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Patch 1.3.3 PTR - Page 46

Forum Index > SC2 General
4401 CommentsPost a Reply
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Massive units are not affected by concussive shells. If you think they are, you are wrong.
It's SPORE crawlers that are being changed, not SPINE. Please read carefully.
windsupernova
Profile Joined October 2010
Mexico5280 Posts
April 26 2011 06:54 GMT
#901
On April 26 2011 15:50 TheGiftedApe wrote:
Pylon change is so stupid, gives protoss a disadvantage in all matchups just to encourage less 4 warp gate in pvp.....Not to mention I will have to relearn where to position all my buildings for my sim cities. I really really dislike these changes for toss seems like they are going backwards instead of forward.


Really? That change is not really that bad, the sim citying is not that hard to relearn. What worries me is that we will probably see a lot of P losing a lot due to the warpgate changes(timings changed etc..) And the pylon change does give more risk when you offensive 4 gate with a warp in on the ramp.

"Its easy, just trust your CPU".-Boxer on being good at games
Azarkon
Profile Joined January 2010
United States21060 Posts
April 26 2011 06:55 GMT
#902
On April 26 2011 15:51 syllogism wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2011 14:25 [Atomic]Peace wrote:
I'm going to go with Tyler on the Warpgate change:

I'm tired of casual play negatively affecting pro play (4gate being addressed in next patch). Rule changes should happen only when necessary




He nails it. The change simply isn't necessary and is only being made to cater to casual play. Is it difficult to hold off a 4 warp gate? It can be. Is the build usually powerful for how easy it is to execute? Sure. But with proper training you can hold off 4 warp gate 100% of the time. By definition it is not imbalanced.

There seem to be pro players who like these changes (LaLush for one) and I'm not quite sure what he means by "negatively". I imagine he dislikes how the change affects other matchups? Regardless, I'm sure players will keep opening doors.


Tyler doesn't like the fact that Blizzard is changing stuff at such a rapid pace in response to casual player whining (supposedly). This is a reasonable point of view whether you like the changes or not. Tyler also probably has builds prepared that would no longer work with the new patch, meaning that he'll have to start anew.
UniQ.eu
Profile Joined July 2010
Sweden82 Posts
April 26 2011 06:55 GMT
#903
This is absolutely awesome! Warp-Gates are now a choice early game, bunker pressure ain't free, and Zerg can defend those annoying cloaked banshees or pheonixes easier
burnswuff
Profile Joined December 2010
United States61 Posts
April 26 2011 06:56 GMT
#904
I think the pylon range was reduced to the abusable strategies in 2v2. Bunker salvage has always been a complaint among non terran players. Maybe ghosts will be more common due to less gas. I think warpgate was increased to accommodate stim increase.
SYNC_qx
Profile Joined October 2010
Germany197 Posts
April 26 2011 06:56 GMT
#905
On April 26 2011 11:37 arQ wrote:
Great changes imo. Interesting to see how this pans out. Ghost changes is really interesting, i have been waiting for ghost builds since i saw TLO go mass ghosts during beta


tlo still uses ghost builds, but rather early game focused
Jacko11
Profile Joined November 2010
China146 Posts
April 26 2011 06:56 GMT
#906
If u think about it 12 seconds to root a spore crawler is ridiculous, I mean why should a
Spore crawler with less usability be longer to root when spine
Crawlers are needed to be moved more often?
syllogism
Profile Joined September 2010
Finland5948 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-26 06:58:57
April 26 2011 06:57 GMT
#907
On April 26 2011 15:55 Azarkon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2011 15:51 syllogism wrote:
On April 26 2011 14:25 [Atomic]Peace wrote:
I'm going to go with Tyler on the Warpgate change:

I'm tired of casual play negatively affecting pro play (4gate being addressed in next patch). Rule changes should happen only when necessary


https://twitter.com/#!/TylerWasieleski/status/61786904529616896

He nails it. The change simply isn't necessary and is only being made to cater to casual play. Is it difficult to hold off a 4 warp gate? It can be. Is the build usually powerful for how easy it is to execute? Sure. But with proper training you can hold off 4 warp gate 100% of the time. By definition it is not imbalanced.

There seem to be pro players who like these changes (LaLush for one) and I'm not quite sure what he means by "negatively". I imagine he dislikes how the change affects other matchups? Regardless, I'm sure players will keep opening doors.


Tyler doesn't like the fact that Blizzard is changing stuff at such a rapid pace in response to casual player whining (supposedly). This is a reasonable point of view whether you like the changes or not. Tyler also probably has builds prepared that would no longer work with the new patch, meaning that he'll have to start anew.

He knows full well a lot of pro protoss players hated the [PvP] matchup and the patch is also intended to address that somewhat
Tofugrinder
Profile Joined September 2010
Austria899 Posts
April 26 2011 06:57 GMT
#908
as a Protoss player myself i acually love all the changes. as far as I know everything makes sense. Hope these changes will come to the next patch
Cabinet Sanchez
Profile Joined February 2011
Australia1097 Posts
April 26 2011 06:57 GMT
#909
On April 26 2011 15:55 Azarkon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2011 15:51 syllogism wrote:
On April 26 2011 14:25 [Atomic]Peace wrote:
I'm going to go with Tyler on the Warpgate change:

I'm tired of casual play negatively affecting pro play (4gate being addressed in next patch). Rule changes should happen only when necessary


https://twitter.com/#!/TylerWasieleski/status/61786904529616896

He nails it. The change simply isn't necessary and is only being made to cater to casual play. Is it difficult to hold off a 4 warp gate? It can be. Is the build usually powerful for how easy it is to execute? Sure. But with proper training you can hold off 4 warp gate 100% of the time. By definition it is not imbalanced.

There seem to be pro players who like these changes (LaLush for one) and I'm not quite sure what he means by "negatively". I imagine he dislikes how the change affects other matchups? Regardless, I'm sure players will keep opening doors.


Tyler doesn't like the fact that Blizzard is changing stuff at such a rapid pace in response to casual player whining (supposedly). This is a reasonable point of view whether you like the changes or not. Tyler also probably has builds prepared that would no longer work with the new patch, meaning that he'll have to start anew.


The game is still new and Blizzard know what they are doing.
Pros need to learn to adapt, forget casual play - I barely play the game but I can totally see how what they've implimented is good for the stuff I WATCH, not what I play.

Ideally in a well balanced game, Zerg, Terran and Protoss should have a variety of options against each opponent, not 1 or 2 builds at most to save their ass, seeing all units well balanced across the board makes for more dynamic and exciting gameplay.

This archon change for example, means we might finally see archons used more often in TvT matches, how is that in any way a bad thing?
windsupernova
Profile Joined October 2010
Mexico5280 Posts
April 26 2011 06:57 GMT
#910
On April 26 2011 15:54 ParasitJonte wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2011 15:51 syllogism wrote:
On April 26 2011 14:25 [Atomic]Peace wrote:
I'm going to go with Tyler on the Warpgate change:

I'm tired of casual play negatively affecting pro play (4gate being addressed in next patch). Rule changes should happen only when necessary


https://twitter.com/#!/TylerWasieleski/status/61786904529616896

He nails it. The change simply isn't necessary and is only being made to cater to casual play. Is it difficult to hold off a 4 warp gate? It can be. Is the build usually powerful for how easy it is to execute? Sure. But with proper training you can hold off 4 warp gate 100% of the time. By definition it is not imbalanced.

There seem to be pro players who like these changes (LaLush for one) and I'm not quite sure what he means by "negatively". Perhaps he dislikes how the change affects other matchups? Regardless, I'm sure players will keep opening doors.


To me it's about making the game better. The game will be better if PvP isn't all about 4 gate. Tyler doesn't seem to give this a thought.


Ehhh, I actually don't agree. Blizzard should only step in to fix broken things, Its not up to them to make a matchup more playable or watchable. And really, with 9 matchups only 1 was retarded so I don't think it was that bad.

PvP was interesting to me at least, not all matches need to go into super late macro mode to be good.
"Its easy, just trust your CPU".-Boxer on being good at games
Brief.Starcraft
Profile Joined January 2011
United States35 Posts
April 26 2011 06:58 GMT
#911
I don't care much for the 4 gate changes. We don't need those.
Baarn
Profile Joined April 2010
United States2702 Posts
April 26 2011 07:00 GMT
#912
Decrease in radius of pylon will be fun. Can hide pylons better against opponent.
There's no S in KT. :P
Ulfsark
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States958 Posts
April 26 2011 07:00 GMT
#913
I feel the zealot build time is fine early game though stalker and sentry should be reduced with these changes.
gg wp
XsebT
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Denmark2980 Posts
April 26 2011 07:00 GMT
#914
Shit, these threads get spammed up so fast. So here's another one!

These changes looks very promising imo, though I feel like most of these were already discussed during beta. Blizzard being a bit slow is no surprise though.

Pylon range change... well more like BW = I like it.
화이팅
SONE
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada839 Posts
April 26 2011 07:00 GMT
#915
On April 26 2011 15:57 windsupernova wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2011 15:54 ParasitJonte wrote:
On April 26 2011 15:51 syllogism wrote:
On April 26 2011 14:25 [Atomic]Peace wrote:
I'm going to go with Tyler on the Warpgate change:

I'm tired of casual play negatively affecting pro play (4gate being addressed in next patch). Rule changes should happen only when necessary


https://twitter.com/#!/TylerWasieleski/status/61786904529616896

He nails it. The change simply isn't necessary and is only being made to cater to casual play. Is it difficult to hold off a 4 warp gate? It can be. Is the build usually powerful for how easy it is to execute? Sure. But with proper training you can hold off 4 warp gate 100% of the time. By definition it is not imbalanced.

There seem to be pro players who like these changes (LaLush for one) and I'm not quite sure what he means by "negatively". Perhaps he dislikes how the change affects other matchups? Regardless, I'm sure players will keep opening doors.


To me it's about making the game better. The game will be better if PvP isn't all about 4 gate. Tyler doesn't seem to give this a thought.


Ehhh, I actually don't agree. Blizzard should only step in to fix broken things, Its not up to them to make a matchup more playable or watchable. And really, with 9 matchups only 1 was retarded so I don't think it was that bad.

PvP was interesting to me at least, not all matches need to go into super late macro mode to be good.

Thank goodness im not the only one that thinks super late macro games arent always good as a spectator. Need variety.
Oxymoron
Profile Joined August 2009
Canada137 Posts
April 26 2011 07:01 GMT
#916
Pylon change was unnecessary. I'm actually surprised that they did that instead of nerfing forcefields.

Other that that, definitely one of the better patches from blizzard. Loving the new ghost change, perhaps we'll see some ghost openings now.
Mitchlew
Profile Joined September 2010
Australia428 Posts
April 26 2011 07:02 GMT
#917
My friend is saying this.
"Nah, it won't work in 2 players map, Protoss will just build pylons inside Terran's base. Use workers to kill off the pylon? Nope, Tasteless said it just doesn't worth it as Protoss can just build another pylon, while Terran will lose plenty of mining time."

This is regarding a proxy 2 gate even if it is scouted by terran. Surely it isn't as hard to defend than what he is making out.
NeonPeon
Profile Joined February 2011
93 Posts
April 26 2011 07:02 GMT
#918
On April 26 2011 15:57 windsupernova wrote:
Ehhh, I actually don't agree. Blizzard should only step in to fix broken things, Its not up to them to make a matchup more playable or watchable. And really, with 9 matchups only 1 was retarded so I don't think it was that bad.

PvP was interesting to me at least, not all matches need to go into super late macro mode to be good.


If a single path defines a matchup to the extent that it's virtually obligatory, the game IS broken.

It can't be a strategy game if there aren't various viable strategies.
Azarkon
Profile Joined January 2010
United States21060 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-26 07:04:35
April 26 2011 07:02 GMT
#919
On April 26 2011 15:53 Gegenschein wrote:
Please don't decrease Zealot build time to 33... Decrease it to 37, like for Stalkers and Sentries.
Protoss already has enough ways to cheese as it is.


I've changed my mind about my earlier opinion regarding Blizzard forgetting why they nerfed zealot build time in the first place. In actuality, they probably know quite well that they're bringing back 2 gate. In fact, they *want* to bring back 2 gate.

A lot of people think that Blizzard loves macro games, but I don't really think so. Dustin Browder has stated that the design team wants games to be "action-packed" from the very beginning. This means that they don't want players sitting on their safe ass builds until it's 3 base vs. 3 base.

2 gate is the ultimate form of early Protoss pressure. By bringing it back Blizzard is saying that they're going to compensate Protoss, who now has significantly delayed 4 gates, another way to keep other races "honest" with early pressure. On smaller maps, say goodbye to your Terran 1 rax expands and Zerg 15 hatches. You're not going to be lifting that CC or putting down that hatch until you're sure the 2 gate pressure is over or not coming.
GhostLink
Profile Joined January 2011
United States450 Posts
April 26 2011 07:03 GMT
#920
say goodbye to 4gates
Let a man play chess, and tell him that every pawn is his friend. Let him think both bishops holy. Let him remember happy days in the shadows of his castles. Let him love his queen. Watch him lose them all.
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