• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 13:51
CET 19:51
KST 03:51
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book8Clem wins HomeStory Cup 289HomeStory Cup 28 - Info & Preview13Rongyi Cup S3 - Preview & Info5herO wins SC2 All-Star Invitational14
Community News
PIG STY FESTIVAL 7.0! (19 Feb - 1 Mar)8Weekly Cups (Jan 26-Feb 1): herO, Clem, ByuN, Classic win2RSL Season 4 announced for March-April7Weekly Cups (Jan 19-25): Bunny, Trigger, MaxPax win3Weekly Cups (Jan 12-18): herO, MaxPax, Solar win0
StarCraft 2
General
Rongyi Cup S3 - Preview & Info Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book Clem wins HomeStory Cup 28 How do you think the 5.0.15 balance patch (Oct 2025) for StarCraft II has affected the game? HomeStory Cup 28 - Info & Preview
Tourneys
PIG STY FESTIVAL 7.0! (19 Feb - 1 Mar) WardiTV Mondays $21,000 Rongyi Cup Season 3 announced (Jan 22-Feb 7) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament $5,000 WardiTV Winter Championship 2026
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ? [A] Starcraft Sound Mod
External Content
Mutation # 512 Overclocked The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 511 Temple of Rebirth Mutation # 510 Safety Violation
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Can someone share very abbreviated BW cliffnotes? StarCraft player reflex TE scores BW General Discussion Recent recommended BW games
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 1 Small VOD Thread 2.0 KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Strategy
Zealot bombing is no longer popular? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Current Meta Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2
Other Games
General Games
Diablo 2 thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread EVE Corporation Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread The Games Industry And ATVI Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club! The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Play, Watch, Drink: Esports …
TrAiDoS
My 2025 Magic: The Gathering…
DARKING
Life Update and thoughts.
FuDDx
How do archons sleep?
8882
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2175 users

Sc2 Multiplayer Panel - Page 3

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 All
hiyo_bye
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States737 Posts
October 25 2010 06:46 GMT
#41
On October 24 2010 10:44 Wargizmo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 24 2010 09:10 Happy Frog wrote:

Here's their formula for their race match ups adjusted for skill:

[image loading]


And here's the formula they use to balance the game afterwards

[image loading]


this was pretty clever.


I think people need to stop complaining about balance so much. blizzard cares for us!
Random
Adaptation
Profile Joined August 2004
Canada427 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-10-25 09:36:10
October 25 2010 09:35 GMT
#42
I would just like to state that i tried the reaper/ling strat in 2v2 and 4v4's, and it utterly dominates. We went undefeated for a while, and it was clear that something was wrong.

Do not come from the bw point of view where only 1v1 exist. 2v2+ is HUGE and that patch strongly helped.(to stop us from cheesing!)
So i did a 9 pool on an island map, so what?
quasit
Profile Joined July 2010
Sweden49 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-10-25 10:59:30
October 25 2010 10:57 GMT
#43
On October 25 2010 18:35 Adaptation wrote:
I would just like to state that i tried the reaper/ling strat in 2v2 and 4v4's, and it utterly dominates. We went undefeated for a while, and it was clear that something was wrong.

Do not come from the bw point of view where only 1v1 exist. 2v2+ is HUGE and that patch strongly helped.(to stop us from cheesing!)


Should've nerfed zergling too then.
Perscienter
Profile Joined June 2010
957 Posts
October 25 2010 13:02 GMT
#44
On October 24 2010 09:10 Happy Frog wrote:
Q: Boxer might have done better if he had spawned cross locations, do you take spawn locations in maps into account in balance stats.

A: Map balance is a big issue, don't think we take spawn location into account but it's a good point, we watch to see if race match ups become lopsided on specific maps, that's why we yanked DO / Kulas.

Location based stats might be drilling too deep but if we think there might be an issue we can access those stats

So they balance the game around the mainstream map pool and sort out the maps which deviate from the map pool too much. Not exactly what I'd like to see. Especially DO allowed for interesting macro strategies. Keep the map pool diversified, Blizzard!
Noxie
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2227 Posts
October 25 2010 13:32 GMT
#45
Was def fun to read! We seem to have a ton of stuff in store for us. I wish they would have said more about maps as I think that is a bigger topic then what was addressed.
Eluadyl
Profile Joined May 2010
Turkey364 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-10-25 14:56:05
October 25 2010 14:54 GMT
#46
Good read, thanks OP

However this also reminded me of knowing what you are doing and actually doing it right are two very different things. Go talk to any good scientist or engineer (aka professional nerd) and you'll see they all sound very competent and convincing. They'll still screw up pretty badly and often too

Good thing people starting to realize it's a hard job that these guys have.
Not enough energy
Nienordir
Profile Joined October 2010
98 Posts
October 25 2010 15:11 GMT
#47
On October 24 2010 09:10 Happy Frog wrote:
Q: (Kind of incoherent, I think the main theme is) "Are Zerg designed to need to out macro T and P?

A: Yes, specifically not supposed to be strong at pushing at Tier 2, need to macro up and get to tier 3

That seems like such a weird design choice. Z T1 feels so vulnerable&limited and then you tech to T2 just to get mobile AA/detection and a bit of map control, only to find out that the devs made T2 intentional 'weak' to force you into T3, where the fast switching of unit compositions suddenly becomes overpowered.

I don't know it just seems odd, that T&P have so many early options for harass, timing attacks and fast tech protected by wall-in, while denying all scouting (with proper play/building placement) except for overlord sacrifice. While Z has to survive, survive into roflstomp. That just isn't 'balance' all races should have a more or less equal chance throughout the game, it seems even more unfair towards Z, because larva management is already such a difficult mechanic.

Not to mention that 200/200 feels weak compared to T&P, basically you have to pile up larva/resources to get 2/3 waves with tech switching, because your army melts. A 200/200 T/P seems a lot more scary even if they don't get the time to macro up for more waves.


I don't mind macro focus and throwing a flood of bugs at the enemy (that feels very zergy), but when the devs say stuff like "yeah, well you have to survive until you reach T3 and then you're overpowered.." and think that's a decent answer..that's just wrong. A P can 4 Gate his way to the top, T has so many tools&fallbacks, while a Z is screwed until he figures out all the subtile mechanics of the game.

I don't want to complain about the state of the game, it's just that answer, which translates into "we don't care about early issues of zerg or that it requires more skill to get similar results. Our statistics are fine and you're intended to be weak until T3", which feels pretty rude.
e4e5nf3
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
Canada599 Posts
October 25 2010 15:19 GMT
#48
That's impressive how much work the balance team is doing. Most other companies don't put so much resources on balancing. I kind regret all my "Blizz doesn't know what the fck they're doing" now, lol.

With that said, I have a feeling a couple months from now people will forget the praises of the balance team and the "Blizz doesn't know what the fck they're doing" posts will come back....
King takes Queen
Perscienter
Profile Joined June 2010
957 Posts
October 26 2010 13:09 GMT
#49
They put a lot of effort into this, but that doesn't mean that they apply the proper policy.
Sanguinarius
Profile Joined January 2010
United States3427 Posts
November 06 2010 13:52 GMT
#50
I am glad they have someone who understands all the formulas used to estimate peoples skill. Cause thats all gibberish to me.

But I am really impressed by how much they actually understand about the game.
Your strength is just an accident arising from the weakness of others -Heart of Darkness
Prev 1 2 3 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Patches Events
18:45
Patch Clash Showdown #3
RotterdaM121
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ForJumy 294
mouzHeroMarine 163
RotterdaM 121
BRAT_OK 117
LamboSC2 55
EmSc Tv 24
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 18699
Calm 3343
Horang2 237
Hyun 123
Shuttle 36
sSak 35
Aegong 33
Rock 25
Shine 17
Dota 2
qojqva2194
Dendi586
Fuzer 332
Counter-Strike
fl0m5810
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox1267
Mew2King50
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor742
Liquid`Hasu455
MindelVK15
Other Games
Grubby3332
FrodaN3035
Liquid`RaSZi1452
Mlord824
B2W.Neo562
KnowMe167
ToD162
Hui .107
mouzStarbuck97
Organizations
Other Games
EGCTV2168
gamesdonequick1567
BasetradeTV94
StarCraft 2
EmSc Tv 24
EmSc2Tv 24
angryscii 20
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 19 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 168
• HeavenSC 45
• Adnapsc2 7
• Response 4
• Kozan
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• intothetv
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• Michael_bg 2
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV479
League of Legends
• Jankos3305
• imaqtpie1669
• Shiphtur371
Upcoming Events
OSC
5h 9m
Replay Cast
14h 9m
Wardi Open
17h 9m
Monday Night Weeklies
22h 9m
Replay Cast
1d 5h
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 15h
LiuLi Cup
1d 16h
Reynor vs Creator
Maru vs Lambo
PiGosaur Monday
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
LiuLi Cup
2 days
Clem vs Rogue
SHIN vs Cyan
[ Show More ]
The PondCast
3 days
KCM Race Survival
3 days
LiuLi Cup
3 days
Scarlett vs TriGGeR
ByuN vs herO
Replay Cast
4 days
Online Event
4 days
LiuLi Cup
4 days
Serral vs Zoun
Cure vs Classic
RSL Revival
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
LiuLi Cup
5 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
LiuLi Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
Rongyi Cup S3
Underdog Cup #3

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Nations Cup 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S1: W8
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
RSL Revival: Season 4
WardiTV Winter 2026
LiuLi Cup: 2025 Grand Finals
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
FISSURE Playground #3
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.