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On November 28 2010 00:47 garbanzo wrote:
I think it should be kept in there. I don't know how hard it is to do in SC2, but anyone who has watched (or played) enough BW knows that it is not that easy to pull off.
so basically you said "i have no idea what the fuck im talking about but in bw this went unfixed so it should stay", srsly, gtfo
its not hard to pull off, it doesnt require any additional micro, you just have to pick the right spot for your probe to be in
im simply amazed how many ppl think this should stay in the game for the sole reason that it was possible in BW
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They should definately remove this bug, it adds nothing good to the game, and it removes the choice on which side to leave the probe.
Imo it's just unfair.
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they should fix it, of course. As long as only one race can abuse a bug, while the other races can not the bug needs to be fixed! I mean come on peolpe, why should protoss be able to slide through walls, when drones cant? Isnt it the purpose of a wall, not to let units through?
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On November 28 2010 01:16 Alpina wrote:
They should definately remove this bug, it adds nothing good to the game, and it removes the choice on which side to leave the probe.
Imo it's just unfair.
They should definitely not remove this bug, it adds additional possibilities to the game, and it removes nothing good.
Imo it's just fair.
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I want more of these things, they add more fun for the people watching the game.
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Working as intended, imo.
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if probes can hop pylons I want better ling surround...
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The question is: Does it increase the available amount of interesting options for both players? If the answer is "It gives the attacking player an extra option for early-game wall-ins without giving the defending player any recourse", then no, it doesn't. Remove it.
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Gsl spoiler + Show Spoiler +idras opponent did it to him and saw that idra was going roaches, but still wasn't able to stop him. I think it's a very important scouting mechanical as far as the pylon/cannon rush goes. Zerg can have overlords over toss' base, why can't toss sneak a probe into zerg's? :D
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On November 27 2010 23:47 gongryong wrote:
Indeed. i dont understand why blizzard gives the probe that AI in the first place. Why does it have to move after warping something? When it is snugged on a corner, perhaps yes (in fact it's used in many a great ways, especially in ums games xd). but on an open field??? Probes have one of the worst AI in SC.
On November 27 2010 23:48 Danze wrote:
I think they should fix it and similar bugs. I'm all for using and abusing game mechanics to the best of your ability, but when it comes to things that aren't working as intended; it just comes down to ethics.
We've all seen vids of probes being able to pass through 100% building wall offs and abusing similar bugs. If a player goes to the effort of walling off to deny scouting (insert similar example here) and you're able to sneak a probe in abusing a design error, it's not really ethical is it? What should the walling player do, find a way to stack buildings?
Do players have to resort to exploiting bugs themselves to combat being exploited against? Of course not, it's silly. I know this might just be my illusion of grandeur. I know it sounds crazy but here it goes:
Let's try to play fair eh?
On November 28 2010 00:39 Elwar wrote:
Given its only use is to facilitate cheese, absolutely they should remove it. Oh you can wall someone in then abuse a bug in the game engine to get through yourself, thats logical... Even if it had a greater purpose, glitching probes through wall-offs is just not something that should ever factor into any strategic play.
Just because something was in BW and/or is a bug that has potential to do something Blizzard didn't intend doesn't mean it should automatically be left alone.
let me take a wild guess, all of u drones/scv/probes posters that cry "FIX BUG THIS IS AN EXPLOIT QQQQQQQQ"
never watched a single game in the map outsider in SC1 before? fact is that alot of bugs that probably wasn't intended by blizzard stuck in BW like hold position lurker, air units bugging out turrets, workers can glitch through minerals patches, and yet all those bugs were actually utilised by players and produce whacky strategies and games which are freaking awesome. actually made the game AWESOME!
these may not look pretty or some times doesn't look like how its suppose to work, bu these stuff adds a deeper level of depth to the game, and before u cry about exploits and unfair, similiar bugs were present in old starcraft and it did not broke the game at all, infact it improved it.
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On November 28 2010 07:26 Shizuru~ wrote:
fact is that alot of bugs that probably wasn't intended by blizzard stuck in BW like hold position lurker, air units bugging out turrets, workers can glitch through minerals patches, and yet all those bugs were actually utilised by players and produce whacky strategies and games which are freaking awesome. actually made the game AWESOME!
'I think it's awesome' isn't an argument against how illogical it is that 2 pylons block one player from getting probes out but let the other player get probes in.
I think 5 rax reaper and roaches with a range of 3 is awesome! Let me guess, you QQ'ingers didn't play beta?!
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its part of the game so keep it in. Only change it if it ruins the gameplay. Protoss don't exactly own everyone right now anyway.
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10387 Posts
You could do something similar to this in WC3, patching it out would be breaking tradition
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On November 28 2010 00:39 Elwar wrote:
Given its only use is to facilitate cheese, absolutely they should remove it. Oh you can wall someone in then abuse a bug in the game engine to get through yourself, thats logical... Even if it had a greater purpose, glitching probes through wall-offs is just not something that should ever factor into any strategic play.
Just because something was in BW and/or is a bug that has potential to do something Blizzard didn't intend doesn't mean it should automatically be left alone.
you clearly just started playing this game and have absolutly no idea how it could make game interesting in BW
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im simply amazed how many ppl think this should stay in the game for the sole reason that it was possible in BW
seriously.
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On November 27 2010 23:39 LittleeD wrote:
Part of the game.
End of story
On November 27 2010 23:43 Mutaahh wrote:
it aint a bug, its how the engine works.
stop calling it a bug
This argument makes absolutely no sense. Based on your logic, nothing is a bug.
Almost all strategy games try to model some kind of 'real' battle, so they try to model the laws of physics (in a sci-fi sense), etc, so we don't end up with some weird game with completely arbitrary and counterintuitive rules.
A probe jumping over obstacles does not make sense at all and is obviously a bug in the sense that is a probably unintended 'feature' that is caused by sloppy handling of a probe's position after it builds something. It does not correspond to anything real (in the starcraft universe). So from this point of view, this is definitely a bug and should be fixed.
You could argue that they shouldn't fix it because it makes the game more interesting, and that is entirely a matter of opinion, but I think the future of starcraft is pretty bleak if you feel that it needs bugs to make games interesting. Let's hope that Blizz and the players can make sc2 matches interesting enough without weird gimmicks, because this probe jump is nothing more than that.
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On November 27 2010 23:48 Danze wrote:
I think they should fix it and similar bugs. I'm all for using and abusing game mechanics to the best of your ability, but when it comes to things that aren't working as intended; it just comes down to ethics.
We've all seen vids of probes being able to pass through 100% building wall offs and abusing similar bugs. If a player goes to the effort of walling off to deny scouting (insert similar example here) and you're able to sneak a probe in abusing a design error, it's not really ethical is it? What should the walling player do, find a way to stack buildings?
Do players have to resort to exploiting bugs themselves to combat being exploited against? Of course not, it's silly. I know this might just be my illusion of grandeur. I know it sounds crazy but here it goes:
Let's try to play fair eh?
It's not a bug, it's not a design error, it's not a question of ethics. Suck it up, it's completely fine. Just because some people aren't exactly great at scouting/holding off a Cannon rush doesn't mean we need to bitch and moan about it. If we keep dumbing down SC2 like this pretty soon we'll have nothing interesting left.
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Should it be removed? Yes. It's a bug. No argument can deny this. It doesn't matter if it was in BW or War3, it's a bug. It should not be there.
Do I care if it gets removed? No.
That's the thing. A lot of things in this world SHOULD be fixed, but won't be because nobody cares, and this is an example.
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On November 28 2010 07:45 MDew wrote:
Should it be removed? Yes. It's a bug. No argument can deny this. It doesn't matter if it was in BW or War3, it's a bug. It should not be there.
Do I care if it gets removed? No.
That's the thing. A lot of things in this world SHOULD be fixed, but won't be because nobody cares, and this is an example.
That's a terrible argument. Just because it's a bug doesn't mean you should remove it. Remove any of the bugs in BW and that game's balance is completely thrown out the window. There are strategies that revolve around the exploitation of bugs because they have become an integral part of play.
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EPT
