I agree, Colossus are just freaking boring.

Actually there are very few units in SC2 that can cause any kind of hype, the rest is just plain bland. In the long term a lot of people are going to get bored of it and just stop watching games.

I'm already getting bored of watching GSL.

Doomblaze

United States1292 Posts

March 15 2011 02:16 GMT

#123

Ahahaha wombo combo
i was there when jeff and mitchell did that, best moment of my life. Without waffles, it wouldnt have been nearly as hype though.

Collosi are boring, its been discussed to death already. They dont have any flashy surprise factor, and you can micro them fancily if the opponent doesnt have viking/corruptor, but thats the extent of it. Theyre slow, bulky deathball units.

bkrow

Australia8532 Posts

March 15 2011 02:19 GMT

#124

Awww but i LOVE hype.. Yeah they are boring but you can't really blame current protosses for using them; they are just so damn good.. I don't think anti-hype is Collossus specific - in terms of specific units, there is very little hype quality .. It usually comes down to inventive strategy and matchups rather than specific unit potential

Sickafant

Canada19 Posts

March 15 2011 02:20 GMT

#125

They should make the Colossus fall such a heavy and gruesome death that it deals splash damage where it dies.Then the protoss will have to micro his Gateway units away from the falling Colossus. Also, Suicide Colossus!

sickle

New Zealand656 Posts

March 15 2011 02:26 GMT

#126

They should just remove the collosus. Pvp would become much more fun (thats if, u can hold off the initial 4-gate)

fxSolo

United States42 Posts

March 15 2011 02:29 GMT

#127

I feel like we still need to give more time to allow the game to develop certain crowd-pleasing play. If you continue watching that Day9 daily you posted where the MM ball dies to 1 baneling, Mondragon uses some interesting mid to late game infestor play, going roach/infestor with neural parasite play against the Thors. Day9 said he believed that strategies like that will become more common as the game develops. That's not to say its the equivalent of a reaver drop, but I think it shows that there are a lot of lesser used strategies and underused abilities that might see more usage in the future as players become better or as the metagame shifts.

dudeman001

United States2412 Posts

March 15 2011 02:35 GMT

#128

I'd extend the anti-hype argument to voidrays and dark templar as well. The balance with these units feel okay, but the design of the Protoss race feels overall skewed. I'd call colossi, voidrays and dark templar kill units, in the sense that if you're not prepared for that one unit then the game can instantly be over. If you don't produce enough vikings or corruptors (or on the opposite end, over commit) then the game is almost always instantly over. Protoss having at least one of these feels okay, they had dark templar in the BW days, and Terran has banshees, a very unforgiving unit. But 3 separate units that are capable of simply winning a game against an unprepared opponent feels somewhat ill-designed. The reason I bring up voidrays and dts is because to a spectator, when seeing a Protoss rush for these they can already see the outcome. There's no uncertainty on if the strategy will work, it either obviously will or obviously wont.

But the OP is right, outside of an emergency colossus spawning when being broken by some all-in to save the day, colossi are very boring because you already know what'll happen. Protoss will mass colossi, get sentries to make their colossi even more effective, get phoenix to make their colossi survive longer. Does this hurt the balance of the game? Not necessarily, but I'd say it hurts the excitement of watching.

The only counterargument I'd make is TvP in BW. It was pretty well established that Terran would sit back and make a 200/200 mech army, then go kill the Protoss. And aside from vulture harass, it was entirely up to the Protoss to make the match more exciting with recalls or a carrier switch. So eh, maybe it's okay that colossi are anti-hype.

S.O.L.I.D.

United States792 Posts

March 15 2011 02:36 GMT

#129

On March 15 2011 10:55 gamefan15 wrote:

Show nested quote +

it has nothing to do with anything if you dont care about the whole esport part of the game and if its exciting to watch, which highly determines how successfull and durable a game will be as an esport title.

also unit excitement and micro tension can determine how much fun ppl can get out of the battles as a player.. plus can give you long time motivation because you have some more room to improve.

so aslong as you are not only interested in playing a pure macro and decision making rts games without spectators, such subjects remain worthy of discussion.

I suppose that's true. But I feel like it's difficult to make every unit exciting, and excitement should take a back seat to balance like I said. I feel like one unit being boring or exciting isn't going to make or break SC2 as an eSport, but I see that you guys mean by saying it can help.

Apolo

Portugal1259 Posts

March 15 2011 02:38 GMT

#130

Funny, there's a similar thread like this on another popular rts forum about how taking out KA is overkill, and how too much colossus is boring to watch and see. Really seems like it's general opinion. Rarely do i see someone that preferres watching colossus over storms, or that would want to see more colossus play. Probably blizzard should pay attention to this, if it's so general of a feeling.

Sensator

Australia377 Posts

March 15 2011 02:40 GMT

#131

If reaver replaced Colossus I'd totally switch to Toss.

Seiuchi

United States931 Posts

March 15 2011 02:43 GMT

#132

On March 15 2011 11:36 S.O.L.I.D. wrote:

Show nested quote +

The problem is that even though it's just one unit, every Protoss matchup is pretty much dominated by it and Blizzard is pushing balance changes that will make Protoss even more Colossus based; so it looks like more Colossus ball yawn fests are incoming after we've felt the excitement of Gateway/Templar based play.

Foreplay

United States1154 Posts

March 15 2011 02:45 GMT

#133

Yeah we have all thought this since beta. Sadly the colossus is here to stay.

0neder

United States3733 Posts

March 15 2011 02:48 GMT

#134

Awesome post. I really hope Blizzard reads this and does something with it. I agree, colossus need to be more powerful with more glaring weaknesses. That, or replace them.

chongu

Malaysia2593 Posts

March 15 2011 02:51 GMT

#135

along with everything terran and zerg has... I miss my BW units : (

bkrow

Australia8532 Posts

March 15 2011 02:54 GMT

#136

On March 15 2011 11:51 chongu wrote:
along with everything terran and zerg has... I miss my BW units : (

I know this pretty good game that has all those BW units you miss.. it's quite old now but a lot of people still play it in Korea?

AndAgain

United States2621 Posts

March 15 2011 03:00 GMT

#137

I remember in beta, colossi drops were used pretty often (WhiteRa vs TLO comes to mind.) Anyone know what happened to that? I assume it got nerfed or something.

Eleaven

772 Posts

March 15 2011 03:04 GMT

#138

I'm going to miss watching games with HT..

Those San Vs (forgotten name) games in gsl were pretty full on.

Dox

Australia1199 Posts

March 15 2011 03:10 GMT

#139

Doubling the Colossi damage and halving the attack speed, whilst having no impact on their actual DPS, would be a tremendously overpowered buff when you consider that the very first attack will almost kill an entire army. It doesn't matter how slow your attack is if there's nothing left standing after the first shot.