EPTOn May 26 2011 21:03 blackone wrote:
That was only four times, you're totally safe man!
That was only four times, you're totally safe man!
He did say it 5 times, check the 4th word of his reply.
Casting Language Standards - Page 25
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ryan__h
United States42 Posts
He did say it 5 times, check the 4th word of his reply. | ||
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Bubble-T
Australia105 Posts
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supersoft
Germany3729 Posts
i hope i understood this correctly... i mean we are 4 brothers and our youngest brother is 12. he knows exactly "where the babys come from"... i don't know maybe it's different in germany... but i remember that we watched an education movie about having sex in primaryschool... and about swearing: my brother also knows like every single bad word in the entire german and english language :D that doesn't mean he uses any of them. i don't want to tell you how to raise your children, but i don't think that it's the right way if you just dont let you kids hear the words. i think it's absolutely no problem at all... my brother is the best student in his class... | ||
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primebeef
United States140 Posts
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StarStruck
25339 Posts
On May 26 2011 22:19 supersoft wrote: what your kids are 8 and 12 and don't know the word "fuck"? i hope i understood this correctly... i mean we are 4 brothers and our youngest brother is 12. he knows exactly "where the babys come from"... i don't know maybe it's different in germany... but i remember that we watched an education movie about having sex in primaryschool... i think it's absolutely no problem at all... my brother is the best student in his class... I can see it being a problem if the OP's children look up to players/commentators like Incontrol, Gretrop, IdrA, etc. If they view these guys as role models they would probably curse a lot more. That's what kids do. They see something they like and they start acting upon it. As a parent, I can see how this would be an issue for other parents. I've noticed several casters trying to hold back already. At certain events like MLG, the casters are even asked not to curse at all. The big organizations are heading in the right direction in terms of class and professionalism. If you are watching someone's own stream. That is a different can of worms. They can say whatever the heck they want in their own stream. | ||
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SnuggleZhenya
596 Posts
On May 26 2011 22:19 supersoft wrote: what your kids are 8 and 12 and don't know the word "fuck"? i hope i understood this correctly... i mean we are 4 brothers and our youngest brother is 12. he knows exactly "where the babys come from"... i don't know maybe it's different in germany... but i remember that we watched an education movie about having sex in primaryschool... and about swearing: my brother also knows like every single bad word in the entire german and english language :D that doesn't mean he uses any of them. i don't want to tell you how to raise your children, but i don't think that it's the right way if you just dont let you kids hear the words. i think it's absolutely no problem at all... my brother is the best student in his class... It isn't about hearing the word fuck, its about it seeming amateurish. It makes casters seem like a couple of kids in their parents basement watching video games when its all "holy shit" and "what the hell" and so forth. Its like wearing a big sign that says "eSports isn't ready for prime time yet." Maybe it isn't, and thats fine. Maybe we don't care if it ever is, and thats fine. But frankly, if this is ever something I am going to try and get people in to, or be really excited about talking about in front of my friends, the only way is going to be socially acceptable and legitimate is it has an air of professionalism about it. As it stands I'd be embarrassed to show most of my friends and colleagues a lot of Starcraft 2 casts. I'm sure that lots of people will say "oh, it shouldn't be that way" or "its not our job to conform to arbitrary cultural/societal norms" etc. Fine fine fine, but just realize what you are saying. Think of something like the X-Games. That never would've caught on if it was a bunch of stoned snowboarders cursing and making pot jokes while commentating. But, it got legitimatized precisely because it was treated seriously by ESPN, had a high production quality, and so forth. I think Starcraft and professional gaming needs to follow a similar path to successful. I've never watched the X-Games and thought, gee if only these people would really let loose with the swearing my experience would be better. Finally, on a slightly different topic I feel like the two sides of this argument are operating from different assumptions about the "default" state of language. To me, swearing is not some kind immoral thing, but if you are saying them, there should be a point. That is to say, the "default" way of talking doesn't include them, but they can be added for emphasis or something like that. I think the pro cursing or anti censorship crowd (or however they identify) would argue that cursing is part of the casters normal language and shouldn't be removed for some arbitrary standards. So to me cursing is adding something that wasn't there before and not including them in your casts isn't really an imposition, and to them not cursing is taking away something that is there normally so it is censorship, I suspect this is the source of a lot of the conflict. | ||
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fant0m
964 Posts
It's just a word, explain that to them. No need to shelter them from the real world. Ever. | ||
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Softboing
United States68 Posts
On May 27 2011 00:03 fant0m wrote: If your kids' lives will be ruined because they heard the word fuck, then you need to do something differently.... It's just a word, explain that to them. No need to shelter them from the real world. Ever. Thanks, armchair parent. This thread was not-at-all about censoring every caster, but rather giving a choice and creating standards to be able to choose what to watch. Looking for a little more sophistication and content-friendliness isn't sheltering your kids. | ||
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Ragoo
Germany2773 Posts
It's just a word and a very flexible and useful one, too. I never associate it with the act of having sex when used in contexts like "that was a fucking great match" or "I hate this fucking strategy" and neither should you. And even if you would, what's so bad about sex anyway? You watch humans get killed in the most gruesome ways in this game yet when someone says "fuck" it's not okay? The only reason why "fuck" is such a powerful and feared word in American society is cause you give it so much attention. Treat it like a normal word, it doesn't hurt. I would personally hate it if casters became more "professional" about what they say just because some people demand it. It will take away from their personality and it's just sad that they can't say what they want cause you have to cover your ears when someone says "dirty words" lol | ||
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ryan__h
United States42 Posts
On May 27 2011 00:14 Ragoo wrote: I love reading about the "f-word" or "f-bomb" lol It's just a word and a very flexible and useful one, too. I never associate it with the act of having sex when used in contexts like "that was a fucking great match" or "I hate this fucking strategy" and neither should you. And even if you would, what's so bad about sex anyway? You watch humans get killed in the most gruesome ways in this game yet when someone says "fuck" it's not okay? The only reason why "fuck" is such a powerful and feared word in American society is cause you give it so much attention. Treat it like a normal word, it doesn't hurt. I would personally hate it if casters became more "professional" about what they say just because some people demand it. It will take away from their personality and it's just sad that they can't say what they want cause you have to cover your ears when someone says "dirty words" lol I never realized that a lot of people view U.S.A as the censorship capital of the world. Like I said early I'm against censorship, but i can understand why people think that. I guess I never thought about it. | ||
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ReaperX
Hong Kong1758 Posts
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supersoft
Germany3729 Posts
since a bomb and its purpose should be much more disturbing than fuck and its purpose | ||
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Jhax
Ireland201 Posts
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Achaia
United States643 Posts
For people calling out parents about not wanting their kids to say the "f-word" I think perhaps you should rethink posting about parenting if you're not a parent yourself. I have a 3 year old daughter myself and I would be appalled if she used such language. You can't justify bad language by saying "it's just a word", some words are offensive. It's that simple. Do you think it's acceptable for me to just run around saying nigger to whoever I want, or to use any other kind of language that is generally seen as racially demeaning? Just because a word has a meaning doesn't justify its use. Anyone who would think I'm a language censor or something can shut that down right now. I don't have a problem with certain words in certain contexts. That kind of language is absolutely unacceptable for any child by societal standards and that's what the parents in the threads are speaking to. | ||
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naim
41 Posts
On May 27 2011 01:02 Achaia wrote: That kind of language is absolutely unacceptable for any child by societal standards and that's what the parents in the threads are speaking to. What makes you think that children adopt this language if they hear it? | ||
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warsinger
United States17 Posts
On May 27 2011 01:22 naim wrote: What makes you think that children adopt this language if they hear it? experience of being a parent. children are like little parrots, repeating anything and everything they hear. Kinda like people who watch CNN or Fox News  | ||
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naim
41 Posts
On May 27 2011 01:25 warsinger wrote: experience of being a parent. children are like little parrots, repeating anything and everything they hear. Kinda like people who watch CNN or Fox News I knew this would come up. And do your kids kill other people because they saw it? | ||
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Popss
Sweden176 Posts
On May 27 2011 01:27 naim wrote: I knew this would come up. And do your kids kill other people because they saw it? Two different things, dont be silly. | ||
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naim
41 Posts
Hell no, why always this difference? Sure its exaggerated but why do you think children won't get aggressive when they see violence? You deaden your kids towards violence. They eventually play sometimes bad guy and good guy with wooden swords or plastic pistols or whatever, thats normal. However they wont yell "make me a sandwich or i KILL YOU!" at the dinner table. Same goes for language, they wont yell "what the fuck is this on my sandwich bitch?". But that is not because you censor authentic expression, its because they learned what they can do, what is acceptable and what isn't. | ||
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Zechs
United Kingdom321 Posts
But just because a commentator CAN swear doesn't mean they SHOULD. Once you get past the age of 14/15 and swearing isn't "cool" any more and whatever your own opinion may be, swearing is seen as immature and uncouth for a reason. I don't find it offensive but i also don't find it especially amusing in and of itself. There is always another word you can use in place of a swear word, and if esports wants to be professional its commentators should carry on using another word... or, you know, just keep yelling "ohhhhhhhhhh" and "oh my god." Because that's entertaining AND informative. Frankly, though, i can hardly remember a commentator swearing anyway, except on the Day9 Dailies, but that's a much different show with a different audience to general SC2 match coverage. | ||
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