional, except perhaps releasing receipts to prove the TIG guy wrong about deposits, and that's only because they don't have to stoop to that level, their word should have been enough and they're giving into the public too much.
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He doesn't make sense in the article. First he says he doesn't understand the basis for having a security deposit and then he says koreans had problems with their opponents not showing up on time for their matches.
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On August 17 2011 15:01 deerpark87 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2011 14:58 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:53 vertical101 wrote:
the only korean team who handle this professionaly is SlayerS they back out before the contract they keep communicating with NASL. funny this team is not in SC2con but act more professionaly than SC2con teams. seriously we need slayers_jessica as head of SC2con Boxer is the model of conduct. Speculation: This is why Slayers have sponsors - sponsors only want to negotiate with professional teams. I can also speculate that reason why only MLG, IPL, and GOM has sponsors. Sponsor only wants to negotiate with professional leagues.
I'm not saying that the NASL is professional/unprofessional - I'm not defending them in the way they run the tournament. I'm also saying that they have much to improve.
The crux of my argument is that the korean teams that violated the contracts are unprofessional. And they are doing so because they feel that by negotiating collectively, they can get a better deal.
And I point out that Slayers is a professional team.
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On August 17 2011 14:58 Azzur wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2011 14:53 vertical101 wrote:
the only korean team who handle this professionaly is SlayerS they back out before the contract they keep communicating with NASL. funny this team is not in SC2con but act more professionaly than SC2con teams. seriously we need slayers_jessica as head of SC2con Boxer is the model of conduct. Speculation: This is why Slayers have sponsors - sponsors only want to negotiate with professional teams.
i think this korean teams plan this before contract and make a drama. NASL trying to communicate with these teams for the past few months but they are no where to be found. only person they talk to is Mr.chae who is not part of this any team or SC2con
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It sounds like the Korean players found the event produced poorly and overall pretty amateurish. I can understand not wanting to pay a steep security deposit for a league that hasn't indicated it has any staying power.
It doesn't sound as much like a list of demands, but rather that the Korean teams are saying, "hey, just run this thing well and treat the players like MLG and GSL treat their players, and we will come play". Yet people are acting like they are demanding for something more than that. What are they demanding more of than what MLG offers? Not coincidentally, there seems to be a fantastic relationship between the MLG and the Korean teams.
I've also seen several people say "the prize $ should be enough to come" but also say "you need the security deposit to ensure that players will show up for games". Can't you see the disconnect there? If the prize money is enough than there is no need for a security deposit.
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United States214 Posts
On August 17 2011 15:04 vertical101 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2011 14:58 Azzur wrote:On August 17 2011 14:53 vertical101 wrote:
the only korean team who handle this professionaly is SlayerS they back out before the contract they keep communicating with NASL. funny this team is not in SC2con but act more professionaly than SC2con teams. seriously we need slayers_jessica as head of SC2con Boxer is the model of conduct. Speculation: This is why Slayers have sponsors - sponsors only want to negotiate with professional teams. i think this korean teams plan this before contract and make a drama. NASL trying to communicate with these teams for the past few months but they are no where to be found. only Mr.chae who is not part of this any team or SC2con
Standard Korean business tactic of "hide the leader." Which is a cultural difference, yes, but it's such a backwards one that it really will affect how international companies do business with them if they don't change it.
NASL has some things to learn from this, but Korean team managements have even more.
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On August 17 2011 14:57 Slider954 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2011 14:48 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:46 Slider954 wrote:On August 17 2011 14:40 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:31 whateverpeeps wrote:On August 17 2011 14:20 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:18 whateverpeeps wrote:On August 17 2011 14:17 Kaneh wrote:On August 17 2011 14:15 L3gendary wrote:On August 17 2011 14:02 zeehar wrote:
[quote]
...and that is why they're not choosing to compete this time, in the same way you guys justify the lack of foreigners in GSL by saying "there's not enough financial incentive" to invest in it.
grow up. Yes but do foreigners make demands to the gsl about it? No. They dont sign contracts saying they will play and then back out at the last moment either. They simply dont go. does the GSL then make posts all over playXP about how the foreigners wronged them and are being babies like how NASL did on TL? Did NASL do that? Quote please. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253750or did you miss then entire community news thing. The whole post is just bashing on the korean/korean teams. EDIT:: to be more precise, the whole thing reads like an angry/raging joe average poster instead of the representative of a league annoucing news All I have to say buddy is that you are reading something into that post that really isn't there. I saw not one phrase of bashing. All I saw was, "This is what happened. We are disappointed." Disappointed is probably the closest you actually get to a negative emotion, and it simply refers to the face that they're not happy with how negotiations turned out. This article does more "bashing" and even it's not actually bashing. from the NASL post We are disappointed that the Korean Committee waited until the final hour, not only to make these demands but also to notify us of their withdrawal. We would like to apologize to our fans who wanted to see these players participate in the NASL and to the Korean players who hoped to participate. While we do respect the Committee’s decision, we wish it had been made in a more timely manner that did not interrupt the start of our season. straight up "son I'm dissapoint" from NASL. Not a single hard fact in that entire paragraph. The entire post was trying to drum up emotions instead of being factual news. This is the exact kinda stuff that makes NASL appear like a very amateur organization to me and a signifigant number of people. Please do your research, that is exactly what happened. The koreans played their qualifiers, before the S1 grand finals. Then even after they saw how they were "treated" they still went ahead and signed the contracts for S2. Then after that is when they brought up their concerns to NASL right before S2 was about to start, and then pulled out after 2 days of filming had already happened. That's pretty much the definition of waiting till the final hour. i agree. it is what happened. I'm making the point that NASL handled it very, very, very poorly and that the post is inflammatory and not professional. Then why say that there was 'Not a single hard fact in that entire paragraph.' when it was actually factual. And I don't see anything that is inflammatory or not professional. Please highlight what parts you feel are inflammatory.
well, that's your opinion, and this is my opinion. and a significant number of people (including the koreans) agree with me, enough for that post to be an issue. I can't convince you the post is inflammatory, but you can see from the responses from me, other people in this and the other thread, and the koreans, that the post generated ill-will.
the results speak for themselves
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On August 17 2011 13:06 QurtStarcraft wrote:
Why again should NASL pay for everything? I really think they are asking way too much and why don't Koreans complain about every other tournament?
Pretty much every other tournament simply invites them and pay for their flights. While other players and even casters pay their own way. They're spoiled now.
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On August 17 2011 15:02 shizzycs wrote:
Okay, I know a lot of you are losing respect for the korean teams.. but at the end of the day, they're the best starcraft 2 players, and they're the ones everyone wants to watch. That being said, the simple fact is.. NASL will not make as much money/fewer people will actually watch the stream now that koreans are no longer participating in their league.
NASL should listen to this, and fix their league accordingly, instead of blaming everything on the koreans. You wanna make money NASL? Get the koreans back into your league, because now that koreans aren't even participating, I know for damn certain i'm not going to be watching NASL this season.
So what, NASL should bend over backwards and do whatever the koreans want just to get them back in? If they did that, I for one wouldn't watch NASL anymore because I wouldn't respect a league that caves in to a certain select grp even if they are the best. It cheapens the integrity of the whole league if there are players getting special treatment.
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On August 17 2011 15:03 Eko200 wrote:
He doesn't make sense in the article. First he says he doesn't understand the basis for having a security deposit and then he says koreans had problems with their opponents not showing up on time for their matches.
The problem is that they had to wait for the other player.
"When the opponent was not on time, [players] had to wait for more than two hours many times," he explained, "This is why the players were stressed. They did not want to show low performances compared to their usual play. In days where GSL or GSTL followed right after, players couldn’t show their full ability due to not feeling well and exhaustion."
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On August 17 2011 15:07 Slider954 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 17 2011 15:02 shizzycs wrote:
Okay, I know a lot of you are losing respect for the korean teams.. but at the end of the day, they're the best starcraft 2 players, and they're the ones everyone wants to watch. That being said, the simple fact is.. NASL will not make as much money/fewer people will actually watch the stream now that koreans are no longer participating in their league.
NASL should listen to this, and fix their league accordingly, instead of blaming everything on the koreans. You wanna make money NASL? Get the koreans back into your league, because now that koreans aren't even participating, I know for damn certain i'm not going to be watching NASL this season. So what, NASL should bend over backwards and do whatever the koreans want just to get them back in? If they did that, I for one wouldn't watch NASL anymore because I wouldn't respect a league that caves in to a certain select grp even if they are the best. It cheapens the integrity of the whole league if there are players getting special treatment.
Why are you acting like the Koreans are making crazy demands? There is a great relationship between the GSL and MLG. It sounds like the Korean teams are asking NASL to treat them like the MLG treats them - which is footing the travel bill, and not being run in such an amateurish way. It cheapens the integrity of a league when they treat their players like that.
They are just asking for travel to be paid for (to the Grand Finals, which every other tournament does), and for the league to be run with an element of professionalism. Have you heard the Koreans complain about MLG or Dreamhack in this way? Those tournaments are run much better.
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EPT
