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On May 22 2011 02:20 emythrel wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 02:18 Lms0 wrote:Well, I think it's mainly the fact that you have to stay there for 1 month that is the problem for foreigner's  Yup and the time difference + lag stops them playing in other tourneys that they might already have agreed to, such as clan wars or ESL Pro series etc. If the lag issues could be solved, it might lead to more foreigners deciding they can be in korea and still earn money outside of the GSL Could you imagine if Jinro and HuK could play in online tourneys from korea without lag.... that would encourage others to try it out
No dude, LAG is not a fucking problem anymore. Holy shit. If lag is a problem, explain why at least 4 of the koreans have 4 wins in the NASL, and all currently rank in the top 20? There are players whoare in the US who have no wins, so whats their excuse? not enough lag? We've already seen this discussion, and people have said it's easy to get use to the latency.
However, I do agree that having to stay for a month kind of screws things for you for awhile. Also, being in a different time zone doesn't help because it's hard to play games at your best when you're too damn tired. But stop QQing about lag, because that's not the fucking problem.
EDIT: When I say lag isn't a problem anymore, I mean... it still exists, but it;s not making the game unplayable from continent to continent.
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I'm gonna go bold here and label this whole ordeal as travel anxiety. You can still compete in online cups, you can still attend MLG, and you can get used to the lag if you practice enough.
Unless you have family responsibilities it's really down to comfort. As in, adjusting a to a new house, new friends, and playing with a bit of lag.
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The tournament location is the biggest problem. It's in Korea, it's like a month long, it cost lots of money to live in Seoul for that one month. Unless you come out on the semi-finals, I can't really see any foreigners being able to to prevent their wallets from being busted. Maybe it would not be so bad if they were given a stay at the GSL professional house...still those travel costs.
I think most of these guys want to stay close to home where other tournaments are being held (which would make the location to carry on regular code A/S tournaments a pain). Now if those guys can be in two places at once this would work out a lot better. OSL and MSL never had this problem because both tournaments are hosted in the same city (thus eliminating that distance problem).
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Canada13389 Posts
On May 22 2011 06:20 Golgotha wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 05:59 iCCup.Diamond wrote:On May 22 2011 05:57 namedplayer wrote:
I don't want mediocre foreigners to compete GSL.. no foreigners in GSL is perfectly fine for me if THEY AREN'T GOOD AS GOOD AS MVP,BOMBER.
You realize that MVP lost to a foreigner in the Gom World Team league thing right? you realize that it was just one game right? and did you forget he won the championships a week later? lol
But most people in the GSL currently coda A or Code S arent as good as MVP, bomber or even DongRaeGu. DRG isn't even in the GSL 1v1 anyway and his teammates in the GSL need to perform well enough to get slayers in a GSTL for us to even watch him play.
Some foreigners are better than many of the Koreans in the GSL but its not like they will necessarily go to Korea since they can make money from home too. Its not like BW where you couldnt really make any money without going to Korea and any salary or money you did make paled in comparison to a similarly skilled korean player.
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On May 22 2011 06:05 leakingpear wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 06:02 namedplayer wrote:On May 22 2011 05:59 iCCup.Diamond wrote:On May 22 2011 05:57 namedplayer wrote:
I don't want mediocre foreigners to compete GSL.. no foreigners in GSL is perfectly fine for me if THEY AREN'T GOOD AS GOOD AS MVP,BOMBER.
You realize that MVP lost to a foreigner in the Gom World Team league thing right? no I don't. what was that? BO1? Please just give up now and save this thread from more inane bullshit where one person thinks some player is better than another player and blah blah blah, NO ONE GIVES A FLYING SHIT ABOUT YOUR OR MY OPINION ON THE RELATIVE SKILL OF PLAYERS.
? I mean it. I want BEAST foreigner to compete GSL, not a bunch of mediocre.
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GSL may not offer much prize money, but the status that comes along with it is just ridiculous.
1. Look at gosucoaching, Idra is the only one offered the coaching rate at $150 and increased it to $300 because he wanted more time to practice.
2. Remember Jinro in first two GSL? He is pretty much nobody. Reaching to top 4 GSL and did well on the next one by beating oGs.MC, suddenly he become a national gaming hero that featured on a newspaper.
Instead of thinking blindly about money, pro-gamer should put another thought about baller-status by attending GSL.
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On May 22 2011 06:18 Misanthrope wrote:
Believe it or not, the world doesn't revolve around fucking Korea, I hope they keep making asses of themselves and people just keep shunning the GSL. E-sports is worldwide now bitches, adapt or GTFO.
Explain to me how "fucking Korea" is making asses out of themselves.
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status doesn't put food in their plates or cash in their wallets. face it, this is still a niche scene with limited sponsorship.
besides, it's not like doing well in foreign tournaments doesn't give similar amounts of prestige.
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On May 22 2011 06:28 namedplayer wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 06:05 leakingpear wrote:On May 22 2011 06:02 namedplayer wrote:On May 22 2011 05:59 iCCup.Diamond wrote:On May 22 2011 05:57 namedplayer wrote:
I don't want mediocre foreigners to compete GSL.. no foreigners in GSL is perfectly fine for me if THEY AREN'T GOOD AS GOOD AS MVP,BOMBER.
You realize that MVP lost to a foreigner in the Gom World Team league thing right? no I don't. what was that? BO1? Please just give up now and save this thread from more inane bullshit where one person thinks some player is better than another player and blah blah blah, NO ONE GIVES A FLYING SHIT ABOUT YOUR OR MY OPINION ON THE RELATIVE SKILL OF PLAYERS. ? I mean it. I want BEAST foreigner to compete GSL, not a bunch of mediocre.
yup. The only foreigners I want to see in the GSL and actually have a chance are:
Nani, Idra, T-Zain, Jinro, Select, Dimaga, and Sen. The rest would find it hard to stand a chance even if they got 1st place in MLG.
IMO. Feel free to add or take away.
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I think GSL will have to make short events like MLG or Dreamhack do if they want to get alot of foreigners to go there, also tell the players long before the tournaments happen.
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illsick
United States1770 Posts
On May 22 2011 05:34 coddan wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 05:13 illsick wrote:On May 22 2011 04:33 coddan wrote:On May 22 2011 04:29 gozima wrote:
Everyone always stating what the "opportunity cost" of going to Korea for a month will be. I won't be able to do this and that. wah wah wah...
Instead of looking at it from the perspective of a loser, why not look at what you could potentially gain from going....
~$27,000 for a months worth of work and everything else that comes with winning at the highest level.
If you don't think you can compete and win, of course you're going to continue to make excuses. Even if you are one of the 10 best players in the world, and assuming those 10 people are completely equal, and that all of the players in the top 10 would magically get the perfect brackets that allow them all to finish top 10, that's still only a 10% chance to win that kind of money. It is not an economically responsible thing to do. 3-4th place make almost same as winner of MLG (~$5k) 5-8th place make (~$3k) That's better than a lot of the top foreigners are making And there is also the requirement that you make it there every time. Idra only made it once, Jinro twice and haven't been close before or after that. If you go to Korea you are exluding yourself from the smaller prize pools for potentially winning a larger sum in much fiercer competition.
I'm going by your example of top 10 best players in the world scenario... that I quoted from you
If you are top 10, then you will either exceed or break even in what you will make outside of Korea. Looking statistically through a whole year, economically speaking it is even higher than 10%; maybe even 20% as 2nd place is $18-19k prize (that's a good chunk of money to make it worthwhile). Then factor in that every other month is a GSL season ontop of in between seasons there can be a WC or Super Tournament; so your odds are even better than your original 10% of making it worthwhile if you are top 10 in the world (and if you magically get 'perfect' brackets).
So it comes down to the competition being fiercer. And people are mad when he said that Code S and MLG are not too comparable. Europeans are sending people to MLG for for prize of $5k and not sending people to the Super Tournament. It's only a month long tournament if you make it to the very end but by then it's already worthwhile/exceeding that month 'sacrifice'. Obviously if you are knocked out early it's not worth it; just like if you are knocked out of MLG early. But it's not a month 'sacrifice' to be knocked out early of the Super Tournament.
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On May 22 2011 06:30 Sein wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 06:18 Misanthrope wrote:
Believe it or not, the world doesn't revolve around fucking Korea, I hope they keep making asses of themselves and people just keep shunning the GSL. E-sports is worldwide now bitches, adapt or GTFO. Explain to me how "fucking Korea" is making asses out of themselves.
lol he probably missed all seasons of the GSTL 
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Can imagine that the koreans are sad that the foreigners actually can have a proscene without them. THey dont have to feel insulted because they are unwillingly to leave their family, friends and lovers at home while they go pro in a far away country. Especially considering the risk in code S, only Jinro who also won MLG at that time was able to go into the Code S semifinals as the only foreigner, idra managed the ro16 iirc (maybe ro8, can only remember he was knocked out by Jinro at that time).
Might be a tough pill for koreasn to swallow that the foreigners don't feel the prestige of being in korea, especially when they have to afford the plane ticket. And also include everything in Xeris' post basically, many of the koreans would also have a better faring in money and success (with internal fans too who'd recognize them on street) if the koreans tried to setup a progaming house in Sweden, germany or the US for example then they would probally be able to understand what the foreigners would have to go through. Probally not even that since many foreigners would love the opportunity to practice with famous koreans while foreigners in korea would not be as "exotic" as so to say.
THats just my view on it anyways
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On May 22 2011 06:32 Golgotha wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 06:28 namedplayer wrote:On May 22 2011 06:05 leakingpear wrote:On May 22 2011 06:02 namedplayer wrote:On May 22 2011 05:59 iCCup.Diamond wrote:On May 22 2011 05:57 namedplayer wrote:
I don't want mediocre foreigners to compete GSL.. no foreigners in GSL is perfectly fine for me if THEY AREN'T GOOD AS GOOD AS MVP,BOMBER.
You realize that MVP lost to a foreigner in the Gom World Team league thing right? no I don't. what was that? BO1? Please just give up now and save this thread from more inane bullshit where one person thinks some player is better than another player and blah blah blah, NO ONE GIVES A FLYING SHIT ABOUT YOUR OR MY OPINION ON THE RELATIVE SKILL OF PLAYERS. ? I mean it. I want BEAST foreigner to compete GSL, not a bunch of mediocre. yup. The only foreigners I want to see in the GSL and actually have a chance are: Nani, Idra, T-Zain, Jinro, Select, Dimaga, and Sen. The rest would find it hard to stand a chance even if they got 1st place in MLG. IMO. Feel free to add or take away.
I would add Morrow to the list, he is a hard worker and very talented.
Edit : Oh and Huk already prove himself by being in code S and by showing his dedication, i respect a lot players who are true competitor like him and want to compete with the best.
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If there was something else to play in korea maybe that would not be so bad but atm there is noting else other than the GSL.
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I just think its awesome that Gom is responding to a prominent foreigner community member's post on team liquid! It might not have been very productive in this case but its clear they are paying attention.
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I'd imagine if there was a BW Chaosplayer level of lag from korea, then a lot of foreigners would take the opportunity to go to korea.
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On May 22 2011 06:40 Dreadwolf wrote:
If there was something else to play in korea maybe that would not be so bad but atm there is noting else other than the GSL.
Yeah I don´t understand why Blizzard gave GOM a monopoly on SC2 tournaments over there, if SC2 is going to get more popular then BW surely they need many tournaments? :/
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On May 22 2011 06:45 Gurgl wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 06:40 Dreadwolf wrote:
If there was something else to play in korea maybe that would not be so bad but atm there is noting else other than the GSL. Yeah I don´t understand why Blizzard gave GOM a monopoly on SC2 tournaments over there, if SC2 is going to get more popular then BW surely they need many tournaments? :/
well at the time relationship between kespa and blizzard wasnt the greatest so blizzard had nobody except gom to negotiate sc2 with else sc2 in korea would have died out
but in 2 years when the contract ends you are guaranteed more tournament by ogn or mbc game
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its kind of stupid that people don't want to go to korea. I mean how likely is it for a foreigner to win the tournaments at home? It's not like they're winning every tournament. I rather go to korea and make some money just for being in the tournament instead of going to MLG and getting knocked out in the first round earning no money, and actually losing money because of the flight and hotel expenses.
They are giving you a place to live in korea seriously... You can make 100 bucks in a day in a foreign online tournament... so you can in Code A also in the first day.
People shouldn't be going into tournaments without the attitude of winning. Foreigners go into foreign tournaments thinking they can win it, but they don't share that same attitude going into the GSL, because they know they can't win it.
Maybe players can fill in for Code A and commentate for it to make some money in Korea to help with their financial problems.
I encourage all foreign players to play in Korea, and do it for the experience, I mean Sen was living in IM when he qualified for GSL open 3 and probably got a lot of value out of it.
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EPT
