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Imbalanced - Show - Page 8
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Toxiferous
United States388 Posts
keep it up | ||
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FliedLice
Germany7494 Posts
ty artosis <3 | ||
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Mindflow
Korea (South)320 Posts
On February 10 2011 13:21 Finrod1 wrote: First of all, big credits for Artosis and Idra really lerning and thinking within your discussion. Really described my feelings in this matchup too. If you just compare the protoss t1 and terrant1 units with all their possible upgrades at t1 it's...hell yeah i have halluzination! Because of pvz you can't buff protoss t1 so just freakin nerv terran t1. I always thought in a logical sense that it's kinda stupid that marines/marauders can't die of stim. Why is that? Or just make them unable to stim if they're on 1hp! Maybe it would be better to nerf stim/grenades with more time/cost/whatever and see what happens in the game because of that. Like Idra and Artosis pointed out the gas managment ist so damn hard for protoss compared to the stim a-move. You also forgot that there analyzing the match-up on a "PRO" level, of course you guys arnt but as they said the builds can be either Easily executed by the terran and toss very hard to defend but on the pro level certain amounts of certain things can counter certain things on both sides of the matchup. | ||
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PepperoniPiZZa
Sierra Leone1660 Posts
Nevertheless, I've enjoyed the episode, thank you. | ||
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TrickyGilligan
United States641 Posts
You guys went off script and actually had a very interesting discussion about the issue. I was amazed you were able to talk about it for so long, and still not cover everything, there was really depth and spontaneous insights that were missing in the first episode. Even though you sided against P again (bastards), I was totally fine with it, because it was backed up with some interesting and well thought out debate. Also, your conclusion was exactly what my ladder experience has been. I was placed into Bronze at release, and just could not deal with Marine Marauder for the life of me. I concluded that Terran was overpowered, and proceeded to tell everyone so. I'm now in Masters, and PvT is my best matchup. MMM is something I've run into so many times that I know exactly how to respond to it, and am rarely losing to it early on. | ||
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Wartortle
Australia504 Posts
I also 100% agree. I think saying any sort of 1 base terran aggression against protoss is even strong is wrong, not to mention overpowered. FF + immortals (depending on tech choice) make it so easy for protoss to turtle early game into the colossi/ht/vr death ball. Not to mention that 1 base protoss is extremely strong, especially when they are making pushes as seen in Seeds games in the GSTL, a terran couldn't ever hope to produce such a potent push off 1 base. I find it extremely saddening that two such prominent figures in e-sports are even giving opinions on balance when neither play 2 of the 3 races. I know we are not supposed to say that it would be fairer to have 1 of each race discussing the issues because its "impractical", but at least someone who plays random/p/t at a high level could provide some insight. I dont mean to flame Artosis, who is one of my favorite casters, but in a pre-patch video, he didn't even know what flux veins was. How can someone that doesn't have an intimate knowledge of the classes they're talking about comment on imbalance. The worst part is, i fear blizzard will take this sort of commentary into account when balancing the game. I for one, hope they do not. | ||
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sh02hp0869
Sweden460 Posts
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Sek-Kuar
Czech Republic593 Posts
EDIT: Actually your parrot/cat is louder than greg  | ||
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ThunderJim
Norway23 Posts
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schimmetje
Netherlands1104 Posts
Sigh, some of these responses.. get over the name already. If anything they discuss where imbalance claims come from and the rights and wrongs of that. And yeah they could probably, as was said after the first episode as well, benefit from other viewpoints and I'm sure it's been noted. But the feedback thing can help there as well, please keep that in guys. But maybe I just have an unhealthy obsession with hearing people talk Starcraft. Please keep that fed too! Haha defilers <3 | ||
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x2mirko
Germany245 Posts
Why don't you guys make a podcast out of this? I don't think that audio-only would take anything away from the discussion (unless you intend to analyze replays later in the show or something). It would be cool to be able to get this on a mp3-player and listen to it on the go. | ||
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iChau
United States1210 Posts
On February 10 2011 12:19 anotherone wrote: Each time i hear how Protoss is poor i get ill. If you say that Protoss have hard time vs Terran in early game then what you will say about Terran life vs Protoss in late game? Super Hardocre Survival? (SHS). Force Fields are doing amazingly well vs early bio pushes and allows to win early minor battles just with gate units. Just throw MM ball without stim, shield and grenades on Protoss zeal/stalker/sentry ball and see what will happen. Terran need those upgrades to do anything early and Protoss dont need any upgrades beside warp tech for early game. How much does concussive cost? How much does stim cost? How much does shield cost? How much does a twilight cost? How much does charge cost? How much does blink cost? How much does robotic's bay + range cost? How much does storm + amulet cost? | ||
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Wartortle
Australia504 Posts
On February 10 2011 22:11 x2mirko wrote: I haven't watched this part yet (just part one up till now) but i have a suggestion anyhow: Why don't you guys make a podcast out of this? I don't think that audio-only would take anything away from the discussion (unless you intend to analyze replays later in the show or something). It would be cool to be able to get this on a mp3-player and listen to it on the go. a video post cast i can put on iphone would be nice  (like day9s dailies) | ||
HwangjaeTerran
Finland5967 Posts
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Jampackedeon
United States2053 Posts
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Roggay
Switzerland6320 Posts
Love your work Artosis and IdrA, keep this up. | ||
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eu.xen
Germany352 Posts
![[image loading]](http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/7066/artosisidrahighfivefail.gif) | ||
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Mercury-
Great Britain804 Posts
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JDeathmetal
Netherlands81 Posts
EPIC, I thought the same thing about that part. Kinda embaressing! And you made the best gif ever of it ! Still laughing :DAbout the conclusion, I think they are a bit to soft in the conclusion parts maybe be a bit more outspoken. Ofc bio can be dealt with, but you have to scout very well place near to perfect FF's etc etc. There are just so many openings for terran that have extremem pressure that sometimes its hard to geuss whats really hapening once they placed that bunker (which they can salvage anyway) and you can't scout past it. But ye obs are pretty mandatory against terran anyway but sending it to his base my cost you alot if they do hit with cloack banshees --> 2 obs = 150 gas Its all about gas gas gas in PvT | ||
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rd
United States2586 Posts
early bio pressure isn't as strong as they make it out to be, esp. on maps like xel'naga or maps with ramps, toss forcefield destroy these bio pushes. 1gate FE can solidly hold off most bio pushes, and definitely holds off 2rax FE. I use 2rax FE often, and my goal is just to trade down armies here. That's really situational though: If its a 1 gate FE then you're going to be attacking his FE if he's hiding at his ramp. Bio pressure against an FE'ing protoss really comes down to micro though, regardless. A protoss with adequate micro can hold it fine. A terran can snipe the stalkers or sentries, and suddenly hes up the ramp destroying pylons powering the cybercore and forcing probes to pull; It's an extremely volatile period for the protoss, though it's not crossing imbalance. A protoss has to really know his timings to balance teching and defense though, at least when it's not top level play. I find it extremely saddening that two such prominent figures in e-sports are even giving opinions on balance when neither play 2 of the 3 races. You can be an observer of e-sports and still know more than most players give them credit for. I'm semi-blowing this out of my ass, but that's like criticizing blizzard for balancing sc2 when none of their designers play every match-up competitively. (...or do they?) They watch and draw the same conclusions Artosis and Idra do. | ||
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