|
Hello, im SMMN(commonly known as pal.387) and im master league protoss player. I find difficult to find practice partners even with usage of TLpickup (rarely anyone want to play) practice partner thread (good one but still it is very slow). So i came up with idea which is called
Practice Zone International Project (PZIP)
General idea is to whenever you're online joining channel PZ on battlenet EU (possibly other servers if there is some community interested) and hang out there. If idea got picked-up, I hope many master/GM players that are interested in practice, game analyssis, obs analyssis of fellows game etc. will join this channel.
So, if you're interested by the idea(many people from Practice partner thread said that I should make thread on TL about it because its nice idea) then please join channel "PZ" and spread the word amongst other players.
If this idea will get big, then lower level leaguers (Bronze-midDiamond) can find practice at channel "PZ2" Now everyone is sitting on "PZ" channel
IRC channel is now up! please join channel "#PZ" for irc ! 
Credit for Masayume for making this awesome channel on irc!
Known personas that support the idea:
*EGLzGaMeR
*Empire.Nerchio
*Tefel
*Empirehobot
*aTnDarKFoRcE
@TO MODS@
If you can please rename topic to Practice Zone International
|
Very cool idea, it is a much quicker and easier way to find good partners, as well as it can be a good way to obs some GM and master games if players allow for it.
|
I think its a really good idea and i think it's going to be a big thing
|
Sounds like a good idea, kind of like TLKOTH in NA, I'll hop in here when I'm on EU next time. Its always nice to just sit back and watch better players do all the work, very educational/entertaining. When everyone can watch reps together I see channels like this getting more popular.
|
great idea, hope this gets popular. As users are very needed for this to work =)
|
This sounds really awesome, alrdy joined the channel! Hope we can get this running on a really high and active level!
|
You can never have enough practice partners!! Sounds awsome, I'll hang out in this channel anytime I'm online
|
sounds like a good idea to me! im here~
|
Nice idea, I'll hang out in the channel whenever I'm online.
|
Thank you everyone for support!
|
A small suggestion for improvement:
I think a nice idea for observers (who are made referee) would be to pause the game at certain stages and then ask both players what they think their opponent has as a number of units, bases, what his plan is and such. Type it out and you can see in the replay how accurate you really are as a player, because your perception of yourself and the opponent can make you gg prematurely (like IdrA shows regularly I think).
Such simple training techniques can be applied even by low level players watching a high level game, just ask if it is ok to do it before the game starts. Maybe there are other "simple questions" which could always be asked as well ...
|
Great idea! will definitvely join whenever I need someone to practice with.
|
On June 08 2011 01:03 Rabiator wrote:
A small suggestion for improvement:
I think a nice idea for observers (who are made referee) would be to pause the game at certain stages and then ask both players what they think their opponent has as a number of units, bases, what his plan is and such. Type it out and you can see in the replay how accurate you really are as a player, because your perception of yourself and the opponent can make you gg prematurely (like IdrA shows regularly I think).
Such simple training techniques can be applied even by low level players watching a high level game, just ask if it is ok to do it before the game starts. Maybe there are other "simple questions" which could always be asked as well ...
Thanks for feedback, but I think its unnecesary. We have replays to do so and interrupting the game is just bad.
You watched too much day9 surely!  But any ideas are welcome, again thanks for feedback
|
nice idea, hope there will be many ppl in that channel!
|
This is a good idea, the teamliquid channel doesn't always cut it so this is a nice add-on
|
Great idea! I really hope it works cuz I can't find anyone to practice with also. Looking forward to play some games and learn from better players . gl
|
The IRC channel wont be permanent for now. Once there is a decent stream of people, I can actually make sure that the IRC channel has Moderators 24/7. Right now it cannot be guaranteed. Just get more people streaming in and we will see what we can do  .
Awesome channel btw, looking good so far.
|
I may be a plat but I can tell this is a great idea and a much needed system/channel. I hope it works out.
|
Thanks everyone! Tell your friends!
|
I don't mind the whole "spamming people on bnet"-thingy because I like this initiative and will join the channel.
I don't play a lot but used to be pretty damn good so whenever I ladder my MMR is way off - it's usually matching me against player who are a lot better than me and getting it right takes a lot of time.
|
On June 08 2011 01:03 Rabiator wrote:
A small suggestion for improvement:
I think a nice idea for observers (who are made referee) would be to pause the game at certain stages and then ask both players what they think their opponent has as a number of units, bases, what his plan is and such. Type it out and you can see in the replay how accurate you really are as a player, because your perception of yourself and the opponent can make you gg prematurely (like IdrA shows regularly I think).
Such simple training techniques can be applied even by low level players watching a high level game, just ask if it is ok to do it before the game starts. Maybe there are other "simple questions" which could always be asked as well ...
That would be sooooooo anoying tho :d
Great idea, even if it's not really new, tho
|
On June 08 2011 02:16 Alexl wrote:Show nested quote +On June 08 2011 01:03 Rabiator wrote:
A small suggestion for improvement:
I think a nice idea for observers (who are made referee) would be to pause the game at certain stages and then ask both players what they think their opponent has as a number of units, bases, what his plan is and such. Type it out and you can see in the replay how accurate you really are as a player, because your perception of yourself and the opponent can make you gg prematurely (like IdrA shows regularly I think).
Such simple training techniques can be applied even by low level players watching a high level game, just ask if it is ok to do it before the game starts. Maybe there are other "simple questions" which could always be asked as well ... That would be sooooooo anoying tho :d Great idea, even if it's not really new, tho
I didnt saw anything like that anywhere so I cant agree
@topic
thanks everyone for feedback!
|
Russian Federation9 Posts
good idea! will be there!
|
So this is just TLPickup in ingame channel form?
|
great idea, will be my first stop when looking for practise partners from now on
|
|
|
Of course a great initiative, however you might want to reconsider the name of your thread. It doesn't reveal much of it's content, you might get more views otherwise.
|
this is awesomeeee need get it started on NA too though, i would love some better pratice
|
On June 08 2011 03:05 Gator wrote:
this is awesomeeee need get it started on NA too though, i would love some better pratice
You're free to make your own channel man, i dont need credit for this i just want to have a place to practice
Very much appreciate everyones post here!
|
sounds like an ok idea, problem is that i just joined the channel of the 38 ppl in there i have heard the names of 2 of them before.
|
On June 08 2011 03:16 DarKFoRcE wrote:
sounds like an ok idea, problem is that i just joined the channel of the 38 ppl in there i have heard the names of 2 of them before.
Already said to you on pm but i will say it once again, this channel is aiming to not only get comptetetive players on but also unknown master-grandmaster etc players that want to train, just like me. Anyways thanks for your support i appreciate everyones post in this thread
|
Idea, is good, but there is not point for a guys like darkforce to sit in that channel and search for practice partners because they will get much higher level opponents in ladder :D
But if they are here to help others then cool.
|
On June 08 2011 03:25 Alpina wrote:
Idea, is good, but there is not point for a guys like darkforce to sit in that channel and search for practice partners because they will get much higher level opponents in ladder :D
But if they are here to help others then cool.
I just get them to show up and make other people excited so more are joining Actualy Lzgamer played some games with us and then with empirehobot and it was kind of fun im very tired i will get some more people and then propably go to bed
thanks everyone for support i love ya
|
I think this is good idea for Master / Grand Master players and for newbie players like me i can obs games and teach new starategy better macro or micro tricks.
|
On June 08 2011 03:48 Manchox wrote:
I think this is good idea for Master / Grand Master players and for newbie players like me i can obs games and teach new starategy better macro or micro tricks.
Actualy on second channel PZ2 low level players may also practice with eachother, I guess it need more time to grow
Thanks everyone for help!
|
Really good idea, I repeatedly find myself without an available practice partner and not feeling like the randomness of ladder (in terms of both maps and match ups) so I think this is great. Will try to spread the word
|
On June 08 2011 04:06 Ziktomini wrote:Really good idea, I repeatedly find myself without an available practice partner and not feeling like the randomness of ladder (in terms of both maps and match ups) so I think this is great. Will try to spread the word
Thank you for your help
Actualy we have 40 people on the channel i hope it will continiously grow! =)
|
There are actually a good number of practice channels out there - they're just not popularized enough.
I love your idea though, the more the better, really.
For reference though
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=183961
I've recently joined a channel 'Game Time'. I haven't seen any GMs in there, but lots of High Diamond/Masters players practice regularly here.
|
On June 08 2011 04:12 Clicker wrote:There are actually a good number of practice channels out there - they're just not popularized enough. I love your idea though, the more the better, really. For reference though http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=183961I've recently joined a channel 'Game Time'. I haven't seen any GMs in there, but lots of High Diamond/Masters players practice regularly here.
Actually i never saw any of those, but you're right, the more the better
thanks for support!
|
support the idea I need pracc partners --
|
|
|
Support this idea, always nice to join a channel with people willing to pratice with you! Gonna spread the word so this will grow!
|
I'm commander PD and this is my favorite thread on the citadel.
|
goood ideaaa awesome project !
|
50 people on channel, those 6 hours of work payed off greatly! thanks everyone for comming and spreading word about the channel
Good night everyone
|
hello im back if you like the idea please comment in this thread that keeps me motivated to work and also tell your friends if you would be so kind i very much appreciate everyones input in this project
|
|
|
refresh! give me some feedback guys 20 people on channel if anyone want to join us
|
Nice, no more messaging a bunch of people to see who is avaible to play
|
I think this is a great idea
Definitely needs a little refining though
Atm even though i can find the odd 1v1 in there, it is not a very good form of practise since you are unlikely to get helpful advice for your own race unless you are playing mirror (i've had some TERRIBLE advice from some players who beat me, and again when i've beaten some guys, i cannot exactly elaborate on what they should or could have done)
This could easily be fixed by practising the same thing over and over again (i wish people were more willing to do this) to refine the same build and its quirks
And also, most importantly, customs where players of each race are present (like, 2 of each race) so you can work on each other and comment easier
|
Actualy after first day where there was like 50 people it got worse, now its 20+ people online and thats all  I wish more people join us so we can get better practice
|
just playing the same guy in the same map several times is great practice
|
Hey guys this is awesome but it need a few more ppl. If we had 100 ppl in the channel or multiple channels then it would be so much better!
|
Good idea, if you manage to get enough people in. I definitely need to practise non-ladder maps too^^
|
One problem is that you can not find out who is Grandmaster or Master by right clicking them in under 30 seconds (NEED MOAR INPUT bug tt). Would it be an idea to have PZ-GM PZ-M PZ-D to get levels grouped appropriately?
|
I need tvp practice. Grubby come practice with me
|
On June 11 2011 04:28 Grubby wrote:
One problem is that you can not find out who is Grandmaster or Master by right clicking them in under 30 seconds (NEED MOAR INPUT bug tt). Would it be an idea to have PZ-GM PZ-M PZ-D to get levels grouped appropriately?
I though about it, but after first day where there was 50 people it stays around 20-30 all day so splitting it now isnt good idea (how it would be to have 3 people in one channel lol ) I guess not many people are actualy interested
|
I think this deserves some more spotlight, really like what you're doing there, but without the necessary spotlight it will be without great effect.
|
good idea. will join and look whatsup.
|
On June 11 2011 04:28 Grubby wrote:
One problem is that you can not find out who is Grandmaster or Master by right clicking them in under 30 seconds (NEED MOAR INPUT bug tt). Would it be an idea to have PZ-GM PZ-M PZ-D to get levels grouped appropriately?
very valid point, its frustates me that you cant see what level anyone is, most channels are like this, they get full of silver, gold and plat after a while, and you have to manually go in and look before accepting a 1v1.
|
I support the idea, lets see if it works.
|
great idea
you could also do like: BronzePZIP
etc, and make it more organized
|
|
|
I'm not so sure about people not being interested in this.
I think it's because most Master/GM or even lower level players already have their own practice partners, friends of similar skill, clans or local communities where they can get practice.
This project's problem is that it refers to people without access to any of the above, thus a limited target group - obviously Nerchio, LzGamer and the rest of the guys that have shown interest are investing in it as an idea rather than improving their training and benefiting from this right away.
So, what do I you gotta do to make you love me make this work is offer something extra, something most players won't have access to that easily, something that will differentiate the actual "service" and/or improve its quality.
Now, there's 2 great obstacles in doing this:
1. Noone is willing to spend 5 minutes in browsing profiles in order to find the right player (league/race) to practice with.
2. Bnet channels support no moderation.
My suggestions are:
1. You work on mIRC.
I guess the bnet channel could still remain, but honestly it doesn't seem able to support this project at the moment.
2. You need Admins.
Yes, it sounds troublesome, and to be fair it will be. You're just a Masters player who wants to get practice, but nothing ever becomes successful unless it's well organized, and nothing ever becomes well organized unless it's got people working on it. I'm sure people willing to do this will show up if you ask around. I'd be glad to help out at least in the beginning since after August I'll be having my hands full with running a league.
3. How will it work?
3A. You give voice (+v) to all Master & GrandMaster players.
Each M & GM player that comes in the channel will have to PM an admin (@) with his Bnet Username & CharacterCode. The admin checks the profile on sc2ranks.com and gives +v to the player. Theoretically, given most players will be auth'd this will happen only once.
3B. You create a Bot.
You make a Bot that will accept commands from all +v and @. I'm not an expert on the subject but based on the Quake Pick-up channel model, a basic format of it's functions would be:
+ Show Spoiler +!add <Your Race> <Race you're Looking for>
e.x. !add Protoss Zerg
That will add a Protoss Master/GM player in the list of those looking for Zerg practice partners, and so on.
Therefore, a Zerg player later joins the channel, gets +v and types
!add Zerg Protoss
The Bot finds a match, and messages both players letting them know of who their practice partner is. As i said, I have no knowledge regarding the level of difficulty in making this Bot, but simpler versions would definately serve the same purpose well.
This should be working on a first-come first-served basis, and from that point on the players can exchange ID's, skype, talk about each ones weak spot and get right on with helping each other out.
Obviously they could and should arrange another practice session for the day after or so, but that's the goal, isn't it? Offering quality practice to people that don't have access to it.
However, that alone would omit a basic part of what you're looking for. That is, people observing.
+ Show Spoiler +So, you add another function to the Bot, available to anyone who joins the channel.
!addobs <Race you're Interested in>
e.x. !addobs Zerg
This way, the very moment the 2 players are notified that they got a match, the first X number of players that were added to the list of people interested in observing a M/GM player practising will get a message as well, letting them know of who that person is.
I say "X number of people" because I doubt a high level player would be interested in spending 20 minutes adding 8 or 10 people to observe his game. It's not time efficient and there's always the lag factor. So you can make it 3 or 5.
3C. You keep the channel moderated and the service clean.
As you can understand, you don't want people who will waste your user's time. Therefore, people who:
- Refuse to do a specific build for their practice partner
- Flame, troll or show any kind of extremely inappropriate behavior
- Abuse any personal information that may be exchanged during practice
and get reported (with actual proof) should be banned from the channel, and their Bnet Account added to a Black-List that all Admins will have access to.
So, let's see what you end up with.
Case-Study #1: Empire.Nerchio looking for Practice:
+ Show Spoiler +- Joins Channel
- Types !add Zerg Terran
- Finds a M/GM Terran practice partner
- Exchanges info
- Invites 2-3 players that requested to obs high-level Zerg or Terran - if he's kind enough, that shouldn't be a requirement imo.
Case Study #2: Grimskov is looking for Practice:
+ Show Spoiler +- Joins Channel
- Types "hiho! Zerg looking for Plat/Diamond Protoss, msg me!"
- Types !addobs Zerg
- Gets messaged by an interested player. If he's lucky he gets a nice person. If he's really lucky he gets to observe Empire.Nerchio practice!
Now, on a more abstract fashion let's take a few moments to compare it with "competition":
Why is this better for practice than Ladder is:
- It's not random.
- It's cheese-proof and generally prevents you from encountering games or strats that seem like a complete waste of time - unless you request for something like that.
- It doesn't record stats
- It gets you to actually talk to people
- It allows observers
- It's way faster. You might have to queue up several times to get the match-up and strategy you actually want to practice on.
Why is this better than Practicing with your Clan/Team/Friends:
- Well, it isn't, i guess. BUT:
- Many skilled players don't have access to such circles.
- It offers variety in styles. Two players could do the same build but trying it out against different styles could lead to different conclusions
- It offers variety in opinions.
- It's there when they're not. You could theoretically get quality practice at any point of the day or night.
Well, I think this would be a good first step to start getting people interested in this.
Feel free to PM me anytime if you need help.
EDIT: I'm a fairly new member on TL, so excuse my noobness: Maybe all the above should just be applied on #tlpickup
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
