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Patch 1.3.3 PTR - Page 48

Forum Index > SC2 General
4401 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 46 47 48 49 50 221 Next
Massive units are not affected by concussive shells. If you think they are, you are wrong.
It's SPORE crawlers that are being changed, not SPINE. Please read carefully.
bovineblitz
Profile Joined September 2010
United States314 Posts
April 26 2011 07:15 GMT
#941
My god, terran already doesn't need to mine much gas and they're making the anti-protoss unit cheaper???
SONE
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada839 Posts
April 26 2011 07:15 GMT
#942
On April 26 2011 16:13 Alpina wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2011 16:12 SONE wrote:
On April 26 2011 16:10 Alpina wrote:
On April 26 2011 16:08 OsoVega wrote:
On April 26 2011 15:45 Alpina wrote:
Most changes are good, but what's the point in increasing zealot build time?

Also if they decided to make archon massive why not make queen massive. It would make zerg much easier to deal with very strong phoenix/void opening and zergs could move queen around to destroy FFs.

Those two things are in no way related. Archons and queens have almost no relation. Saying queens should be massive because archons are is like saying zealots should be able to cloak because banshees can. All you are doing is pointing out that making queens massive would be a buff. No shit but you don't give any reason why queens should be buffed. Also, zealot build time is not increased. If you mean decreased, it is because warpgates come later.


Lol then why archons should be buffed? Do you think it's ok to have 5 queens in base to be sure to defend simple 2 void/2 phoenix opening?

probably because they were never used as the archon, just the "oh my ht has no more energy"


That's what blizzard wants them to be, they said that several times.

well not anymore?
Ziggy Starport
Profile Joined November 2010
United States70 Posts
April 26 2011 07:15 GMT
#943
On April 26 2011 15:57 windsupernova wrote:

Ehhh, I actually don't agree. Blizzard should only step in to fix broken things, Its not up to them to make a matchup more playable or watchable. And really, with 9 matchups only 1 was retarded so I don't think it was that bad.

PvP was interesting to me at least, not all matches need to go into super late macro mode to be good.


Well to be fair, I think their vision of the game and its future is probably the most valid, despite what anyone else may think.

Plus, there are only six match ups, not nine.
OsoVega
Profile Joined December 2010
926 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-26 07:18:20
April 26 2011 07:15 GMT
#944
On April 26 2011 16:10 Alpina wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2011 16:08 OsoVega wrote:
On April 26 2011 15:45 Alpina wrote:
Most changes are good, but what's the point in increasing zealot build time?

Also if they decided to make archon massive why not make queen massive. It would make zerg much easier to deal with very strong phoenix/void opening and zergs could move queen around to destroy FFs.

Those two things are in no way related. Archons and queens have almost no relation. Saying queens should be massive because archons are is like saying zealots should be able to cloak because banshees can. All you are doing is pointing out that making queens massive would be a buff. No shit but you don't give any reason why queens should be buffed. Also, zealot build time is not increased. If you mean decreased, it is because warpgates come later.


Lol then why archons should be buffed? Do you think it's ok to have 5 queens in base to be sure to defend simple 2 void/2 phoenix opening?

I don't know, that is up to Blizzard. I could speculate but my speculation doesn't matter. I have no interest in discussing balance with you, I'm just pointing out that your point is completely off topic and you tried to relate it to this discussion in an absolutely retarded way. Again, saying "Archons are massive so why not make queens massive?" is like saying "Banshee's can cloak so why not make zealots cloak?".
NeonFox
Profile Joined January 2011
2373 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-26 07:16:52
April 26 2011 07:16 GMT
#945
I'm a bit wary of the zealot build time change, but the changes are so good! The one I don't really get is the pylon radius nerf, might be too big an impact on protoss wall-ins.
Morphs
Profile Joined July 2010
Netherlands645 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-26 07:19:29
April 26 2011 07:16 GMT
#946
Why is everybody so happy about the Archon becoming massive? As far as I can see, it doesn't change anything (except removing FF). I hope someone can clarify this one..

Spore change is cool, gives a bit more defense vs. banshees/void rays.
SONE
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada839 Posts
April 26 2011 07:17 GMT
#947
On April 26 2011 16:16 Morphs wrote:
Why is everybody so happy about the Archon becoming massive? As far as I can see, it doesn't change anything (damage dealt, damage taken stays the same right?). I hope someone can clarify this one..

Spore change is cool, gives a bit more defense vs. banshees/void rays.

as repeated several maybe hundreds of times, cant be slowed, breaks FF, cant be lifted.
ALPINA
Profile Joined May 2010
3791 Posts
April 26 2011 07:18 GMT
#948
On April 26 2011 16:15 OsoVega wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2011 16:10 Alpina wrote:
On April 26 2011 16:08 OsoVega wrote:
On April 26 2011 15:45 Alpina wrote:
Most changes are good, but what's the point in increasing zealot build time?

Also if they decided to make archon massive why not make queen massive. It would make zerg much easier to deal with very strong phoenix/void opening and zergs could move queen around to destroy FFs.

Those two things are in no way related. Archons and queens have almost no relation. Saying queens should be massive because archons are is like saying zealots should be able to cloak because banshees can. All you are doing is pointing out that making queens massive would be a buff. No shit but you don't give any reason why queens should be buffed. Also, zealot build time is not increased. If you mean decreased, it is because warpgates come later.


Lol then why archons should be buffed? Do you think it's ok to have 5 queens in base to be sure to defend simple 2 void/2 phoenix opening?

I don't know, that is up to Blizzard. I could speculate but my speculation doesn't matter. I have no interest in discussing balance with you, I'm just pointing out that your point is completely off topic and you tried to relate it to this discussion in an absolutely retarded way.


I know that my suggestion not related with this patch changes, I just say what I think they should change. Zerg's T1 anti air is pretty much non-existant.
You should never underestimate the predictability of stupidity
windsupernova
Profile Joined October 2010
Mexico5280 Posts
April 26 2011 07:19 GMT
#949
On April 26 2011 16:07 Morfildur wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2011 15:57 windsupernova wrote:
On April 26 2011 15:54 ParasitJonte wrote:
On April 26 2011 15:51 syllogism wrote:
On April 26 2011 14:25 [Atomic]Peace wrote:
I'm going to go with Tyler on the Warpgate change:

I'm tired of casual play negatively affecting pro play (4gate being addressed in next patch). Rule changes should happen only when necessary




He nails it. The change simply isn't necessary and is only being made to cater to casual play. Is it difficult to hold off a 4 warp gate? It can be. Is the build usually powerful for how easy it is to execute? Sure. But with proper training you can hold off 4 warp gate 100% of the time. By definition it is not imbalanced.

There seem to be pro players who like these changes (LaLush for one) and I'm not quite sure what he means by "negatively". Perhaps he dislikes how the change affects other matchups? Regardless, I'm sure players will keep opening doors.


To me it's about making the game better. The game will be better if PvP isn't all about 4 gate. Tyler doesn't seem to give this a thought.


Ehhh, I actually don't agree. Blizzard should only step in to fix broken things, Its not up to them to make a matchup more playable or watchable. And really, with 9 matchups only 1 was retarded so I don't think it was that bad.

PvP was interesting to me at least, not all matches need to go into super late macro mode to be good.


PvP is currently broken. It's a fact.
There is only one option you can go for, every other is almost auto-loss against it - unless the opponent screws up or you have far superior micro. So while you can risk going other builds, it can cost you a lot or money in a tournament if your opponent 4gates, so you can only go the safe route and 4gate yourself, which results in a cycle that is impossible to break.

Player A: If i don't 4gate i lose if he 4gates, so i better 4gate eventhough i don't like it
Player B: If i don't 4gate i lose if he 4gates, so i better 4gate eventhough i don't like it
Result: Both players 4gate


How is it broken? Stale maybe, but as it is now the better player will win in a 4gate microfest. Its horribly unforgiving but that doesn't mean its broken either. If someone wants to go for a less safe build blind then they will be punished.

And the other 2 mirror matchups are the same in that eventually both have to do the same of lose because they are being less efficient almost all TvTs will become a tank war,almost all ZvZ will be a Roach Infestor war. Maybe they can go on different routes to get there but they will get to that point or die.

And don't pass off your opinion as a fact

"Its easy, just trust your CPU".-Boxer on being good at games
ThaZenith
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada3116 Posts
April 26 2011 07:19 GMT
#950
On April 26 2011 16:16 Morphs wrote:
Why is everybody so happy about the Archon becoming massive? As far as I can see, it doesn't change anything (damage dealt, damage taken stays the same right?). I hope someone can clarify this one..

Spore change is cool, gives a bit more defense vs. banshees/void rays.


Concussive shells no longer slow it.
OsoVega
Profile Joined December 2010
926 Posts
April 26 2011 07:19 GMT
#951
On April 26 2011 16:18 Alpina wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2011 16:15 OsoVega wrote:
On April 26 2011 16:10 Alpina wrote:
On April 26 2011 16:08 OsoVega wrote:
On April 26 2011 15:45 Alpina wrote:
Most changes are good, but what's the point in increasing zealot build time?

Also if they decided to make archon massive why not make queen massive. It would make zerg much easier to deal with very strong phoenix/void opening and zergs could move queen around to destroy FFs.

Those two things are in no way related. Archons and queens have almost no relation. Saying queens should be massive because archons are is like saying zealots should be able to cloak because banshees can. All you are doing is pointing out that making queens massive would be a buff. No shit but you don't give any reason why queens should be buffed. Also, zealot build time is not increased. If you mean decreased, it is because warpgates come later.


Lol then why archons should be buffed? Do you think it's ok to have 5 queens in base to be sure to defend simple 2 void/2 phoenix opening?

I don't know, that is up to Blizzard. I could speculate but my speculation doesn't matter. I have no interest in discussing balance with you, I'm just pointing out that your point is completely off topic and you tried to relate it to this discussion in an absolutely retarded way.


I know that my suggestion not related with this patch changes, I just say what I think they should change. Zerg's T1 anti air is pretty much non-existant.

Cool, go post it on the battle.net forums then and don't try to justify your suggested buff because a completely unrelated unit is getting buffed.
aLuLz
Profile Joined January 2011
Germany175 Posts
April 26 2011 07:20 GMT
#952
Nice one. 4gate in PvP now affects a lot. I think an immortal is out before 4gate arrives. i like it
progeny
Profile Joined January 2011
Sweden43 Posts
April 26 2011 07:20 GMT
#953
finally archon cant be denied by a 50/50 upgrade!!!!
Heavenly
Profile Joined January 2011
2172 Posts
April 26 2011 07:21 GMT
#954
On April 26 2011 16:10 Alpina wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2011 16:08 OsoVega wrote:
On April 26 2011 15:45 Alpina wrote:
Most changes are good, but what's the point in increasing zealot build time?

Also if they decided to make archon massive why not make queen massive. It would make zerg much easier to deal with very strong phoenix/void opening and zergs could move queen around to destroy FFs.

Those two things are in no way related. Archons and queens have almost no relation. Saying queens should be massive because archons are is like saying zealots should be able to cloak because banshees can. All you are doing is pointing out that making queens massive would be a buff. No shit but you don't give any reason why queens should be buffed. Also, zealot build time is not increased. If you mean decreased, it is because warpgates come later.


Lol then why archons should be buffed? Do you think it's ok to have 5 queens in base to be sure to defend simple 2 void/2 phoenix opening?


You think a tech path that leaves you with almost no ground army to defend anything should become worthless? When are people going to stop complaining about what protoss can do? Now four gate is severely nerfed, we just have to make queens massive, remove forcefield, require a twilight council to build stalkers, remove thermal lance upgrade, not allow units to be warped in unless it's within two inches of a nexus, and make colossus splash damage injure your own units for people to stop complaining about protoss.
"thx for all my fans i'm many lost but cheer for me .. i lost but so happy my power is fans i will good play this is promise my fans" - oGsMC
Cobrakessen
Profile Joined February 2011
Canada12 Posts
April 26 2011 07:21 GMT
#955
I was really hoping KA might make a reapearence in the ptr, with some sort of collosi nerf which I wouldn't want to be burdened with... making HT appear more in match-ups. I really do love good storming and micro battles around it, Collossi just seem to be all any P really wants to go with good robo units along that tech path to a good unit. Storms just make everything excitin, but hopefully i get my wish with archon buff.
RmoteCntrld
Profile Joined June 2010
United States596 Posts
April 26 2011 07:21 GMT
#956
On April 26 2011 11:22 sAfuRos wrote:
Eh...not a fan of the pylon distance change, nor the ghost cost change
Ghosts should be gas intensive, not mineral intensive :/

Edit: i wonder how much the anti-stacking will affect mutas....


I think the "stacking" is mainly the patrol trick.
Perfi
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Poland349 Posts
April 26 2011 07:22 GMT
#957
On April 26 2011 15:57 windsupernova wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2011 15:54 ParasitJonte wrote:
On April 26 2011 15:51 syllogism wrote:
On April 26 2011 14:25 [Atomic]Peace wrote:
I'm going to go with Tyler on the Warpgate change:

I'm tired of casual play negatively affecting pro play (4gate being addressed in next patch). Rule changes should happen only when necessary


https://twitter.com/#!/TylerWasieleski/status/61786904529616896

He nails it. The change simply isn't necessary and is only being made to cater to casual play. Is it difficult to hold off a 4 warp gate? It can be. Is the build usually powerful for how easy it is to execute? Sure. But with proper training you can hold off 4 warp gate 100% of the time. By definition it is not imbalanced.

There seem to be pro players who like these changes (LaLush for one) and I'm not quite sure what he means by "negatively". Perhaps he dislikes how the change affects other matchups? Regardless, I'm sure players will keep opening doors.


To me it's about making the game better. The game will be better if PvP isn't all about 4 gate. Tyler doesn't seem to give this a thought.


Ehhh, I actually don't agree. Blizzard should only step in to fix broken things, Its not up to them to make a matchup more playable or watchable. And really, with 9 matchups only 1 was retarded so I don't think it was that bad.

PvP was interesting to me at least, not all matches need to go into super late macro mode to be good.


That's 33% of the interesting matchups for most Protoss players, though.

Personally I really like the changes. It's gonna take some adapting to the later warpgate, but I think we can all manage.
dthree
Profile Joined March 2010
Australia150 Posts
April 26 2011 07:22 GMT
#958
I foresee 2gate zealot aggression with no gas and expansion being really strong PvZ early game, just like in the beta it will probably force a 1base roach in response and give protoss advantage going into mid-game. I think 33 seconds is too low for zealots.
Volkov
Profile Joined September 2009
United States71 Posts
April 26 2011 07:22 GMT
#959
In general, pretty good. 4-gate in PvP really did need to be made less omnipresent.

BUT. TO BUFF TERRAN???!!! That's ludicrous. That's by far the most horrendous change of the patch, and it will continue to make low and mid-level PvT even more imbalanced; at high levels I'd think it will still shift balance toward terran, but I don't know by how much. In either case, the early-game protoss will now change significantly; I really think the warp gate timing should NOT have been changed. As it is, if you are preparing against a 3-rax push, it already comes almost too late.
torg
Profile Joined April 2011
Norway47 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-26 07:23:54
April 26 2011 07:23 GMT
#960
Oh yes.
maybe they could nerf the duration of pdd. getting sieged is hard enough without being shelled for 3 mins (and by that time they have energy for another).
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