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Designated Balance Discussion Thread - Page 602

Forum Index > SC2 General
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TheDwf
Profile Joined November 2011
France19747 Posts
July 26 2013 12:20 GMT
#12021
On July 26 2013 21:08 Ammanas wrote:
What do you guys think would happen, balance wise, if next patch would contain this:

-Worker (SCV, Drone, Probe) supply cost now 0.5 down from 1.

Zerg wins next 10 Code S.
Mehukannu
Profile Joined October 2010
Finland421 Posts
July 26 2013 12:23 GMT
#12022
On July 26 2013 21:08 Ammanas wrote:
What do you guys think would happen, balance wise, if next patch would contain this:

-Worker (SCV, Drone, Probe) supply cost now 0.5 down from 1.

Zerg players would have a broken ''D'' button in their keyboard.
Seriously, zergs would be taking the expansions like crazy.
C=('. ' Q)
Orek
Profile Joined February 2012
1665 Posts
July 26 2013 12:32 GMT
#12023
On July 26 2013 21:08 Ammanas wrote:
What do you guys think would happen, balance wise, if next patch would contain this:

-Worker (SCV, Drone, Probe) supply cost now 0.5 down from 1.

3 pool OP
GreenGringo
Profile Joined July 2013
349 Posts
July 26 2013 12:41 GMT
#12024
Three pages of this thread devoted to discussing whether Terran is the most vulnerable race with respect to production facilities being harassed. Because presumably taking down 8 tech add-ons with zealots or zerglings is easier than marauders sniping a spire or a templar archives.

You know the Terrans are clutching at straws when they resort to arguments like these.
Big J
Profile Joined March 2011
Austria16289 Posts
July 26 2013 12:43 GMT
#12025
On July 26 2013 21:41 GreenGringo wrote:
Three pages of this thread devoted to discussing whether Terran is the most vulnerable race with respect to production facilities being harassed. Because presumably taking down 8 tech add-ons with zealots or zerglings is easier than marauders sniping a spire or a templar archives.

You know the Terrans are clutching at straws when they resort to arguments like these.

could you please let stupid arguments die instead of fielding more stupid arguments against them. just for once...
Pirfiktshon
Profile Joined June 2013
United States1072 Posts
July 26 2013 12:55 GMT
#12026
I'm a terran player since bw and have never changed I Agree with the 2 zerg players above that is an argument of stupidity on another level.....
klup
Profile Joined May 2013
France612 Posts
July 26 2013 13:14 GMT
#12027
i agree to agree with the terran above that this is an argument of stupidity on another level between the 2 zergs
Pirfiktshon
Profile Joined June 2013
United States1072 Posts
July 26 2013 13:23 GMT
#12028
I will say after last night me playing TvZ 3 games against Low masters and completely destroying them with 2 base widow mine play into 4 base Raven MMMM I have to start siding with zergs . Widow mines are giving me the option to Punish 3 base play to the point where 90% of the time I can win the game on micro alone with 2 bases right there and then..... IMHO Zerg should be able to hold 2 base play with a 10 min push with 3 bases with good defense but even with defense it seems like i steam roll them regardless .

Here is my proposal that mines stay the same but the production can only happen with a techlab as oppose to being able to make 2 at a time.... the production speed of widow mines seems to play a HUGE roll in this attack seeing how I can pretty much without let up attack zerg and drop his main and push creep all at the same time giving me at the very least a game winning advantage in the late game.... I honestly don't see how a zerg can beat this strategy So i'd like to put it up to someone who is Masters / GM that has played against this strat as zerg and won and how they did so.....
TheDwf
Profile Joined November 2011
France19747 Posts
July 26 2013 13:25 GMT
#12029
On July 26 2013 22:23 Pirfiktshon wrote:
I will say after last night me playing TvZ 3 games against Low masters and completely destroying them with 2 base widow mine play into 4 base Raven MMMM I have to start siding with zergs . Widow mines are giving me the option to Punish 3 base play to the point where 90% of the time I can win the game on micro alone with 2 bases right there and then..... IMHO Zerg should be able to hold 2 base play with a 10 min push with 3 bases with good defense but even with defense it seems like i steam roll them regardless .

Here is my proposal that mines stay the same but the production can only happen with a techlab as oppose to being able to make 2 at a time.... the production speed of widow mines seems to play a HUGE roll in this attack seeing how I can pretty much without let up attack zerg and drop his main and push creep all at the same time giving me at the very least a game winning advantage in the late game.... I honestly don't see how a zerg can beat this strategy So i'd like to put it up to someone who is Masters / GM that has played against this strat as zerg and won and how they did so.....

If your Zerg opponents are dying to simple 2-bases timings they're 100% doing something terribly wrong.
Pirfiktshon
Profile Joined June 2013
United States1072 Posts
July 26 2013 13:30 GMT
#12030
Actually adding to my last post I have also vsed 2 base play with this strategy and the way I can micro and how i scout I usually can scout 2 base muta or 2 base roaches either way I completely destroy these strategies with ease..... I just don't get how zerg is suppose to survive this 10 minute push or get an even or equal playing field footing.....
eXdeath
Profile Joined August 2011
France66 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-26 13:33:09
July 26 2013 13:31 GMT
#12031
I really think Zerg's harass options should be buffed via nydus and not drops. Nydus worm is a mechanic that is very unique and feels very "zergy". Plus, it could act the same way as drop with some tweaking.
They might consider making Nydus strats more viable and less "all in". They could buff the mechanic while also limit it, for example, making it only available from overseers. This way T and P should look for overseers getting closer to their bases, that would be a sign of harass danger just like when spotting a medivac or warp prism.
Pirfiktshon
Profile Joined June 2013
United States1072 Posts
July 26 2013 13:31 GMT
#12032
So Dwf what do you think they do wrong? Or have you beaten this strategy playing zerg? If so describe how.....
Pirfiktshon
Profile Joined June 2013
United States1072 Posts
July 26 2013 13:36 GMT
#12033
Flash has also used this strategy in MLG with very very very GOOOD results btw
ETisME
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
12896 Posts
July 26 2013 13:39 GMT
#12034
On July 26 2013 22:25 TheDwf wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2013 22:23 Pirfiktshon wrote:
I will say after last night me playing TvZ 3 games against Low masters and completely destroying them with 2 base widow mine play into 4 base Raven MMMM I have to start siding with zergs . Widow mines are giving me the option to Punish 3 base play to the point where 90% of the time I can win the game on micro alone with 2 bases right there and then..... IMHO Zerg should be able to hold 2 base play with a 10 min push with 3 bases with good defense but even with defense it seems like i steam roll them regardless .

Here is my proposal that mines stay the same but the production can only happen with a techlab as oppose to being able to make 2 at a time.... the production speed of widow mines seems to play a HUGE roll in this attack seeing how I can pretty much without let up attack zerg and drop his main and push creep all at the same time giving me at the very least a game winning advantage in the late game.... I honestly don't see how a zerg can beat this strategy So i'd like to put it up to someone who is Masters / GM that has played against this strat as zerg and won and how they did so.....

If your Zerg opponents are dying to simple 2-bases timings they're 100% doing something terribly wrong.

didn't stephano fall against Mvp to his 2 base marauder hellbat?
Ryung used to do the same build without going all in and had tonnes of damage done as well (GSTL)
其疾如风,其徐如林,侵掠如火,不动如山,难知如阴,动如雷震。
H0i
Profile Joined October 2010
Netherlands484 Posts
July 26 2013 13:42 GMT
#12035
On July 26 2013 18:43 MTAC wrote:
Imo. Buff roaches, and buff tanks could lead to much more cool things in TvZ. CC first into 3CC double ebay should be a reactionnary play, or a really greedy one. Not the go-to. A few roaches in a Z comp is already good. (Different speeds give natural spread against splash), and more roaches/less lings give more unit attacking at a time. And btw, if the T is spread, even 10 Marines/marauders don't kill a lonely roach before the mine is launched.

For toss, everything that could be shield-bases and therefore harrassement-bases could be great and diversify toss play/techpaths (mix of GWsky comp, better stalkers etc...).


If roaches get buffed, PvZ is insta-gg.
TheDwf
Profile Joined November 2011
France19747 Posts
July 26 2013 13:53 GMT
#12036
On July 26 2013 22:31 Pirfiktshon wrote:
So Dwf what do you think they do wrong? Or have you beaten this strategy playing zerg? If so describe how.....

Well, are they scouting your timing in the first place? Are they stopping drones at the correct timing so they have enough units to hold your attack?

On July 26 2013 22:39 ETisME wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2013 22:25 TheDwf wrote:
On July 26 2013 22:23 Pirfiktshon wrote:
I will say after last night me playing TvZ 3 games against Low masters and completely destroying them with 2 base widow mine play into 4 base Raven MMMM I have to start siding with zergs . Widow mines are giving me the option to Punish 3 base play to the point where 90% of the time I can win the game on micro alone with 2 bases right there and then..... IMHO Zerg should be able to hold 2 base play with a 10 min push with 3 bases with good defense but even with defense it seems like i steam roll them regardless .

Here is my proposal that mines stay the same but the production can only happen with a techlab as oppose to being able to make 2 at a time.... the production speed of widow mines seems to play a HUGE roll in this attack seeing how I can pretty much without let up attack zerg and drop his main and push creep all at the same time giving me at the very least a game winning advantage in the late game.... I honestly don't see how a zerg can beat this strategy So i'd like to put it up to someone who is Masters / GM that has played against this strat as zerg and won and how they did so.....

If your Zerg opponents are dying to simple 2-bases timings they're 100% doing something terribly wrong.

didn't stephano fall against Mvp to his 2 base marauder hellbat?
Ryung used to do the same build without going all in and had tonnes of damage done as well (GSTL)

Marauder/Hellbat was much stronger than the standard Marines/Hellions/Medivac timing, but it was patched anyway.
Qikz
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United Kingdom12067 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-26 13:57:23
July 26 2013 13:56 GMT
#12037
On July 26 2013 22:42 H0i wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2013 18:43 MTAC wrote:
Imo. Buff roaches, and buff tanks could lead to much more cool things in TvZ. CC first into 3CC double ebay should be a reactionnary play, or a really greedy one. Not the go-to. A few roaches in a Z comp is already good. (Different speeds give natural spread against splash), and more roaches/less lings give more unit attacking at a time. And btw, if the T is spread, even 10 Marines/marauders don't kill a lonely roach before the mine is launched.

For toss, everything that could be shield-bases and therefore harrassement-bases could be great and diversify toss play/techpaths (mix of GWsky comp, better stalkers etc...).


If roaches get buffed, PvZ is insta-gg.


I personally think they should swap hydras and roaches around, make hydras the teir 1 unit and make roaches the teir 2 with a slight damage increase or something. Then again roaches are still really good already.
FanTaSy's #1 Fan | STPL Caster/Organiser | SKT BEST KT | https://twitch.tv/stpl
Pirfiktshon
Profile Joined June 2013
United States1072 Posts
July 26 2013 14:02 GMT
#12038
@Dwf yes they do the 7 minute ovi but because I have enough marines and with good placement I try not to reveal as much as possible So rarely do they get a scout on it usually when I'm moving across the field is when they get a notice that i'm attacking MOST of the time and even if they do I put them in a position where I'm constantly producing and dont let up my assualt and drops even when expanding and increasing my production... Which means they have to keep producing units and they can't produce drones which means they either drone up and die or I eventualy get ahead with production and they die......
Pirfiktshon
Profile Joined June 2013
United States1072 Posts
July 26 2013 14:03 GMT
#12039
Look as I said I'm a Terran and on ladder I know if i'm vsing a zerg I go cc first with a good block to protect from a 6 pool and I scout for 7 roach rush if not its smooth sailing to victory that game
GreenGringo
Profile Joined July 2013
349 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-26 14:13:19
July 26 2013 14:10 GMT
#12040
On July 26 2013 21:43 Big J wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2013 21:41 GreenGringo wrote:
Three pages of this thread devoted to discussing whether Terran is the most vulnerable race with respect to production facilities being harassed. Because presumably taking down 8 tech add-ons with zealots or zerglings is easier than marauders sniping a spire or a templar archives.

You know the Terrans are clutching at straws when they resort to arguments like these.

could you please let stupid arguments die instead of fielding more stupid arguments against them. just for once...
The difference is that my argument wasn't stupid. Taking down 8 tech add-ons with zealots or zerglings is exactly what's required of the idea that Terran is especially vulnerable in its production facilities.

What you mean is could I please let stupid arguments die instead of fielding yet more rebuttals. The answer is no. It had already been carried on for three pages and showed no signs of dying. If two or three people in this thread are going to try and square a circle like maniacs, they can expect someone to call them on it.
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