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Deadlock Ridge Imbalance

Forum Index > SC2 General
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beyond.wudge
Profile Joined December 2007
Australia58 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-26 03:29:15
July 26 2011 03:26 GMT
#1
[image loading]

The 4 o'clock gold base can be siege from the main whilst only the vespene can be sieged on the 10 o'clock.

[image loading]

[image loading]

This lets a terran who has just cleared out the main with tanks to then take out the 4 o'clock gold easily, without the travel time or issue of pushing through a controlled xelnaga.

[image loading]

[image loading]

Similarly, the 5 o'clock gold's mineral line can be sieged from the nearby main (1 patch and the geyser) whilst the 11 o'clock gold can only have a single geyser hit.

Sure, these are not map breaking imbalances but given most of my 4v4s go onto 3-4 bases a player with full 200 supply armies, its quite likely to matter for some games.

These issues are also easily fixed.

TLDR;

Effectively the bottom right golds can be sieged from the nearest mains but the top-left ones barely at all. This effectively makes one set of golds weaker than the other. With the connections between the two sides being unequal this means that one side will have (significantly) more vulnerable late-game expansions.

There seems to be little reason for this (i.e. the connectors being also asymmetrical making the two sides different by design).
XiGua
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Sweden3085 Posts
July 26 2011 03:28 GMT
#2
I don't think that they really put very much thought into the 4v4-maps. There is no reason why the map would be asymmetrical.
ლ(ಠ益ಠლ) APM, Why u make me spam?
zerglingsfolife
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States1694 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-26 03:30:24
July 26 2011 03:29 GMT
#3
Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death. I shall take no wife, hold no lands, father no children. I shall wear no crown and win no glory. I shall live and die at my post. I am the sword in the darkness.
beyond.wudge
Profile Joined December 2007
Australia58 Posts
July 26 2011 05:36 GMT
#4
How is that link relevant?
Jtn
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
444 Posts
July 26 2011 05:37 GMT
#5
I've always wondered how Blizzard manages to miss these things. It's always something to do with seige tanks and/or bunker placements anyway, I don't think it's that hard to find these things out.
Baeras
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States140 Posts
July 26 2011 05:41 GMT
#6
blizzard helps terran stay op

it probably will be fixed next season.... that part wasnt sarcasm sadly
Bet on it!
All.In
Profile Joined August 2010
United States214 Posts
July 26 2011 05:55 GMT
#7
It will be fixed I'm sure. Keep in mind most BW maps had these issues also and were fixed slowly but surely till they were deemed "balanced". This is part of the game and will get better with time. I'm glad to see faster seasons and the addition of new maps frequently now. This will keep the game from becoming stale. Perfection is achieved through trial and error it just doesn't randomly happen.
It is what it is
neobowman
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Canada3324 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-26 05:57:31
July 26 2011 05:56 GMT
#8
On July 26 2011 14:55 Odyssey wrote:
It will be fixed I'm sure. Keep in mind most BW maps had these issues also and were fixed slowly but surely till they were deemed "balanced". This is part of the game and will get better with time. I'm glad to see faster seasons and the addition of new maps frequently now. This will keep the game from becoming stale. Perfection is achieved through trial and error it just doesn't randomly happen.

Well why does Blizzard make these maps with clear flaws when they can do much better and just use mirroring.
KimJongChill
Profile Joined January 2011
United States6429 Posts
July 26 2011 05:57 GMT
#9
What game format is this map for? If it's not for 1v1, then I doubt it will garner much attention from TL.
MMA: U realise MMA: Most of my army EgIdra: fuck off MMA: Killed my orbital MMA: LOL MMA: just saying MMA: u werent loss
beyond.wudge
Profile Joined December 2007
Australia58 Posts
July 26 2011 07:20 GMT
#10
Yes, I'm surprised they don't use a mirroring function and then go about adding the asymmetrical touches.

Ofcourse, maybe they do and just don't worry about these things... ^^
Deleted User 101379
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
4849 Posts
July 26 2011 07:28 GMT
#11
In any real game it won't make a difference. Those expansions can only be sieged if 2 players lost their main base already as the other side won't ever take that base unless they have a huge advantage already (so practically game over anyways).

Nice find, should be fixed just for completeness sake, but it still doesn't matter.
JoeSchmoe
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada2058 Posts
July 26 2011 07:29 GMT
#12
On July 26 2011 14:41 Baeras wrote:
blizzard helps terran stay op

it probably will be fixed next season.... that part wasnt sarcasm sadly


read the post or don't comment and whine for that matter. the issue is related to the symmetric imbalance of the map.
PhiliBiRD
Profile Joined November 2009
United States2643 Posts
July 26 2011 07:30 GMT
#13
oh its a 4v4 map. lol

sucks for 4v4 players
beyond.wudge
Profile Joined December 2007
Australia58 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-26 07:43:37
July 26 2011 07:41 GMT
#14
Well, there are still a lot of refugee plays in 4s Morfildur

And I agree, its not the hugest deal but when a base trade happens in a GSL game it does come down to the third, fourth and fifth bases and whether a player can rebuild.

When you can lose your gold to an army that just sacked your main so effortlessly, with no option to return the favour, it will lose you base trades that you could have held, rebuilt and gotten on an even footing in.

madstarcraft
Profile Joined May 2011
United States103 Posts
July 26 2011 08:09 GMT
#15
i can't really thing of a reason for blizzard to do this, seems unlikely that something like this would just slip by blizzard
Terran is OP deal with it!
Caliber
Profile Joined August 2010
United States598 Posts
July 26 2011 08:11 GMT
#16
almost all blizzard maps have some sort of imbalance. its a shame they just dont use mlg/gsl maps.

or at least put more effort into creating them
Nerski
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States1095 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-26 08:46:06
July 26 2011 08:45 GMT
#17
On July 26 2011 12:28 XiGua wrote:
I don't think that they really put very much thought into the 4v4-maps. There is no reason why the map would be asymmetrical.


Fixed for laughs because blizzards map makers never cease to amaze me on the things they can mess up...I'd hate to say it but can anyone in the community say blizzard makes great maps with a straight face?

I do think that they really put a lot of thought into the 4v4-maps. There is no reason why the map would be asymmetrical.
Twitter: @GoForNerski /// Youtube: Youtube.com/nerskisc
Chargelot
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
2275 Posts
July 26 2011 09:12 GMT
#18
On July 26 2011 17:45 Nerski wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2011 12:28 XiGua wrote:
I don't think that they really put very much thought into the 4v4-maps. There is no reason why the map would be asymmetrical.


Fixed for laughs because blizzards map makers never cease to amaze me on the things they can mess up...I'd hate to say it but can anyone in the community say blizzard makes great maps with a straight face?

I do think that they really put a lot of thought into the 4v4-maps. There is no reason why the map would be asymmetrical.


Most Blizzard maps aren't copy/paste from one half to the other. Most of them have little differences like this. I don't think Blizzard cares about this tiny little "imbalance". 4v4 is a just-for-fun game style, at least in their eyes, and therefore we should be making motherships, not discussing balance.

The answer is always make more motherships.
if (post == "stupid") { document.getElementById('post').style.display = 'none'; }
iamahydralisk
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States813 Posts
July 26 2011 09:19 GMT
#19
A lot of 3v3 and 4v4 maps have stupid design choices, but Blizzard probably doesn't give a damn because 3v3 and 4v4 aren't really competitive game modes.
"well if youre looking for long term, go safe, if you expect it to end either way, go risky. wow. just like sc2" - friend of mine when I asked him which girl to pick
beyond.wudge
Profile Joined December 2007
Australia58 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-26 11:39:27
July 26 2011 11:39 GMT
#20
Yeah, it looks like an interesting map. There is a lot of room in the middle so whilst it sort of is a straight fight, it actually is easy enough to dance around.
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